Pacing leopard tortoise

[Brandi]

Hi my leopard tortoise is 6 years old and paces(Jhonny is his name -hope he IS a male). He pacesnot all the time but usually before or after he eats. Is this normal?
He is very friendly and people oriented but I am wondering if he is bored and needs a mate? Do leopards do well with a partner of same sex or opposite?
I have more questions but I am not sure where or how to post a variety of questions about a leopard. This is my first time interacting with this site.
Please advise
Thank you,
Brandi

 

[Maro2Bear]

Greetings and welcome. I’m sure some experienced Leopard keepers will soon chime in.... but, there are lots of reasons! Too hot, cold, too bright, enclosure area too small, etc.

You don’t want to get another “friend” that's never the solution.

Take a few pix of your enclosure, tell us where you are located, lighting, heating, housing, etc.

Take a read here too.. https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.78361/

 

[wellington]

What size enclosure? My leopards live outside in the summer. They walk around a lot. Will walk up and down their very large enclosures. Will go in and out of their shed, lay under the shade tree, graze on the weeds and grasses and then will "pace" walk the enclosure some more. However, they have a large enclosure so they are doing their thing. If yours is I better too small of an enclosure then he likely wants out. A six year old should be around 10 inches long give or take and needs a very large enclosure.

 

[Brandi]

Well, first thank you for your informative responses ! I live in Southern California, San Bernardino County. As for his enclosure I will attempt to upload photos but the info is he has free run of our back yard/side yard and back covered patio where his “enclosure” With his Zoo Med RepiTherm RH high densitypolyethylene plastic habitat 40 watt mat is placed. He can go in and out at his choosing and surprisingly enough I find him just sitting inside during hot and cold weather. He loves to roam and munches at will. I need help in his diet as He won’t eat cactus stems or flowers or hibiscus or much of anything he is suppose to except for fresh grass, fresh dandelions from my yard, spring mix from store, plus I give him very little strawberries and tomatoes & spinach. He also eats tortoise monster diet pellets for African tortoise - I add calcium powder with and without D3 - he is a very picky eater as I have bought him greens of all kind he is suppose to love per leopard care sheets, but won’t eat. PLEASE ADVISE as to how to entice him to a healthier diet.
SO BACK TO PACING ISSUE.....My granddaughters and I have been keeping a close eye on him as to when he paces. He only paces next to our back sliding back door by his food bowls. It seems that he paces moreso in spring/summer that is why I thought he needed a friend. Also paces after he eats if he wants a tiny treat of strawberry/tomato bite or wants more food. Or I just had a light bulb moment the big reason might be because he knows how to open the slider screen door and come in and go to his indoor comfort zone in my office snuggled under my desk or in my closet between floor items. I spent a long time “potty training” him and he has not had an accident in years. So when I lock screen door he can’t come in...hence pacing (possibility?) Or when he wants his warm water soak or his garden hose shower, he paces until he gets it. MY CONCERN is that he paces for hours even if he gets what he wants. I am worried he is “unstable or ???”

 

[Brandi]

As you can see from his picture when he was small he was pyramiding when he was under a year old. The previous owners did not have proper heating, humidity or uv lighting, which I started up right way and have continued proper protocol.

 

[Taylor T.]

First thing I notice from the photos is that you are putting WAY too much calcium powder on his food. If you put too much on it can cause stones to develop on his digestive tract. A tiny pinch between two fingers 2-3 times a week is all he needs. This may also help with his pickiness as they will avoid food that has too much calcium.

Also, you really should not let him roam on the floor indoors. He can easily be stepped on, hit by a swinging door, or get lost. He could also ingest something that was on the floor such as dust bunnies, bits of human food, or anything else that might be down there. If the floor is slippery, he can develop hip issues, and it is also usually too cold on the floor for them, especially if you have AC on. Solution to all this: don't let him on the floor.

Do you use any pesticides or fertilizers on the grass that he has access to? I just ask because the grass in the photo looks very cared for.

For the pacing outdoors, I'd say that a little pacing is a good thing. Tortoises just walk around a lot looking for food and stuff. It might help if he had a few more shady spots and hiding areas out in that grassy area, because he probably feels rather exposed walking though that short grass. I know a lot people think cultivated lawns look nice, but they are far from ideal tortoise habitats. Maybe plant a few bushes and let the grass and weeds grow a bit longer?

 

[Brandi]

Wow Taylor GREAT INFO thank you so much ! Actually we pretty much stopped him from coming inside and that is why I thought he was pacing (throwing tantrum). I will heed your advice and indoors no more! The local reptile store told me a few years back I could stop the future pyramiding by giving him a lot of calcium and rotate one day with D3 and next without. So Poohey on his theory and I will follow your advice. One note though as of now he won’t eat the monster tortoise pellets without the calcium powder (are the pellets even good for him?) and we don’t normally put the calcium on his greens. But I will heed to your husbandry. No we do NOT use any pesticides or fertilizers on our grass as if you look closely it is a hodge podge of grasses with lots of areas that need nourishment but we only use water because of Jhonny our tort. He does have some hiding spots/shade on the different part of the yard but I will plant more for him and make sure he has a variety of places. I am very embarrassed of his pyramiding (btw I think he is a boy) but I want to help him from it getting worse.
Do leopards like to be solo or are they better with a “friend” I am kind of afraid he depends on people for playtime and sitting with because it does get a lot of people attention - but when we or grandkids are not around I am concerned he doesn’t know how to entertain himself.
Thank you for all you advise and communication.

 

[Taylor T.]

Pyramiding is caused by lack of humidity during growth. There isn't a whole lot you can do at this point to reverse it, as he is already pretty much full grown, but soaking him is always beneficial in other ways, so I would advise doing it. If you have not soaked him before, all you need is a plastic bin or kiddie pool, that you can fill with water up to about where his bottom shell (plastron) meets his top shell (carapace). Then just let him soak in there for as long as you have patience for, making sure the water doesn't get too cold. The water should stay kind of lukewarm, unless it's a hot summer day, in which case it's better to make the water a bit colder to cool him off. It's also worth mentioning that being pyramided will in no way stop him from living a long happy life.

I have no personal experience with the Monster tortoise pellets, so I don't know if they are good or not. The kinds I use are Mazuri tortoise pellets, and Zoo Med grassland pellets. I never use them in the summer, because weeds are healthier, but in the winter, when there is snow and I am restricted to store-bought food, I do use them.

Definitely DON"T get him a "friend". Tortoises are not social animals like humans, and will stop at nothing to remove the intruding tortoise from their territory. One will become dominant over the other one, and bully it until it eventually dies. The tortoises in this thread are Russians, but the same idea applies:

https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/w...together-a-lesson-learned-the-hard-way.94114/

 

[Robber]

Taylor T has given you some good information - once they reach that size, they will naturally walk around browsing a lot(especially if they are still hungry), but even at adult size they do not like to stay in large open areas very long, so having more areas of cover spread throughout the yard will be appreciated. While I don't think it's an inevitability that he will be aggressive to another tortoise, they certainly do not long for companions as a human or even primate might, so you don't have to worry about filling some kind of social need.

 

[Tom]

Other tortoises will be seen as intruders, not as friends. Adding one won't solve your problem and it will great new problems. If you want another one, divide the yard and make separate enclosures for them.

 

[Brandi]

This forum is outstanding and I sure wish I would have started posting years ago as all of you are a wealth of information!
Thank you Taylor T, Wellington, Tom, Robber, Maro2bear and the many other posts I have read! I hope someday I, too, will be able to contribute valuable info to others! Once again, I thank you and my leopard Jhonny thanks you too!

 

[Brandi]

Question: I cannot get my leopard guy Jhonny to eat Mazuri tortoise pellets or the Zoo Med grassland pellets. I have been trying for years even mixing it with a little bit of his fav strawberries and tomatoes (which are an occasional treat) but he still won’t eat it. He mainly eats hearts of romaine, spring mix minus the red leafs because he won’t eat those, grass grazing and occasional tomatoes and strawberries- he will not eat other things that I have growing for him...... hibiscus, flowers, cactus, aloe Vera, variety of veggies, etc. so how do I entice him to eat ?
ALSO, he pushes away any hay or bedding that I lay down for him in his shelter, or he hides in the mint bushes on dirt. What is the best ground cover for him?
Thank you once again for your anticipated answer(s).

 

[katieandiggy]

Could he be pacing by the door because he can see his reflection in the door glass? Just a thought.

 

[JoesMum]

The pacing sounds like typical male behaviour. My Greek, Joe, was always worse in the spring and early summer. He too had the run of our entire back garden. It's that time of year when the testosterone levels are higher and every male is thinking about sex, the opposite sex and defending their patch from possible intruders.

You know that there's no chance of your tort encountering a rival or a mate, but his macho mind doesn't.

And as others have said, don't thinkof getting another. The newcomer would be bullied or harrased until they become sick. In the wild they roam huge distances, meet up to mate and move on. In captivity one on one means there is no relief.

 

[Robber]

Question: I cannot get my leopard guy Jhonny to eat Mazuri tortoise pellets or the Zoo Med grassland pellets. I have been trying for years even mixing it with a little bit of his fav strawberries and tomatoes (which are an occasional treat) but he still won’t eat it. He mainly eats hearts of romaine, spring mix minus the red leafs because he won’t eat those, grass grazing and occasional tomatoes and strawberries- he will not eat other things that I have growing for him...... hibiscus, flowers, cactus, aloe Vera, variety of veggies, etc. so how do I entice him to eat ?
ALSO, he pushes away any hay or bedding that I lay down for him in his shelter, or he hides in the mint bushes on dirt. What is the best ground cover for him?
Thank you once again for your anticipated answer(s).

Mine don't care for Grassland, but my oldest will eat it moistened in the winter, and they will all eat it if it is crumbled over something they like(which is a lot of things). Although it can take a hatchling a little bit to start eating Mazuri, they almost all seem to like it once they get used to it, although a couple of mine like it noticeably less than the others. Maybe start by grinding it up and sprinkling the powdered form some over a wet piece of romaine or spring mix...I add a lot of good fibrous things to the diet during the winter this way(Timothy pellets, dried echinacea, dried chickweed powder, etc),

 

[Brandi]

Well, Katieandiggy, Robber and JoesMum, you both may have very valid points and ideas as I have been so pleased to have with other members of Tortoise Forum. I believe he does see his reflection in the sliding glass door, Katieandiggy, and most likely is using his macho mind as JoseMum suggests...….so I will attach cardboard to the glass door within his eyesight and see if he changes up his pacing there. Also I will be grinding up and sprinkling the grassland food and I bet he will eat it then - thanks Robber!
I am learning something new each day and tortoise husbandry! Jhonny and I thank all of you again.

 

[TriciaStringer]

I could be wrong, but I think as long as he is going outside in the sunlight, he doesn’t need the calcium powder WITH D3.

 

[wellington]

Stop feeding strawberries and tomatoes they are bad for them. Calcium for his size should actually be a small pinch no more then once a week. Too much is as bad as too little. Forget everything the pet store told you they no almost nothing. The floor is a dangerous place for them as someone pointed out. The pacing is actually not really going to hurt. It's good exercise and they tend to stay around fence lines then travel much in the middle. I would try to block the reflection in the slider as that might stress him. Some more cover in the yard might help for him to fell safer.
To introduce new foods, cut it up small and mix with his favorite foods and make sure it's wet. The new foods will stick to his fave and he will slowly get to liking the new.

 

[Brandi]

Say does anyone know of a GREAT leopard tortoise vet in the SoCal area of surrounding Upland, Claremont, Rancho Cucamonga, Chino, Glendora or anywhere close thereabouts ? Would appreciate all input ....Thanks TF members!

 

[Levi the Leopard]

Yes, Dr Greek. He's in Yorba Linda. I'm originally from Chino Hills. But we moved and now my poor 6 yr old leopard has to live in southern Oregon... Boo hoo for him.


Normally, I never feed him store bought greens. He eats the grass and weeds in the lawn with some mullberry and grape leaves. However, we just moved into a new house and I have to supplement his meals until the grass grows in..