Leopard Tortoise One Eye Puffy and Shut

[Lazmarr]

Hello again,

Our leopard tortoise seems to have one puffy shut eye. She seemed OK the other day but yesterday I noticed this.
Her other eye looks to be OK and I don't see any swelling or puffyness.

We have bathed her which seemed to help briefly. But this morning she still has her eye shut and it's still quite puffy.

I managed to get some vetarycin eye drops and will see if these help.

I'm not sure what could have caused it, but she does seem to be catching get eye on her shell and rubbing at it.

Any help and advice would be appreciated.

 

[Ink]

Can you post pictures?

 

[wellington]

Post pictures of the tort, your enclosure and what lighting you are using.

 

[Tom]

Hello again,

Our leopard tortoise seems to have one puffy shut eye. She seemed OK the other day but yesterday I noticed this.
Her other eye looks to be OK and I don't see any swelling or puffyness.

We have bathed her which seemed to help briefly. But this morning she still has her eye shut and it's still quite puffy.

I managed to get some vetarycin eye drops and will see if these help.

I'm not sure what could have caused it, but she does seem to be catching get eye on her shell and rubbing at it.

Any help and advice would be appreciated.

What substrate are you using?
What UV source are you using?
Does the tortoise live alone?

 

[Lazmarr]

Can you post pictures?

@Tom Apologies for the delay in getting back to you both, it has been quite a hectic week this week.
I can certainly post pictures of her eye and of her enclosure and shall do this tomorrow for you.

The enlcosure is a custom made hybrid between a vivarium and a tortoise table.
There's been no issues with the substrate so far; it is a mix of Arcadia Earthmix and Pro Rep Orchid bark chips.
She has a 5% T5 UVB light installed. For the basking area there is a spot lamp which provides heat and some UVA.

Yes, the tortois is on her own. I have noticed that she keeps trying to rub it when pulling her head into her shell, which isn't going to make it better. The eyedrops do seem to be helping a little, she does open her eye a bit after application and the puffyness does go down.

 

[Tom]

@Tom Apologies for the delay in getting back to you both, it has been quite a hectic week this week.
I can certainly post pictures of her eye and of her enclosure and shall do this tomorrow for you.

The enlcosure is a custom made hybrid between a vivarium and a tortoise table.
There's been no issues with the substrate so far; it is a mix of Arcadia Earthmix and Pro Rep Orchid bark chips.
She has a 5% T5 UVB light installed. For the basking area there is a spot lamp which provides heat and some UVA.

Yes, the tortois is on her own. I have noticed that she keeps trying to rub it when pulling her head into her shell, which isn't going to make it better. The eyedrops do seem to be helping a little, she does open her eye a bit after application and the puffyness does go down.

How close is the UV tube to the tortoise? Do you have a UV meter?

Is there sand in the earth mix? That could be the issue.

Spot lamps shouldn't be used with tortoises. You need a flood bulb. This probably not the cause of the eye issue, but it is a problem.

 

[Lazmarr]

How close is the UV tube to the tortoise? Do you have a UV meter?

Is there sand in the earth mix? That could be the issue.

Spot lamps shouldn't be used with tortoises. You need a flood bulb. This probably not the cause of the eye issue, but it is a problem.

Thanks for the reply @Tom and @Ink

Here are the photos of her eye and her enclosure.



Sorry for not being as clear as I could have been.

The tortoise table area of her enclosure has a halogen heat lamp to provide an area to bask in; when she's outside of her hide.

Looking at the ingredients list of the earth mix, I can't see that any sand is used. This was chosen to let her dig a little.

Inside her main area is the T5 uvb bulb. It's around 35cm - 40cm away from the substrate, as well as a CHE to maintain a warm area of around 30°C. There is also a hide inside, so that she isn't exposed to the Uvb and heat all day and can choose where to go.

 

[Ink]

What is the substrate?

 

[Tom]

Thanks for the reply @Tom and @Ink

Here are the photos of her eye and her enclosure.



Sorry for not being as clear as I could have been.

The tortoise table area of her enclosure has a halogen heat lamp to provide an area to bask in; when she's outside of her hide.

Looking at the ingredients list of the earth mix, I can't see that any sand is used. This was chosen to let her dig a little.

Inside her main area is the T5 uvb bulb. It's around 35cm - 40cm away from the substrate, as well as a CHE to maintain a warm area of around 30°C. There is also a hide inside, so that she isn't exposed to the Uvb and heat all day and can choose where to go.

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1. 35-40 cm might be much too close, depending on which UV tube you are using.
2. The UV tube needs to be near the heat lamp. What type of bulb is it? There are several types of HO tubes with varying levels of UV output.
3. Halogen bulbs should not be used over tortoises. You need a regular incandescent flood.
4. This is not a grass eating species. Whatever the dried grass stuff under the heat lamp is, it should be removed.
5. Since you don't know what is in that substrate, I would remove it.

Here are the most common causes of eye issues:
1. Sand. The substrate you are using looks like there is sand in it.
2. Wrong UV, or misused UV. Without a meter, there is no way to know what is going on under that bulb. Often both eyes, but there can be exceptions depending on bulb placement and cage design.
3. Mechanical injury, like getting poked with a stick, or bitten by an aggressive cage mate. Its usually just one eye in this case.
4. Dry dusty substrate. Is yours damp?
5. Incorrect temps, which cause illness and a hampered immune system.

Give this a read. There is a heating and lighting breakdown at the bottom, along with a temperate species care sheet. Review of this material might reveal your issue:

Info For New People. Please Read This First.

Hello and welcome to tortoiseforum.org! We are all glad you are here! There is no other forum like this anywhere. We have tens of thousands of members from all over the world ranging from kids with their first tortoise to people who have been breeding and keeping high end tortoises since the...

tortoiseforum.org

 

[Tom]

I made a mistake. You need the tropical species care sheet, not the temperate species one. It won't let me edit the above post anymore...

This also brings up another point: There is no ways to maintain the correct temperatures with an open topped enclosure for a leopard tortoise in the UK. Your tortoise might be having this issue because it is too cold. I see the closed area, and I read about the CHE, but this open area isn't suitable for this species in your climate.

 

[Lazmarr]

I made a mistake. You need the tropical species care sheet, not the temperate species one. It won't let me edit the above post anymore...

This also brings up another point: There is no ways to maintain the correct temperatures with an open topped enclosure for a leopard tortoise in the UK. Your tortoise might be having this issue because it is too cold. I see the closed area, and I read about the CHE, but this open area isn't suitable for this species in your climate.

Thanks for the reply @Tom
@Ink the substrate is a mix of Arcadia earthmix and ProRep bark chips. The earthmix was chosen because it is not a risk of impaction and lets the tortoise dig, the ingerdients list doesn't mention that it inlcudes any sand and is a mix of soil and earthworm husk; which provides minerals and nutrients, and some enrichment to the tortoise if she wants to dig. It also allows for some of the foods and plants to grow and provide natural areas to hide in.

This is the care sheet I've been following since I purchased the tortoise, it's from the Royal Veterinary College of London. https://www.rvc.ac.uk/Media/Default...ital/documents/Leopard-tortoise-care 2016.pdf

The grasses that have been planted were timothy hay, dandelion, and some herbs, as these are edible and suggested staples. We've allowed them to die off as we're going to be turning over the substrate with fresh ones.

The main "hide" area is on the left of the outside pen. The hide has the UVB T5 bulb inside, which is an Arcadia 6% T5 UVB, as well as a ceramic heat emitter.
The temperatures inside the hide are closesly monitored and are set to maintain a day temperature, inside the hide's shaded area, of 28-30°C. During the night this does not fall below 27°C.
The substrate inside the hide is dry on the surface, but mosit underneath. It is misted every day.

Outside the hide, in the pen, is the spotlamp which provides an area to bask in. I can swap the bulb to a floodlamp, however all bulbs that are available in the UK, at least that I can get my hands on, output UVA. In September of 2018 a ban came into effect which stopped the sale of general incandescent and halogen bulbs, so the only ones which can be purchased are specifically for reptiles. These all output UVA.

The outdoor pen isn't meant to be her permanent home. We do want to take her into the garden over the summer, particulalrly on warmer days and the outdoor pen mimmics what these will be like.
She spends most of her time within the vivarium part as it is the warmest place. We created the outiside area as a place for her to get some enrichment. She ventures out to eat her food, to stretch her legs, and to drink some water if she wants. Although the ambient temperatures in the pen won't be maintained, the basking area does provides around 35-40°C, as a way for her to warm up after eating or walking, and she will take herself back to her hide after basking.

 

[Tom]

Thanks for the reply @Tom
@Ink the substrate is a mix of Arcadia earthmix and ProRep bark chips. The earthmix was chosen because it is not a risk of impaction and lets the tortoise dig, the ingerdients list doesn't mention that it inlcudes any sand and is a mix of soil and earthworm husk; which provides minerals and nutrients, and some enrichment to the tortoise if she wants to dig. It also allows for some of the foods and plants to grow and provide natural areas to hide in.

This is the care sheet I've been following since I purchased the tortoise, it's from the Royal Veterinary College of London. https://www.rvc.ac.uk/Media/Default/Beaumont Sainsbury Animal Hospital/documents/Leopard-tortoise-care 2016.pdf

The grasses that have been planted were timothy hay, dandelion, and some herbs, as these are edible and suggested staples. We've allowed them to die off as we're going to be turning over the substrate with fresh ones.

The main "hide" area is on the left of the outside pen. The hide has the UVB T5 bulb inside, which is an Arcadia 6% T5 UVB, as well as a ceramic heat emitter.
The temperatures inside the hide are closesly monitored and are set to maintain a day temperature, inside the hide's shaded area, of 28-30°C. During the night this does not fall below 27°C.
The substrate inside the hide is dry on the surface, but mosit underneath. It is misted every day.

Outside the hide, in the pen, is the spotlamp which provides an area to bask in. I can swap the bulb to a floodlamp, however all bulbs that are available in the UK, at least that I can get my hands on, output UVA. In September of 2018 a ban came into effect which stopped the sale of general incandescent and halogen bulbs, so the only ones which can be purchased are specifically for reptiles. These all output UVA.

The outdoor pen isn't meant to be her permanent home. We do want to take her into the garden over the summer, particulalrly on warmer days and the outdoor pen mimmics what these will be like.
She spends most of her time within the vivarium part as it is the warmest place. We created the outiside area as a place for her to get some enrichment. She ventures out to eat her food, to stretch her legs, and to drink some water if she wants. Although the ambient temperatures in the pen won't be maintained, the basking area does provides around 35-40°C, as a way for her to warm up after eating or walking, and she will take herself back to her hide after basking.

That soil mix substrate should not be used. There is no way to know what is in the soil and that is bad enough by itself, and if they aren't listing the total list of ingredients, then there is no way to know what else is in that bag. Most of those types of mixes have some sand, but even with no sand, soil should never be used as tortoise substrate because of all the weird stuff they put in it.

Like most care info, the RVC sheet has a few right elements, but many other wrong elements that will lead to death or permanent disfigurement if followed. THIS is the wrong info we are trying to combat here. There is no sense in me picking it all apart. You've read theirs and you are welcome to read mine to see the differences. Much of their info is the same old wrong outdated info that you find everywhere, except here on TFO. Following that old wrong advice will result in the same old poor results and pyramiding.

The 6% HO tubes are for shade dwellers like red foot tortoises. You need the 12% HO tube and it needs to be mounted at the correct height using a meter. For UVB rays to be effective, the skin needs to be warm, so the UV tube needs to be near the heat lamp, not inside the chamber mildly warm chamber area. Think of the sun. The suns rays simultaneously warm the skin while the UVB hits it. That is what we are trying to accomplish indoors with our artificial lighting.

Arcadia is widely available in the UK and all over most of Europe and they sell basking flood bulbs of various wattages. Here in California we have that same stupid ban and I now how to travel out of state to get the necessary bulbs for my reptiles.

 

[Kayleigh Smith]

Hello again,

Our leopard tortoise seems to have one puffy shut eye. She seemed OK the other day but yesterday I noticed this.
Her other eye looks to be OK and I don't see any swelling or puffyness.

We have bathed her which seemed to help briefly. But this morning she still has her eye shut and it's still quite puffy.

I managed to get some vetarycin eye drops and will see if these help.

I'm not sure what could have caused it, but she does seem to be catching get eye on her shell and rubbing at it.

Any help and advice would be appreciated.

I have seen this exact thing before. When I purchased a greek tortoise her eyes were completely shut and one was swollen and I could tell she was having a hard time from some kind of infection (because it lasted more than a day)...i took her back to where i got her and they kept her the next week and took care of the vet and bills because she was new to me, but make sure you take your tortoise to a vet. They will most likely prescribe eye drops to be used daily for a week or anitbiotics of some sort

 

[TammyJ]

What comes to my mind is the question of humidity. Is she getting the correct level in her enclosure?

 

[wellington]

What no one has said yet is the enclosure is way too small and never should be sold as a tortoise house
Once you get the eye situation under control, you really need to work on a proper sized cage before you have even more problems.