Wolfpackin
Member
Is there a water hardness range that is best for drinking and soaking for tortoises?
Yes...somewhere between frozen and steam...[emoji23]Is there a water hardness range that is best for drinking and soaking for tortoises?
@WolfpackinI'm also curious if hard water softened by a salt based water softener is OK for drinking and soaking.
We report herein that the bioavailability of Ca from the water was generally as good as or better than that from milk, a food product well known for its very high Ca bioavailability.
Well, how about that! There went my theory! [emoji16]
Humans are advised not to drink artificially softened water here in the UK. We have to have at least one tap that is unsoftened, straight from the water main, in the house. Ours is the cold tap in the kitchen which we use for drinking, cooking and making tea and coffee.I'm also curious if hard water softened by a salt based water softener is OK for drinking and soaking.
How interesting! I have personally never had a water softener, but have never heard anything like that.Humans are advised not to drink artificially softened water here in the UK. We have to have at least one tap that is unsoftened, straight from the water main, in the house. Ours is the cold tap in the kitchen which we use for drinking, cooking and making tea and coffee.
Given that advice, I always use the hard water for pets too.
Thank you! Could I ask why you think this? Just curious.I know of no "hard, scientific" data to support this, but my thoughts from what I have seen in a myriad of other turtle and tortoise issues is that I would not use softened water, and indeed a moderately hard water would be best. I would not be overly concerned about this, but if I had a choice, I would certainly go with the harder water.
I resisted the explaination trying to avoid a long, boring post. The problem I find is that most of my thoughts on tortoise/turtle needs are based upon experience and studies from a broad range of topics and how they all would then fit together. The study showing Ca in water is just as bioavailable as in milk, for example, is one small piece of a puzzle of 100 pieces. It is how they all fit together (or not fit) that leads to my conclusions.Thank you! Could I ask why you think this? Just curious.
Thank you! Very interesting! I appreciate you taking the time for this...not boring to me!I resisted the explaination trying to avoid a long, boring post. The problem I find is that most of my thoughts on tortoise/turtle needs are based upon experience and studies from a broad range of topics and how they all would then fit together. The study showing Ca in water is just as bioavailable as in milk, for example, is one small piece of a puzzle of 100 pieces. It is how they all fit together (or not fit) that leads to my conclusions.
A few pieces... soil and ground water in most areas tortoises are found is both high in total alkalinity and acidic. In tropical forest species, rainwater that puddles and feeds water sources is much higher there in ionic calcium content, for example. I also tend to look at what is optimal as the enviroment best for a developing embryo that would be the most sensitive period of an animal's life. For example - What is the best temperature for a tortoise actively growing? = the best incubation temperature! There is more and more evidence I see that developing chelonian eggs are very much affected by the acidity and total hardness of the moisture to which they are exposed. Rainwater that moistens the nest prior to hatchling emerging are filtered by high mineral, acidic soil in areas that were in a more dry period previously. In the tropical forests the rainwater itself is very high in ionic calcium, potassium and magnesium. I believe many scute abnormalities are related to this chemistry (not incubation temps) when the mother's water content she uses while laying, and the moisture used for the incubation media is too soft and alkaline.
So from just those few examples, I feel there is enough reason to err on the side of caution and try to more closely mimic nature with the chemistry of the water our chelonians use.
Was using the hard water a decision on your part because you believed it to be better, or merely a matter of convenience?Here's more anecdotal conjecture on the subject: I soak and water my babies with the well water on my ranch. It is very hard and very alkaline. Been doing it this way for many years and it has worked very well for me. All babies of all species thrive. I actually use distilled or rainwater to rinse them after soaks so that the hard water doesn't leave unsightly mineral deposits on their carapaces.
If you do install a water softener, it is very important that you make sure that it is correctly installed and you do not soften the water to the tap in your kitchen which is used for drinking and cooking. This is because most water softeners work by replacing the hardness with sodium. Too much sodium can be a problem for premature babies because their kidneys are not good at filtering it out of the blood, and for people who are on a low sodium (low salt) diet. Artificially softened water may also be aggressive to plumbing causing leaching of copper and lead.
Its just what was/is available.Was using the hard water a decision on your part because you believed it to be better, or merely a matter of convenience?