blonde vs. "high white"

Status
Not open for further replies.

jamie1210

New Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2012
Messages
6
Hi, everyone, longtime lurker here but have never posted before. My question is regarding the leopard tortoise colors: what's the difference between "blonde", "high white" "snow leopard "? And what is considered "normal" leopard coloration? Are you able to tell what the babies will end up looking as adults?

Couldn't really find this info online, and was looking for a clear cut answer ... Thanks!

Jamie
 

Julius25

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2012
Messages
1,108
Location (City and/or State)
France
To my experience, if you want have a very lighter coloration, you must look at the color of the skin in priority.
More baby skin is clear and there will be more likely that he ends up blonde or yellow.
after there is still genetics. You must try to know how parents are.

I do not know the difference between blond, white or high snow.
I know this site or you can see a full photo gallery on Pardalis with different colors. ==> http://www.ivorytortoise.com/

For my part I possess a male High Yellow. here is a picture.
241213DSCN1158.jpg

752306DSCN1134.jpg
 

Eweezyfosheezy

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2009
Messages
2,365
Location (City and/or State)
Peoria, Arizona
Everyone has there own opinions between what is "blonde" and not "blonde". I would consider a "blonde" leopard the one in the second pic in this thread http://www.tortoiseforum.org/Thread-Some-leopard-tortoises#axzz21WmS8Bj8 a good amount of blonde but also a decent amount of a black speckles (my leopards shell is a bit faded) throughout the carapace. A "high white" leopard is something to me that would have very little (3-6) black specks on the carapace. A "snow leopard" is something to me that has one or two tiny specks or it is completely blonde. I think a normal leopard is the big one in the thread I posted, it has a good amount of blonde and black. Nobody can tell what a leopard will look like unless they know exactly which adults produced them and if the adults produce the same looking babies year in year out. Most people have multiple males so there is likely more than one sire in most peoples clutches which makes it a crapshoot. Hope this can help you out a little bit.
 

N2TORTS

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
8,803
Wheezy’ … is right genetics is the key factor , the names are what humans make up~
Here are just a few leo’s past and present I’ve hatched or owned. You can see in the young torts even at hatchlin’ stage , which ones will be the “lookers” …..it’s all beauty in the eye of the beholder….


snowleps.jpg
NewLeapordtorts.jpg
snow2.jpg
bb17.jpg

AQ16.jpg
AQ19.jpg



JD~:)
 

Julius25

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2012
Messages
1,108
Location (City and/or State)
France
The last picture is incredible !!! so white :)
 

Neal

Well-Known Member
10 Year Member!
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
4,967
Location (City and/or State)
Arizona
Besides what has been posted, most leopards I have seen advertised as "high white" or "blonde" are usually describing the new growth lines (Which are always white), in which case it is just a marketing buzzword to get your attention. The new growth lines will darken and you'll end up with a normal colored leopard, which is still purdy!
 

jamie1210

New Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Mar 20, 2012
Messages
6
Thanks for everybody's input! This opened a whole new can of worms for me! haha :p

julius--that's a great looking leopard you have! no pyramiding whatsoever it seems.

Neal--what are growth lines?

weezy--is "blonde" considered yellow and "white" considered, well, almost cream colored? thanks for your explanation so far!

N2torts--you said you can tell at hatchling stage which ones will end up being the "lookers" ... i think i'm still a newb, but I'm still having some difficulty lol.

So, picture 1, u have 2 torts, a small and a bigger one. Are these two the more common ones? Also, will the small one eventually lose the smooth black patterning, and end up with the jagged black patterns as the bigger one? Is the bigger one the one that will end up being the unusual colored one?

Pic number 2, you have 3 torts. The one on the right corresponds to the one one in pic #3, but which one is the white one pictured in pics 4-6? Is it also the one in pic #3? Is this to illustrate that the lightest ones at a young age also turn out to be very "white"?
 

Eweezyfosheezy

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2009
Messages
2,365
Location (City and/or State)
Peoria, Arizona
From my understanding all leopard shells are blonde (excluding any hypos or albinos) because thats what the sun bleaches it into. If leopards are kept inside a lot or kept inside full time the "blonde" will be white.
 

TortoiseBoy1999

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2012
Messages
2,369
Location (City and/or State)
Palmdale CA
RE: blonde vs. "high white"

N2TORTS said:
Wheezy’ … is right genetics is the key factor , the names are what humans make up~
Here are just a few leo’s past and present I’ve hatched or owned. You can see in the young torts even at hatchlin’ stage , which ones will be the “lookers” …..it’s all beauty in the eye of the beholder….

JD~:)

Woooow those are beutiful!
 

N2TORTS

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
8,803
Eweezyfosheezy said:
From my understanding all leopard shells are blonde (excluding any hypos or albinos) because thats what the sun bleaches it into. If leopards are kept inside a lot or kept inside full time the "blonde" will be white.

Well I would agree the sun will “ wash out or lighten coloring” but not create patterns nor create the dominate color. Most leo’s will be a mixture of coloring and patterns much like their surrounding areas where they live ( for camouflage of course‘) . Anything “ bold , bright , white” would become easy meals and probably not survive into adulthood……thus that odd gene that created those colors goes bye bye. The shell is composed of hard, bone plates covered by scutes, the scutes are made of keratin, the primary substance in hair, nails and hooves of other animals and us . The pigment melanin, present in the scutes, form the intricate designs and brightly colored patterns .
One of several genes controlling pigment melanin color is located on the X chromosome. The gene has two versions, or alleles. One form of the gene codes for say “ white” coloring (XB), and the other form codes for black (Xb). The white allele is dominant to the black allele. Ordinarily, this would mean that an animal inheriting one copy of each gene (genotype XBXb) should be much lighter. I don’t think keeping your Leo in the house will turn it white either….it will just be a whole lot cleaner……
Anyhow just my opinion…….
JD~

and for the poster of the thread ....... the pics where to show you different colorings, most Leos are of a darker color , but the picture of the 3 are all from the same clutch, and yes the smallest " white" one will and still remain much lighter than his clutchmates.
 

Eweezyfosheezy

Active Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2009
Messages
2,365
Location (City and/or State)
Peoria, Arizona
Oh I wasnt trying to say the sun creates patterns at all. I should have explained more in my post. What I should have said is whatever white is on an animal will turn to a blonde when in the sun either full time or most of the time unless its a hypo or albino. Sorry about that. :)
 

N2TORTS

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2010
Messages
8,803
jamie1210 said:
wow, thanks for all the quick responses everyone!




N2Torts--ok, i have several questions on your post/pictures! :)

1. when you say you can tell which hatchlings are going to be "lookers", how DO you tell? What do you look for? Light colored hatchlings are desirable, because they will end up being light colored?

*Looker is just a term for what an individual might considered beautiful to them .....I dont think there is a certain kind?


2. Pic. #1 shows 2 torts, a smaller tort and a slightly bigger tort. When the smaller tort grows up a bit, will it lose its smooth black coloration, and will the black end up looking more jagged like the bigger tort's black coloration?

They all change while growing especially from a baby to Jr's years

3. Pic #2 shows 3 torts. It appears tortoise #3 on the very right is the lightest color of all. Is it the same tortoise that is pictured in pics #4-6? Is it to illustrate that when it's older it will be very white? And is this tortoise considered to be "high white"? Or "blonde"?

No It's a different tortoise, The Pic #2 is example of 3 clutchmates with very different coloring.
pic #3-6 High White ....Snow .....I prefer " Millie Vanilli"
:p

Sorry for the all questions, but I appreciate everyone's responses! :)

Questions and Sharing are a GREAT THING ..........HOW WE ALL LEARN! ;)

Eweezyfosheezy said:
Oh I wasnt trying to say the sun creates patterns at all. I should have explained more in my post. What I should have said is whatever white is on an animal will turn to a blonde when in the sun either full time or most of the time unless its a hypo or albino. Sorry about that. :)

Heck ... maybe I read it wrong ....:p;):D
 

netz67

New Member
5 Year Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
23
Location (City and/or State)
u.k
some lovely leo pics thanks for sharing
 

DesertGrandma

Well-Known Member
10 Year Member!
Joined
Apr 30, 2011
Messages
2,131
Location (City and/or State)
Arizona
Another thing to consider is that even with the same parents the hatchlings don't match each other. Traits shows up from the grandparents too. If someone were breeding a certain trait through generations then they would probably be an indicator of what the hatchlings would look like.

Some believe that the temps they live in have something to do with whether they are light or dark.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top