Both you and wellington have asked me this question before so I’m under no illusion you know the answer and use it as a means of undermining me.. I was curious how many red foots you’ve had specifically, their needs can be quite different in terms of lighting, heat and diet. From my understanding me and you have had reds a similar amount of years, so in terms of red foot care in particular, we aren’t too far off one another.
the only time I’ll maybe get a bit firmer with people is when they aren’t so nice back, even then I try to have some tact
We manually change it throughout the day, there’s always someone in to do so with a reminder on their phone, the dimmer is very accessible so only takes a few seconds
I’m going to try and look into an automatic dimmer to make things even easier though
Let’s face it, there’s no real reason to be debating over something as simple as some dim ambient lighting, it’s just nit picking, and I don’t think someone needs to have raised hundreds of reds over decades to be able to make such a simple point. I’m not throwing some outlandish care method out there with zero evidence to back myself.Both you and wellington have asked me this question before so I’m under no illusion you know the answer and use it as a means of undermining me.. I was curious how many red foots you’ve had specifically, their needs can be quite different in terms of lighting, heat and diet. From my understanding me and you have had reds a similar amount of years, so in terms of red foot care in particular, we aren’t too far off one another.
Never have I ever given anyone the 3rd degree, I’m always friendly and welcoming, I simply ask for the information needed and pass on links
I get multiple direct messages saying they appreciate how kind and forthcoming I am, that others members hostility really puts them off the forum, so 3rd degree is one thing I can safely say I do not do
If I knew or could remember the number of your RF I wouldn't have asked.Let’s face it, there’s no real reason to be debating over something as simple as some dim ambient lighting, it’s just nit picking, and I don’t think someone needs to have raised hundreds of reds over decades to be able to make such a simple point. I’m not throwing some outlandish care method out there with zero evidence to back myself.
I think that’s what maybe got my back up slightly, asking me how many torts I have is irrelevant to the conversation and not been the first time it’s been done, the ambient lighting clearly works best for some people depending where their enclosure is located in their home
You can probably understand why I’m skeptical taking your word considering the irrelevance of the question though?
Hello there!
In this thread I’m going to include some information on an effective example of a starter enclosure for a red foot/cherry head
Care advice for these guys is painfully behind, fb pages, YouTube, pet stores, they’re all repeating the same outdated advice, this forum is made of people who have spent years finding the best ways to care for them that actually result in healthy tortoise, I’ve taken the knowledge of these lovely folks and applied it into making this thread.
I know it looks a lot to go over, I like to make sure all bases are covered, I’m happy to break down any information as and where needed, just ask!
I’m going to cover the types of equipment to use, how to maintain humidity, and a cost effective way for you to get a suitable sized enclosure, hopefully it helps inspire some ideas
Some of the equipment examples will vary from location to location with brands etc, however with the indoor UV, the examples shown are generally the only two brands you’ll want to go for. Cheaper alternatives are unreliable and sometimes dangerous. I’m from the uk so some of my examples reflect that.
When a hatchling, they do best in a closed chamber set up to better control the temperature and humidity, I would never recommend housing a hatchling outside of enclosed chamber, even if in a naturally humid climate, it can be difficult to mimic the humidity needed for a hatchling indoors without a top.
If using a light emitting heat source it should be an incandescent floodlight(examples attached)on a 12 hour timer, using a CHE(ceramic heat emitter) for night heat.
However I think ceramics as a heat source are more suited to red foot’s and far less desiccating on their shells.
Red foot’s don’t necessarily need a ‘basking area’ they aren’t typically a basking species coming from the forest floor(some do though, it depends on the individual) there’s no need for a ‘cooler end’ and ‘warmer end’ with these guys, aim for an overall ambient temperature range of 80-86(82-84 being optimal)temps shouldn’t ever be going below 80 all over both night&day.
Personally we rely on CHE’s(ceramic heat emitters) as our heat source 24/7, on thermostats, they’re a non light emitting bulb and I think you’ll find it easiest sticking to these as your heat source to keep your temps nice and stable. When using multiple hang them equal distance to distribute the heat more evenly.
Large wide(not deep) domes with ceramic fittings will help project the heat down, but don’t rely on the clamps that come with them, always hang them securely.
You can then hang some ambient lighting on a 12hour timer, it can being either a led strip or a led bulb in 5000k-65000k colour range. Create lots of shady areas with safe plants and hides, red foots don’t like things too bright.
Any indoor UV needs to be provided as a t5 tube fluorescent light, the compact or all in one bulbs either are too harsh creating uv hot spots that can damage their eyes, or are far too weak. I’ve attached the brands to go for and examples of stands to mount them. The Arcadia proT5 kit12% comes with the reflector fitting, the reptisun needs it buying separately.
However if you’re able to get them out for a few hours of natural sunlight daily, don’t worry about the uv. Just make sure it’s not too warm or cold, and they’re in a secure run with lots of shade.
Your little one will need around 80%+ humidity 24/7 to thrive, the right substrate and a good closed chamber set up goes a long way in making this work. You’ll constantly struggle with an open top.
We personally keep our red foot on orchid bark, we focus on the under layer of the substrate being nice and damp to create the humidity, then the top layer being dry, the trouble with constantly spraying is, one, it can only last so long, and two, keeping that top layer constantly damp will leave them more prone to a fungal infection, avoid misters/foggers for this reason too, the humidifiers can also make the air too wet leading to respiratory issues. To stop that top layer getting a little too dry (you don’t want dusty substrate) we mix it now n then, which also helps gives a humidity boost without extra water
Substrate wise never add any kind of moss, that’s something some stores think nothing of, but it can actually cause lethal impactions.
Don’t use any top soils or anything mixed with sand. Trouble with top soil is, unless composted yourself, there’s no telling what plants has gone into it, could be something toxic. Sand is an irritant/impaction risk.
Safe substrate options are coco coir, damp and packed down by hand as a base, with orchid bark on top, or forest floor on top, or just the orchid bark/ forest floor on their own.
Size wise I’d generally recommend you make your own base to go as big as you possibly can for the space you have, this tortoise full grown is going to need a large, secure outdoor space if your climate is good for it, if not, a room sized enclosure is going to be needed as an adult.
You’ll still have so many people recommending far too small a set up for adults, Don’t think they can get away with smaller if allowed to free roam, I’d highly discourage indoor free roams, being away from their heat source means they’re being exposed to temperatures that are too low quite often, smooth surfaces like laminate flooring will wreak absolute havoc on their hip joints over time.
There’s just numerous reasons it isn’t a good idea, harmful floor cleaners, foreign objects being swallowed, getting stuck under things they shouldn’t like shelving or sofas, low temperatures, no uv, getting hit by doors, one member has mentioned they knew someone who’s tort got their head crushed in a door jam, flipping hazards, smooth services, the list goes on and is endless.
They feel most comfortable and safe in a space that best mimics their natural environment, our homes don’t.
They don’t have reasoning skills to understand why they are uncomfortable somewhere, they just want to explore, which is why an appropriate size is so important, it helps build their muscle strength and aids in digestion. They’d walk miles in the wild!
Even outdoor free roaming isn’t a good idea for safety, they should always be somewhere secure.
A good cost effective closed chamber starter set up would be a greenhouse style enclosure by making your own large base out of a safe material, or even use a garden bed frame! For both these options line with some cheap pond liner, the lining going up the sides too and make sure those sides are high enough. Then simply secure a greenhouse topper on top, if you can’t find an exact fit, place it over like the one with the white base in one of the photos, I’d place some lining under the cover and base though to avoid condensate getting on your floor.
Some people even hang their lighting and heat from the greenhouse frame!(if it feels sturdy enough) Simply wrap the wire around for the height you need(check with a temperature gun/add thermostats, roughly 18-21 inches from top of tortoises shell for the uv) and secure with cable ties and chains. Or you could make your own stands out of safe timber, again I’ll attach some pics.
For a water dish a large terracotta saucer, sitting flush with the substrate is safest, they have grip in the event the tortoise flips, most pet store options are a hazard
Id definitely recommend a temp gun to make sure your monitors are reading correctly.
Have digital monitors that measure both temp and humidity, the gauge ones are inaccurate.
Ignore whatever else is in the photos in the enclosures, they’re just to give you an idea
Also as this is a closed chamber set up, the materials like the lining and cover will need time to off gas, I’d leave it all running up to a week, or until there is no odour, if there’s no smell, it’s safe for use
Whilst they’re a baby, do daily half hour soaksadults can have one 2/3 times a week.
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Remember basking isn’t necessary though!
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Now let’s talk diet! These beautiful unique tortoises have different dietary requirements from most tortoises, below is a list of things we personally feed ours! Please feel free to add your own safe additions, always looking for new suggestions
These are some greens to feed(bear in mind the lettuce isn’t the most nutritional but fine to add as part of a varied diet);
Lambs lettuce
Romaine
Red leaf lettuce
Frisèe lettuce
Endive(chicory)
Spring greens
Kale
Rocket
Cress on occasion
The odd Brussel sprout on occasion
There’s also plenty of different weeds you can add! Providing you’re sourcing them from an area that is free of any harmful chemicals like pesticides and fertiliser, so be WARY! There’s lots of lookalikes that can be toxic, it might be best to grow your own from seeds online. We add dandelions and broadleaf plantain, I’ll add a link below you might find useful to look through
The Tortoise Table - Home
The Tortoise Table plant database and resource site for Tortoise ownerswww.thetortoisetable.org.uk
Now let’s talk fruit! We remove any pips/seed/stones that are either toxic or a chocking hazard, so for my list, we’d remove the mango stone, plum stone, peach stone, nectarine stone, cherry stones(chocking hazard!), apricot stones, appel&pear seeds(toxic)
Ones we feed more regularly(but rotate cause variety is key):
Mango
Papaya
Pineapple
Raspberries
Melon
Strawberries
Watermelon(not super nutritional but a good hydration boost)
Plum
Peach
Nectarines
Cherries
Apricot
Blueberries
Figs
Guava
Prickly pear
Ones we feel less regularly:
Appel
Banana
Blackberries
Grapes
Pear
Those last ones are more of a treat basis. You can also try cherry tomatoes on occasion but not often.
We also sometimes grate a bit of carrot on our red foots food(not a lot) or some courgette, you can also add bell peppers on occasion, and they’ll also enjoy some mushroom once a week or so!
Hope this helps give you some ideas for variety
Also they’ll need some protein every 7-10 days, we personally give ours a head sized protein of steamed chicken breast, or a mouse we defrost from the reptile shop.
Calcium power can be added on 3 feeds a week.
Hope all this helps, any further questions, please ask away!
Thank you! Appreciate the kind words
Never heard that one, cheeky sod.
Haha don’t worry it was a joke
again not that it really matters a whole lot given the particular topic of conversation
Hands on is definitely much better than just parroting others info. However, we all parrot, that's how learning is and how it gets passed on. Very few of us can or want to own all the different species.Haha don’t worry it was a joke
Notice how I never questioned Maggie on anything to do with her methods though?
I said if she has lighting from her window that’s great it works for her, she’s been the one questioning me and my dim ambient lighting, so I kindly explained why I and many others choose/need to use it.. if you ask most red foot keepers, they all have some to varying degrees.
So tell me again why it matters how many I have?
I’ve answered multiple times about having one red foot, I even have a whole introduction post pinned on my profile that states it
I have yet to get the answer for how long maggie has had red foot’s specifically in her care for.. seeing as hands on experience is all that counts here I’d just be curious to know? You can spend decades raising certain species, but reds are still their own kettle fish, so I’m curious how long her hands on experience is with them compared to mine that’s all
Yes no one can argue hands on learning beats reading online, but like you say, not everyone has the means to own and raise a wide variety of species, that shouldn’t cancel out the things they may learn themselves from their limited hands on experiences. I’m still in my 20’s, having decades of time isn’t possible for me yet
We manually change it throughout the day, there’s always someone in to do so with a reminder on their phone, the dimmer is very accessible so only takes a few seconds
Yeah it just happens to be the one we have at the moment, it’s comes on dim, we turn it up slightly when the uv comes on, so if someone’s in the living room that usually reminds us, then dim bit back down once it’s off, it’s done mainly out of habit now without the need for reminders lol
Yes no one can argue hands on learning beats reading online, but like you say, not everyone has the means to own and raise a wide variety of species, that shouldn’t cancel out the things they may learn themselves from their limited hands on experiences. I’m still in my 20’s, having decades of time isn’t possible for me yet
I am, and always will be, very transparent that almost all the information in my care sheets is based off the knowledge I’ve gained from people on this amazing forum, I’ll never take that away, nothing I state comes off my own back, all I’ve done is taken what I’ve learnt here, applied it to our red foots care over the years and witnessed first hand the benefits and how efficiently it all works.
That inspired me to take the information and present it in a way that I’ve always personally been most fond of, lots of visual references. Is it parroting information? Absolutely! Is it the right information, that I’ve learnt works best through some hands on application myself? Also yes!
I don’t understand why the nitty gritty of how many or how long someone has had red foot’s matter when talking about a bit of subtle ambient lighting? Temperatures and humidity are most important! and there’s clearly no arguments there
The topic of parroting on the forum would be a interesting topic for a thread of its own, maybe in the debatable section.
Trust me I’m completely with you there! It was a long long time before I felt comfortable passing on care information like this, I had to take time to actually learn the nitty gritty of it all myself before feeling comfortable making caresheets, I’ve spent a lot of time learning the more technical side of things and why certain bulbs are dangerous, it was a minefield at first, but I needed to be prepared with the right answers if I’m going to be presenting information like this, with all the information I share, I’ve taken the time doing research to understand the inner workings of it all, I’d definitely encourage anyone who wants to share advice to do the same
You should share all your research you did!Trust me I’m completely with you there! It was a long long time before I felt comfortable passing on care information like this, I had to take time to actually learn the nitty gritty of it all myself before feeling comfortable making caresheets, I’ve spent a lot of time learning the more technical side of things and why certain bulbs are dangerous, it was a minefield at first, but I needed to be prepared with the right answers if I’m going to be presenting information like this, with all the information I share, I’ve taken the time doing research to understand the inner workings of it all, I’d definitely encourage anyone who wants to share advice to do the same
) 
