Indoor Enclosure Questions

[TopWarmachine]

I am planning on buying a THH sometime this month and had a couple of questions about the enclosure I have constructed.

The first question is in regards to the material used for the box. I used Select Pine from my local Home Depot to make the box; however, I remember reading in a previous forum that pine oils are harmful to the tortoises eyes. I cannot detect much of a pine odor from the box and was curious if it was an unwise choice to use pine for the building material?

Secondly, as for the substrate, I was planning on going with either a 50/50 or 70/30 mix of eco earth and play sand for the baby Hermann, but I have read a few other posts about people having problems with that particular substrate being consumed. Will this be a problem, is there a better type of substrate more suitable for a baby Hermann's Tortoise?

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

[Maggie Cummings]

I had pine substrate kill one young tortoise and blind another, however, I don't think pine plywood will harm one, especially since you will need to line it with something before you add the substrate. I use a shower curtain liner for my tort tables. If you use a 50/50 mix of clean play sand and eco earth (bed a beast) that is a good substrate. HTH

 

[TopWarmachine]

Thanks for the reply. I have all of the walls of the table lined with 3.5" of acrylic to prevent any type of water damage to the wood, and a cheap removable plastic liner for quick and easy substrate changes. I was going to use a shower curtain, but upon reading the package label it stated that it was anti-bacterial and made me worry about possible harm to the THH due to the chemicals used to give it anti-bacterial properties.

As for the substrate, is there a special type that should be used for a baby rather than a juvenile? I have heard that some use aspen for hatchlings and others do not. Any Ideas or opinions?

 

[Maggie Cummings]

I have raised all my tortoises on fine grade orchid bark, and couldn't find it once, hence the eye problems from the pine. I have never used aspen because all my animals have needed a moist substrate to create ambient humidity and you can't get aspen wet. If you cannot find orchid bark I would use eco earth and sand mixed 50/50

 

[tortoisenerd]

Pine for the enclosure is ok, but not for the substrate. You are correct. I have a pine enclosure as it's better looking than the plywood and cheaper than another more expensive option I now can't remember that I had at Home Depot. I have a shower pan liner.

As for substrate consumption, it's case by case thing. Just observe your tort and see how it goes. Backup plan is newspaper for a very short term, then figure out a replacement.

Some people prefer to use a more moist/humid substrate for younger vs. adult torts due to pyramiding. It's a personal choice though. I have my hatchling Russian on aspen. From what I know, like Russians, Hermanns have a lower risk of pyramiding (it's not common such as in Sulcatas and Redfoots). I think you should start with a more moist substrate like the orchid bark or coconut fiber, and then switch only if necessary. For us, I couldn't get the temperatures up high enough with a moist substrate in my damp climate. Aspen works well for us for many reasons.

 

[TopWarmachine]

Thank you again for all of your comments; they have been a great help.

I do have another question regarding the Eco Earth Substrate. I have had a hard time deciding whether or not to purchase the Uncompressed Eco Earth Coconut Fiber that comes in 8 liter bags, or to purchase the compressed brick form. My main concern is the amount of humidity it may produce. The uncompressed type is rather dry but can be moistened up fairly easy. The Compressed version however needs to be soaked in water to expand and I am curious about your thoughts on if it may still be to moist when mixed with the play sand.

The Reason I am leaning toward the compressed version is due to the fact that my tort table, when filled to capacity with substrate, requires 1.2 cubic feet or 34 liters of the stuff. So you obviously get more for your money with the compressed version.

 

[tortoisenerd]

When you hydrate the eco earth, from what I've read, it doesn't get placed directly in the enclosure (or at least the tort doesn't get placed in the enclosure right away). You let some of the water dry out from it. Also, you wring it out. By the time the tort is in contact with it, it should be moist but not wet. If you bought the bagged stuff (more expensive), you should add water to keep it moist. You don't use it straight out of the bag and never do anything with it. Same with you don't moisten the bricks and put the wet stuff straight in the enclosure.

Either should have the same result, the same humidity, and can be mixed with sand. The compressed stuff just weighs less, costs less, and is a lot more work (I spent a few hours doing mine for an 8 sq ft enclosure 6 inches deep (is that 4 cubic feet?), and keep in mind this does have to be done at least every few months in most people's opinion). With the moist substrate you are not going to be able to see every pee, and probably not every poop either.

I'd get compressed, have some big buckets, a tarp or something to lay it out on, and count on spending half a day. If you're done sooner, great. I put too much in the bucket at one time and was trying to do it in my apartment. Big mess! Good question by the way.

You might also consider organic soil or some of the other options like orchid bark like Maggie said. I personally didn't like a lot of things about the eco earth, especially the little strings getting caught on my hatchling. Probably better for older torts though. I think ever owner needs to test a few out and see what they and the tort like.

If you do end up getting the eco earth, look online for good deals for multiple brick purchases. Huge difference from getting a price for one at a time, and an even bigger price difference from a local store. Worth even paying for shipping most times, or if you order enough a lot of places have free shipping.