Help.

[Italianlnm]

I just got a new Sulcata. Well.. I rescued him. I already had one, and I went to the farm and someone had given them one. His mate died and he has not been eating or anything. They have been tube feeding him carrots. Baby food Carrots. I am not sure about this.. And they asked me to take him, to see if he will befriend my sulcata. I am not sure how this will work out. Will he try to harm my sulcata?

Also.. He isn't eating because I guess he is in mourning. I am not sure what to do. I am offering plenty of different types of the food I feed mine. He hasn't touched it. He will go and lay in it but not eat it.

He has also never really had any physical contact so everytime I go near him he drawls in. I am going to be hands on with him daily so he gets used to me and gains my trust. I estimate he is about 5 years old.

Can any of you give me any advice or anything about this situation? I am really worried about him passing away due to not eating, and I am worried he will be agressive with the one I already have. The one I have is probably about 1 or 2.

 

[Yvonne G]

You need to be concerned about the fact that his "mate" died, and now he seems quiet and not eating. He might have whatever killed the other tortoise. DON'T put him with your current tortoise until after a LONG quarantine period. You don't want to lose your little one too.

It would be good to take a stool sample from the new tortoise to the vet for a parasite check.

We feed "red" baby foods (carrots, squash, sweet potatoes) to baby tortoises that aren't eating well because it is high in Vit. A. But at 5 years of age, I don't think he needs the extra Vit. A. If you think he needs to be fed by tube method, then you can buy a foil packet of "Critical Care" from the vet and use that instead of the carrots. Critical Care is ground up hays, grasses, weeds and vitamins...just what an herbivore needs.

I don't think he's mourning the death of his mate, but he's more than likely pretty stressed out because of the tube feeding and the move to a new home. It will take him some time to settle down and realize he is home now and you are not going to harm him. Every day put a nice pile of fresh greens in front of him then quickly get out of his sight. Is he outside?

Yvonne

---

Oh...and:

to the forum!!

Yvonne

 

[Italianlnm]

Thanks for the welcome!

He isn't outside right now. I just seperated the two and have him in a different room as well. He is in the dining room, and no one goes in there. So maybe he will calm down. I was worried they might have hurt his mouth doing the feeding too. I will put greens in there every morning before I leave. Should I worry that he may have contaminated the yearling, if he is indeed infected with something? He was in there about 3 hours, and they got head to head.

Also, is there a way I can tell what sex he is?

 

[tortoisenerd]

Welcome to the group! So sorry to hear this. I agree a vet check up is in order to rule out anything health wise. Although I do think tortoises have feelings, I do not think that the tortoise being in mourning is the likely sole cause of not eating. What have you been trying to feed so far? Most likely in my opinion the cause of the not eating could be the shock of the new home and new diet. Can you share more about how the tort is being kept? Enclosure, substrate, temperatures day/night min/max, diet, hydration, etc. Pictures are also helpful. Try to find a tortoise vet, not just a regular one. Yes, tortoises can be quite shy especially without a lot of contact. I think sitting out with him can be helpful. I would however try to keep handling and touching to a minimum until he gets more used to you, and realizes that you won't hurt him, and bring the food. Some foods that can entice a tort to eat are radicchio (the purple lettuce), organic hibiscus flowers, butternut yellow or zucchini squash, pumpkin (plain in a can or fresh), and spring mix. Some torts also like a commercial food called Mazuri that you can buy online or have a feed store order for you. Right now the goal should be to get him to eat anything, and then slowly switch it over to a healthy varied diet.

Yes, a diet solely of carrots or even 5% carrots is not good--they are too sweet/starchy. That said, if you can get him eating again and it's carrots, so be it. Have you tried to feed the carrots mixed in with other greens so it's at least semi-familiar? How does his weight look and feel? If you lift him up (if possible), does he feel like a rock of the same size? Does he look scrawny? How long since he's eaten? Torts can go quite a while (weeks or months) without eating, but you should not wait that long before taking action. A vet will probably suggest examining and testing him for health issues, and likely tube feeding.

He should not harm your Sulcata, but they need to be separated as much as possible. At least a very solid fence which they cannot see each other. The more distance between them the better. Do not be surprised if they can smell each other even without seeing each other. How much acreage do you have? Two male Sulcatas need A LOT of space!

Contrary to popular belief, tortoises do not have "mates". In the wild, they only come together to breed, and otherwise lead solitary lives. Also, if he's actually only 5, then he hasn't even reached full sexual maturity (although really close) and likely didn't ever mate with the female tort. He shouldn't have had a close physical attraction like humans or other animals do.

I actually think the stress of introducing him to another tort (even ignoring the risks with health and not having a quarantine) could be worse for him then just trying to figure out if there is a health of husbandry issue going on. So, did the tort stop eating shortly after the female died? What was he eating before that? Was the carrots tube fed only to get him eating again? Any idea why the female tort died? How long ago was it? Sorry for all the questions. Best wishes.

 

[Italianlnm]

I am not sure they are both males. And I only got the other earlier today. I have him on a tort. Table with a hay substrate. The one end right now is about 85-90 degrees, and the other is probably 75. I have had my hatchling for a bit, so I know a LITTLE bit about them.. But not near enough. I am soaking him to make sure he stays hydrated, which the lady said she had been doing on a daily basis.

Bullet is actually pretty meaty. He isn't scrawny at all. Right now I have a few different types of greens in there, and with the hay that is his substrate. I also put a little bit of canned pumpkin in there. Just a little. I was reading on a site and they say they give their's canned pumpkin as a treat.

I have a tortoise vet, that I have been using for Tank (The hatchling).

The tort. stopped eating when the female died. The woman that gave Bullet to me, said that she thinks the female died due to lack of knowledge on the owner's part. I really don't know what he was eating before that. I have no previous knowledge other than what the woman told me, and she wasn't actually the owner.

 

[Italianlnm]

Before I left this morning, I put a handful of varied greens in a pile in the corner of his table. I just got home and they were scattered everywhere. So I don't know if he is eating them.. but he has been treading on them.

 

[Crazy1]

Italianlmn, it is possible if Bullet (your new Sully) has anything contagious could after 3 hours in close contact with Tank have given it to him. I would start with a vet visit to make sure if you can. Or at least a fecal which if taken in without the tort should be cheaper. If it was lack of knowledge of the previous owner that caused the death of the female it is more than likely that the male is in a bad state also. That is why I suggest a vet check Plus you have exposed him to your yearling. Watch them both closely. Put one or two leaves of something in Bullets table and see if it is gone in the morning. Then at least you will know if he is starting to eat.
At least you know he is moving around as he scattered it throughout his enclosure.

 

[tortoisenerd]

Sometimes people will count spring mix leaves for example if they are not sure the tort is eating. After they are dried and scattered, they can still be counted. Agree with Robyn. Also, if you take action now before you see any obvious symptoms, it more likely any issues could be fixed with less risk or permanent damage or death. Many times a tort will not show symptoms of anything until it's too late to save them. Not eating is a major problem, although torts can go without eating for a long time, not all of them can, and sounds like you don't know exactly how long this has been going on. Any pictures of the tort available? See this thread if you need help posting them: http://tortoiseforum.org/thread-1408.html Also let us know if you need someone to look up information about tort vets on your area. Just post your location. Best wishes.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

My experience with Sulcata tells me that if one is not eating he is probably sick. Sulcata are garbage cans and will eat anything at any time. If you think he is warm enough (85-90) degrees then I would assume he is sick and I would get him to the Vet. Do you know why they started tube feeding him in the first place? He was with a female who died and he is not eating so it is very easy to assume he is most probably sick. I would take him or a fecal sample to the Vet and get a professional opinion. And I would keep him away from your resident tortoise.
Hay is not a good substrate as you can't wet it for the needed humidity. You will need to change his substrate after you get him eating again.
Welcome to the group I hope we will be able to help you with this new tort...

 

[Italianlnm]

I have only had them on hay for 2 days. The zoo told me to put them on something that doesn't hold humidity, as I have been housing mine on a mixture of a soil,sand, and coconut scrapings (The grassy stuff on the top of them).

I have called the Vet and she is going to the try and find a date I can come in. I think the whole reason they started tube feeding is because he wasn't feeding. They never took him to a vet, and had no previous on Torts.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

In the wild Sulcata dig long burrows to protect themselves from the weather. Inside those burrows they continually poop and pee raising the ambient humidity sometimes to 80%. In my experience with Sulcata I have found that it's humidity that prevents pyramiding. I kept my smaller Sulcata on damp to moist substrate and I run a vaporizer every other night or so for Bob creating serious humidity in his shed. I don't believe your Zoo was correct in telling you to put them on a dry substrate. That will cause a bubbly nose from being too dry and it will create pyramiding.
I just now looked to see in Africa where they come from it is 1 am with 100% humidity...

 

[Yvonne G]

I know that zoos "keep" animals, and you would think that in order to keep them, they would know how to care for them. But in my experience with my zoo here in Fresno, they really don't know much about each individual animal's correct care. I'm friends with a woman who retired from our zoo. She was a reptile keeper and was one of the more knowledgeable ones. We had dinner tonight with the gal who used to be the vet at the zoo and three other either retired or current keepers at the zoo. The conversation was a real eye opener. They feed the animals and clean up after them, but they really don't know the "correct" care for the tortoises. I wouldn't set too much store by what the zoo tells you to do with your tortoise's environment. I mean, after all...look at the small habitats they have set up for them in the reptile house. They might look natural, but are they big enough?

Yvonne

 

[Crazy1]

Also when you put the substrate in and dampen it the lights dry out the top layer so that it is dry but it helps keep the humidity (ambient air humidity) up. If they need more they will dig down into the dampend substrate. (Remember damp not wet).

 

[Italianlnm]

I just put a handful of different types of greens in there with him. I will see what happens today when I get home. I would just love to know he is at least munching on something.

I will redo their substrate tonight when I get home. Thanks for letting me know. The torts at the zoo are actually in a nice outside pasture. They have (In my opinion) replicated their natural habitat to the best of their ability. Even if they don't know very much about the animals themselves.

Tank hasn't really should any signs of being sick. He is acting normal. I am still probably going to take him to the vet just to be sure. (and when I say 'he' we don't actually know).

How deep should the substrate be?

 

[Italianlnm]

Alright.. I got home today and he was eating. He is eating again, and he is being pretty active. Which is great! But one other thing that worried me.. He had a piece of wood in his mouth.. He let me pull it out, and then he went right back to munching his food. I am switching their substrate in a little bit. I have to run to the pet store, though. How deep should it be?

 

[bettinge]

2-4 inches should be acceptable!

 

[tortoisenerd]

Do you feed him on some sort of dish, or straight on the substrate? I find a slate tile works great to put food down on, and then place it against a wall. Less food gets on the substrate so less substrate gets in the tort's mouth. Also wears down the beak and nails naturally like in the wild. If your tort shows signs of liking to dig, you want it much deeper (at least as deep as they are long). Otherwise a few inches is fine. What kind of substrate are you getting? How big of an enclosure is this? Any pictures? Best wishes.

 

[Italianlnm]

The only pictures I have right now are on my phone, and I am working on sending them to my Email, to post them. I have a stone slate that I put it on.

I am probably going to get a couple kinds and mix them.. Any suggestions?

 

[Italianlnm]

Not a stone slate. At this point I am putting it on a plate. I need to get a flat stone though.

 

[tortoisenerd]

Coconut fiber with a little play sand is popular. So is orchid bark or cyprus mulch. Organic potting soil is fine too. Why mix several? Isn't it easier to do one?