Opinions on my hide layout?

[fritzgerald]

What do you all think about this layout? Is it too much? Too little?

It's bare because I just finished putting the humid hide and cork flats in. I still need to add in the terracotta bowls and plants (I got confirmation from the nursery that no chemicals or pesticides were used. Just rinse off the fertilizer, re-pot and I'm good).

I'm also planning to top the cork flat hides on the left and right corners with coco coir and planting some oat grass and dichondra seeds for more green and snacks.

I have another bag of micro bar so I thought about covering the humid hide just to give him a little more walking space but I'm not sure since I have a sensor inside of it. How often do you all need to get into your hides?

Last picture is the current temp and humidity as I write this. LED, UVB, and basking only. Humidity is crap since the front glass is off and not holding anything in, and the thermostat is lying on the floor behind the enclosure since I don't have my RHP yet, but the temps look alright as it sits and will get better ones the RHP is in and glass is installed.

 

[COmtnLady]

Are you keeping your tortoise in there yet? It looks like a nice chamber.

Every species of hatchling needs it to be very humid and warm. I like to say 84% and 84F just because it is easy to remember, but generally keeping both in the mid 80s to 90s is ideal. Even though tortoises do most things very slowly, it is pretty important to get your enclosure to those levels immediately if you have your tort in there. Babies are a lot more delicate than adults, and they really do need warm and humid.

OK- Debbie Downer Department ~

What do you mean, " since the front glass is off and not holding anything in"? If it isn't in place what is keeping your tortoise inside? I'd tape plastic sheeting over the opening until you get whatever done that is causing the humidity to be too low/missing glass. How can you check the humidity before you put the tort inside without it being closed up?

With the humidity be about 2/3 of necessary, are you soaking your hatchling? They need at least once per day for 20 mins to a half hour, though twice per day for a little one is even better. Adults can go much farther in between soaks, but hatchlings really need their hydration. Be careful to keep the water lukewarm the entire time your tortoise is in it, 95F-ish of you have a temp gun. It should only be as deep as where the top and bottom shells come together, so watch closely as shallow water rapidly loses heat.

For grazing and color plants you really need to have things that grow outside the chamber and then get put inside when they are big enough. Tortoises tend to plow down and munch on shoots before they can get to any size. Basically, I don't think your idea about coco coir on the cork will work very well.

(Also not sure I'd trust the nursery blithely saying to just rinse and use... What kind of fertilizer did they say was used? The plants "ingest" it and it goes into leaves and stems which the tort will munch on. If it was "well rotted animal manure" from a clean-ish source (critters weren't fed any sort of chemical/antibiotic food), then it would be ok. Are they the growers or did they buy the plants from a grower? If there's any chance of pesticide or chemical fertilizer, err on the side of caution.)

The cork tube could be a place to get stuck inside of. Just saying.

I think I would have something (moisture barrier, tablecloth, etc.) between the table and the bottom of the enclosure - It will ruin the finish, just like sitting a potted plant on a nice table/piano/bookcase does.

How deep is the substrate, and how much is bark and how much coco coir?

 

[fritzgerald]

Are you keeping your tortoise in there yet? It looks like a nice chamber.

Every species of hatchling needs it to be very humid and warm. I like to say 84% and 84F just because it is easy to remember, but generally keeping both in the mid 80s to 90s is ideal. Even though tortoises do most things very slowly, it is pretty important to get your enclosure to those levels immediately if you have your tort in there. Babies are a lot more delicate than adults, and they really do need warm and humid.

OK- Debbie Downer Department ~

What do you mean, " since the front glass is off and not holding anything in"? If it isn't in place what is keeping your tortoise inside? I'd tape plastic sheeting over the opening until you get whatever done that is causing the humidity to be too low/missing glass. How can you check the humidity before you put the tort inside without it being closed up?

With the humidity be about 2/3 of necessary, are you soaking your hatchling? They need at least once per day for 20 mins to a half hour, though twice per day for a little one is even better. Adults can go much farther in between soaks, but hatchlings really need their hydration. Be careful to keep the water lukewarm the entire time your tortoise is in it, 95F-ish of you have a temp gun. It should only be as deep as where the top and bottom shells come together, so watch closely as shallow water rapidly loses heat.

For grazing and color plants you really need to have things that grow outside the chamber and then get put inside when they are big enough. Tortoises tend to plow down and munch on shoots before they can get to any size. Basically, I don't think your idea about coco coir on the cork will work very well.

(Also not sure I'd trust the nursery blithely saying to just rinse and use... What kind of fertilizer did they say was used? The plants "ingest" it and it goes into leaves and stems which the tort will munch on. If it was "well rotted animal manure" from a clean-ish source (critters weren't fed any sort of chemical/antibiotic food), then it would be ok. Are they the growers or did they buy the plants from a grower? If there's any chance of pesticide or chemical fertilizer, err on the side of caution.)

The cork tube could be a place to get stuck inside of. Just saying.

I think I would have something (moisture barrier, tablecloth, etc.) between the table and the bottom of the enclosure - It will ruin the finish, just like sitting a potted plant on a nice table/piano/bookcase does.

How deep is the substrate, and how much is bark and how much coco coir?

Sorry I should have clarified. No tortoise in there yet. I'm working on getting everything set up and dialed in before he gets here. The "front glass off" probably makes more sense now. I took it out since it was easier to work inside with it having to slide it back and forth. So those previous temp/humidity readings were taken with a big opening in the front letting all the humidity out. I did put the glass back in and its been sitting for about 3 hours now. New temp/humidity readings are attached. I also had to drop the lamp down to a 45 watt, the 65 watt I had in there drove the temp directly under the bulb up to 107°. The humidity directly under the lamp is a little low but if I move the sensor 2 inches away, it jumps back up to 80-81.

I wouldn't call this Debbie Downer stuff, this is what I was hoping for. I may think something is good, or looks nice, but if it's wrong I want someone to tell me that. I tried to clarify and answer everything below but please, pick it apart. I want to have all this done right.

I have a bunch of stuff starting from seeds right now but I have the opposite of a green thumb so they may not make it and the re-potted plants will probably die before the tortoise gets here. The oat grass and dandelion in my seed trays are the only thing I'm pretty positive will make it.

I call it a nursery since that's what he calls himself but he's an individual grower with a backyard greenhouse, not a big box store or large nursery.

For the seeds in the enclosure, I'm 100% not expecting them to thrive or grow much, I have a bunch so I planned on just letting them sprout up, then throw in more seeds once he mows that down. Anything I want to last will be potted so he can't trample it, rip it out, or eat it down to a nub.

The table we're not worried about. The enclosure is fully sealed inside and if moisture does damage the table, we bought it second hand specifically for this enclosure and plan to throw the table out or give it away once I get a larger enclosure.

The substrate is 2" in front and slopes up to 3" in back but I may open my other bag and raise it a little more. It's all fir bark. There no coco coir in the enclosure and I was only planning on putting a little in over the cork flats just to have something for the seeds to sprout in. The cork round in the middle is actually bigger than the picture seems. It's sunk into the substrate a bit and the bad angle and shadows makes it seem tighter. If he can fit through the plastic hide opening, he can fit through the round.

 

[COmtnLady]

Thanks for explaining all the details. Sometimes people really do silly things (like have doors off and then wonder how the tortoise got lost or fell on the floor and got hurt), you seem to have your head on right. I just vaguely remembered you saying something about a baby star in an earlier post and I thought that meant you already had your tortoise.

I call it a nursery since that's what he calls himself but he's an individual grower with a backyard greenhouse, not a big box store or large nursery.

That sounds much better. Almost all nurseries get their plants from other sources and don't really know what has been put on them, or use the pesticides and growth hormones themselves. Its good you have one that is more one-on-one/hands on. Still, be cautious, its not good to accidentally get some chemically treated thing in with your tortoise... who will at least try to eat it.


It seems like you are doing well! Let's see what some of the others think.


.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Sorry I should have clarified. No tortoise in there yet. I'm working on getting everything set up and dialed in before he gets here. The "front glass off" probably makes more sense now. I took it out since it was easier to work inside with it having to slide it back and forth. So those previous temp/humidity readings were taken with a big opening in the front letting all the humidity out. I did put the glass back in and it’s been sitting for about 3 hours now. New temp/humidity readings are attached. I also had to drop the lamp down to a 45 watt, the 65 watt I had in there drove the temp directly under the bulb up to 107°. The humidity directly under the lamp is a little low but if I move the sensor 2 inches away, it jumps back up to 80-81.

I wouldn't call this Debbie Downer stuff, this is what I was hoping for. I may think something is good, or looks nice, but if it's wrong I want someone to tell me that. I tried to clarify and answer everything below but please, pick it apart. I want to have all this done right.

I have a bunch of stuff starting from seeds right now but I have the opposite of a green thumb so they may not make it and the re-potted plants will probably die before the tortoise gets here. The oat grass and dandelion in my seed trays are the only thing I'm pretty positive will make it.

I call it a nursery since that's what he calls himself but he's an individual grower with a backyard greenhouse, not a big box store or large nursery.

For the seeds in the enclosure, I'm 100% not expecting them to thrive or grow much, I have a bunch so I planned on just letting them sprout up, then throw in more seeds once he mows that down. Anything I want to last will be potted so he can't trample it, rip it out, or eat it down to a nub.

The table we're not worried about. The enclosure is fully sealed inside and if moisture does damage the table, we bought it second hand specifically for this enclosure and plan to throw the table out or give it away once I get a larger enclosure.

The substrate is 2" in front and slopes up to 3" in back but I may open my other bag and raise it a little more. It's all for bark. There no coco coir in the enclosure and I was only planning on putting a little in over the cork flats just to have something for the seeds to sprout in. The cork round in the middle is actually bigger than the picture seems. It's sunk into the substrate a bit and the bad angle and shadows makes it seem tighter. If he can fit through the plastic hide opening, he can fit through the round.

Looking good! All that condensation is a fabulous sign of humidity! Don’t worry that it’s lower nearer the bulb, that’s totally normal, they’ll be a gradient in there

 

[fritzgerald]

Looking good! All that condensation is a fabulous sign of humidity! Don’t worry that it’s lower nearer the bulb, that’s totally normal, they’ll be a gradient in there

Thank you. Humidity holds really well in there. You can definitely tell the times I had the doors open in the attached graph. Temps aren't where I want them but I'm still waiting on my RHP to get here (hopefully tomorrow).

I ended up seeding the top of the cork hides and the food container on top of the black hide. Placed a few of the potted plants you can't tell from the camera angle but the cork on the left is actually a little triangle shaped tunnel, no way for him/her to get up and eat those sprouts. Turned the center cork a bit to give more shade on the left side.

All the colored plants in "pots" (I need to replace them with better ones) except the green right in the front are raised up a few inches which should be high enough that they can't be eaten (for now). The green in the front is only about an inch above the substrate so it can be nibbled at.

There's Dandelion, Oat grass, Coleus, and Hypoestes seeds sprinkled spread around in areas for snacks, and Dandelion, Coleus, Turnip, Mustard seeds in the clear tray (probably over crowded but if they don't grow, I have more going in seed trays that are starting to sprout already).

I have another terracotta plate for food but haven't decided where to put it yet (probably shift the cool side pool over a bit and fit it in next to it).

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Thank you. Humidity holds really well in there. You can definitely tell the times I had the doors open in the attached graph. Temps aren't where I want them but I'm still waiting on my RHP to get here (hopefully tomorrow).

I ended up seeding the top of the cork hides and the food container on top of the black hide. Placed a few of the potted plants you can't tell from the camera angle but the cork on the left is actually a little triangle shaped tunnel, no way for him/her to get up and eat those sprouts. Turned the center cork a bit to give more shade on the left side.

All the colored plants in "pots" (I need to replace them with better ones) except the green right in the front are raised up a few inches which should be high enough that they can't be eaten (for now). The green in the front is only about an inch above the substrate so it can be nibbled at.

There's Dandelion, Oat grass, Coleus, and Hypoestes seeds sprinkled spread around in areas for snacks, and Dandelion, Coleus, Turnip, Mustard seeds in the clear tray (probably over crowded but if they don't grow, I have more going in seed trays that are starting to sprout already).

I have another terracotta plate for food but haven't decided where to put it yet (probably shift the cool side pool over a bit and fit it in next to it).

Fine tuning is always the tricky bit, but going to be so worth it once you see your baby in there

 

[MoreCowbellAz]

Hey Fritzgerald - What are you using to get those pics of temp/humidity etc? Do you have thermometer with an app or something?

 

[fritzgerald]

@MoreCowbellAz I'm using Aqara Temperature/Humidity/Pressure sensors (https://www.aqara.com/us/product/temperature-humidity-sensor) in Home Assistant. My dashboard for the enclosure just gives me 24 hour overview graphs of the sensors with average/high/low for the past 7 days. Then all the sensors can be drilled down into to get past history. Then I have automations to send me alerts, cut power to the lamp/RHP if temps get too high, or adjust the RHP thermostat higher if temps get too low. The lamp is just on a timer for 12 hours. The RHP is on a wifi Inkbird 308 also added to Home Assistant.