hello and Help!

[kberr]

Hi, my name is Kim and I am new here! I am also new to tortoises. I have wanted one forever and am finally going to make it happen! I have been taking a lot of time researching and making sure I do everything right before I go ahead. I still have quite a few questions, so hopefully someone out there is willing to be patient and generous with their knowledge! I plan on getting a baby Hermanns tortoise sometime soon. I live in Michigan, so will have to house this guy indoors much of the time. Although I have read a lot about tortoise tables, some of the reptile people around here tell me that as babies, their humidity requirement is higher, and in Michigan they would do better in an aquarium type setting for a year or 2. Is that right?
Unfortunely, even though I had planned to purchase my tortoise from a reptile specialist nearby, they will not give me advice unless I purchase my entire set up from them. I am a veterinarian and have access to a lot of supplies myself, so I dont want to spend hundreds of extra dollars if I don't have to!
Lighting...I plan to use an active UV heat light (T-rex or Zoo med). Can I also place a small flourescent at the other end of the enclosure so it's not dark?
Do I also need a heating pad? What about at night, my house gets pretty cool. Do I use a heat pad then or a night basking lamp?
Calcium supplement... with or without D3? Is cuttlebone ok to have available all the time? Do I need an additional herp supplement?
Can anyone recommend a place to get a baby Hermanns? Any good luck with online sources?
Thank you so much for your help!
kim

 

[Seiryu]

I live in Michigan, so will have to house this guy indoors much of the time. Although I have read a lot about tortoise tables, some of the reptile people around here tell me that as babies, their humidity requirement is higher, and in Michigan they would do better in an aquarium type setting for a year or 2. Is that right?

Tanks are really not the best option. I learned that first hand with my Leopard. Even if I blocked him from seeing out, he still constantly tried climbing the edges and flipping himself.

Go with a tort table, they work best.

What part of Michigan are you in? Where I am (detroit metro area) ambient humidity hasn't gone below 50% this summer yet.

What you want is to moisten the substrate, which will provide plenty of added humidity. Also a humid hide (you can put moss in there and keep it moist)

Lighting...I plan to use an active UV heat light (T-rex or Zoo med). Can I also place a small flourescent at the other end of the enclosure so it's not dark?

I just recently read up on the zoomed Powersun, and it's marginally better than the 10.0 tube lights. You want to go with either Mega-Ray or T-rex ACTIVE UV Heat. If it's the T-rex without the word Active in it, don't get it.

You can most certainly add another fixture for more lighting.

Do I also need a heating pad? What about at night, my house gets pretty cool. Do I use a heat pad then or a night basking lamp?

How cool is cool? I like mine to stay around 70-73 at night, but I think they would be fine as low as 65 degrees. You can buy a ceramic heat emitter for night time, or use a space heater for the room. I've never used a heat pad myself

Calcium supplement... with or without D3? Is cuttlebone ok to have available all the time? Do I need an additional herp supplement?

Cuttlebone is just fine to offer all the time. I would get a pure calcium supplement (calcium carbonate, try the "Now" brand). Sprinkle this on every meal. And then also the Rep-Cal/Herpitivite supplement. Use the Rep-cal/herp supplement once a week, not every day.

Bolded my responses, welcome to the forum! Make that FIVE for Michiganders!

 

[egyptiandan]

Welcome to the forum Kim

Danny

 

[Maggie Cummings]

Hi and welcome to the forum.
I see that Rob has given you some great advice already so I will just add a few things. I don't agree with using a heat pad, small tortoises need the heat from above like the sun, and I use a simple black light bulb at night for warmth. in a clamp fixture bought both at Kmart for about $13. Common thinking is that using a heat pad for babies or small growing tortoises causes a deformed plastron. I use calcium with D3 as it's really hard to OD them on the D3 and that helps with their metabolism. I sprinkle calcium on their food everyday.
I disagree with Rob on one thing, I have successfully raised many tortoises in aquariums without the problems he described. I believe they hold the heat and the humidty in better, and I just like them. I have several small tortoises in aquariums right now and none of them are fighting to get out. So, I am thinking it's all what the animal is used to. I don't mean any disrespect to Rob, I am simply relaying my experience.
I am glad you have joined us, it's always great to have a Veterinarian with us...lease keep asking your questions and we'll try to confuse you all we can

I believe we have several Herman breeders now, maybe Danny will tell you who they are...

 

[Stephanie Logan]

Good luck finding your Hermann's. They are supposed to have wonderful outgoing personalities and be hardy and relatively easy to care for.

I can't wait to see the photos when you get it!

Welcome to the forum...now that you've identified yourself as a veterinarian, you may get hit with a lot of "please advise" questions, so look out!

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Kim:

Welcome to the forum!!

 

[egyptiandan]

Have a look through are for sale section http://tortoiseforum.org/forum-26.html We have a few Hermanns breeders here, myself, hermannichris (Chris), TylerStewart (Tyler) and GBtortoises (Gary) to name a few.

Danny

 

[Jacqui]

Welcome! I have to agree with Maggie, I too have and do use aquariums. I like them.

 

[terryo]

Welcome Kim. I use aquariums also, for my cherry head, and all my indoor boxies. I love them because they hold humidity really well. Do your own research and find out what's best and easiest for you.

 

[Laura]

Do yo have any rescues near you? Animal Shelters> See if you can get one in need..
and welcome!

 

[Tom]

Hello and welcome. Many of your questions are matters of debate. Its not that anybody is necessarily right or wrong, sometimes its a matter of what works best for the individual or individual situation. We can each tell you our preferences and what has worked well for us.

Here's my opinions on your questions:
1. Like Maggie, I use aquariums too. Mainly BECAUSE they restrict airflow and hold in the heat and humidity. Its very dry where I live, so this is a concern for me. It also happens to be what I have on hand. Its common for babies to flip no matter what you house them in. If they constantly rub against the glass, trying to get out, you can tape up a visual barrier. Having said all of that, there is nothing wrong with a plastic tub either. They are cheaper, opaque, and you can get them in almost the same dimensions as some aquariums, so they will hold in heat and humidity the same. I usually have to cover half to two thirds of the tops of my enclosures no matter what I use.

2. Lighting. Rob is right on with this one too. TRex Active UV Heat is my bulb of choice for a tort that will be indoors a lot. The plain bulb on the other end is optional, but won't hurt anything. Just make sure all the lights are on a timer. 12-14 hours a day is good. Needs to be dark at night. I prefer to provide night heat with a Ceramic Heating Element. CHE. Like a light bulb, but all heat, no light. If your house stays above 70, you really don't need anything. For an adult 60 is fine at night as long as they can get warm during the day. Also get light fixtures made with ceramic fittings, around $10-12 at most hardware store. Don't use the cheaper plastic ones. I usually hang these by the cord from directly overhead and adjust the basking temp by raising or lowering them. I don't recommend clamping them to the side. Sooner or later this will cause a problem for you. Possibly a very big problem.

3. I'd get two calcium supplements. One with and one without D3. In summer, when your tort gets lots of sunshine use the one with no D3. During winter, when your tort is indoors all the time, use the one with D3. A tortoise vitamin supplement is not a bad idea. I use these once or twice a week. How often to supplement is a matter of debate and preference. I only use calcium once or twice a week. Some use it every day. We all have happy, healthy torts, so anything between never and everyday will probably work for you too.

4. I would not buy a hermanns from any one that I didn't either know personally, or know from this forum. That's why I don't have one right now. I've been talking to a breeder here about westerns. Possibly hatching in October/November. Most of the people on this forum know what they are doing (verses the rest of the world, which is hit or miss), so its a great resource. I like all of Danny's recommendations above. Good luck picking one. Ha Ha.


Good luck and please keep those questions coming.

 

[Angi]

Welcome Kim. I too am new to the tortoise world. I now think tortoises are the best pet a person can have. I am also addicted to this forum. It is a great place to learn. I hope you learned as much from your post as I did.

Tom~What kind of problem will a clamp fixture cause? I was thinking that would be the easiest way to attach lights to a tort table. I have not purchased them yet.

 

[Tom]

Tom~What kind of problem will a clamp fixture cause? I was thinking that would be the easiest way to attach lights to a tort table. I have not purchased them yet.

They always find a way to get knocked loose or fall off. The springs get old, the plastic on the side of the tub bends or cracks, your cat knocks it off, etc... Best case the thing falls, hits a rock and breaks your fifty dollar bulb and leaves glass shards in your enclosure. Worse case your whole house burns down. People on this forum have lost torts due to smoldering bulbs that fell into an enclosure and were still ON. I've personally charred the wood on more than one enclosure, but luckily never burned the house down. I've never had a problem with a bulb that was in a fixture hanging over an enclosure. These hot bulbs that are necessary for our torts health and survival can also be a huge safety hazard if we are not careful.

Another problem is that they aren't as effective if they are not directly over head pointing straight down. Still another problem is that if they are clamped to the side, how do you adjust them up or down to get the perfect basking temp?

Hope this helps and somebody else can learn from my stupid mistakes.

 

[kberr]

Wow, I did not expect so many responses so quickly! This forum is a great resource! Of course I have more questions, didn't want to bomabard everyone all at one time...
Can anyone give me substrate advice? I am thinking either pellets or coconut. Pros and cons?
Do you recommend supplementing their diet with tortoise pellets?
I am sure I will end up wanting more than one of these great little guys...I know you should not have 2 males, or really even 1 male with one female. Can they be sexed as babies? Can I put something other than a Hermanns in with a Hermanns in a year or 2 and will sex matter if they are different species?
I saw that someone on the forum is from tortoisesupply.com. I have been looking at that site for a few weeks now. I assume that this would be a reputable online source for a baby?
Tom, what kind of tortoises do you have?
thanks in advance!
Kim

Hello and welcome. Many of your questions are matters of debate. Its not that anybody is necessarily right or wrong, sometimes its a matter of what works best for the individual or individual situation. We can each tell you our preferences and what has worked well for us.

Here's my opinions on your questions:
1. Like Maggie, I use aquariums too. Mainly BECAUSE they restrict airflow and hold in the heat and humidity. Its very dry where I live, so this is a concern for me. It also happens to be what I have on hand. Its common for babies to flip no matter what you house them in. If they constantly rub against the glass, trying to get out, you can tape up a visual barrier. Having said all of that, there is nothing wrong with a plastic tub either. They are cheaper, opaque, and you can get them in almost the same dimensions as some aquariums, so they will hold in heat and humidity the same. I usually have to cover half to two thirds of the tops of my enclosures no matter what I use.

2. Lighting. Rob is right on with this one too. TRex Active UV Heat is my bulb of choice for a tort that will be indoors a lot. The plain bulb on the other end is optional, but won't hurt anything. Just make sure all the lights are on a timer. 12-14 hours a day is good. Needs to be dark at night. I prefer to provide night heat with a Ceramic Heating Element. CHE. Like a light bulb, but all heat, no light. If your house stays above 70, you really don't need anything. For an adult 60 is fine at night as long as they can get warm during the day. Also get light fixtures made with ceramic fittings, around $10-12 at most hardware store. Don't use the cheaper plastic ones. I usually hang these by the cord from directly overhead and adjust the basking temp by raising or lowering them. I don't recommend clamping them to the side. Sooner or later this will cause a problem for you. Possibly a very big problem.

3. I'd get two calcium supplements. One with and one without D3. In summer, when your tort gets lots of sunshine use the one with no D3. During winter, when your tort is indoors all the time, use the one with D3. A tortoise vitamin supplement is not a bad idea. I use these once or twice a week. How often to supplement is a matter of debate and preference. I only use calcium once or twice a week. Some use it every day. We all have happy, healthy torts, so anything between never and everyday will probably work for you too.

4. I would not buy a hermanns from any one that I didn't either know personally, or know from this forum. That's why I don't have one right now. I've been talking to a breeder here about westerns. Possibly hatching in October/November. Most of the people on this forum know what they are doing (verses the rest of the world, which is hit or miss), so its a great resource. I like all of Danny's recommendations above. Good luck picking one. Ha Ha.


Good luck and please keep those questions coming.

 

[kberr]

Sorry, I previously accidentally posted this above Tom's response to me, not sure if anyone would see it there so I reposted it here...
Wow, I did not expect so many responses so quickly! This forum is a great resource! Of course I have more questions, didn't want to bombard everyone all at one time...
Can anyone give me substrate advice? I am thinking either pellets or coconut. Pros and cons?
Do you recommend supplementing their diet with tortoise pellets?
I am sure I will end up wanting more than one of these great little guys...I know you should not have 2 males, or really even 1 male with one female. Can they be sexed as babies? Can I put something other than a Hermanns in with a Hermanns in a year or 2 and will sex matter if they are different species?
I saw that someone on the forum is from tortoisesupply.com. I have been looking at that site for a few weeks now. I assume that this would be a reputable online source for a baby?
Tom, what kind of tortoises do you have?
thanks in advance!
Kim