Calcified grass

[snake_girl85]

My husband has a friend who does water treatment for all sorts of things, works with water testing, water softeners etc... We asked him where we could find a cheap large source of calcium to mix into our homemade roach feed, and he mentioned something interesting...

He said that one thing we could do for our animals is to treat potting soil with calcium and other minerals for the plants to absorb, making the minerals more digestible for the animal eating them. He said that some people grow grass/plants for livestock hydroponically in calcium fortified water. He even said that we could have the plants analyzed to determine what mineral content they ended up with...

Theoretically any nutrition found in the plant would be more naturally absorbed by the animal than straight up supplements, would it not? Depending on how much calcium could be absorbed by the plant, I would think it would be possible to hydroponically grow "Calcium grass" that would (theoretically) be a natural, overdose-proof source of easily digested calcium (or other minerals) that would need little or no supplementation.

Thoughts? Anyone ever tried this?

 

[kbaker]

I believe this to be true in many ways whether the animal eats the plants or eats the animal that eats the plants. For the last five years or so, I have been putting a 'lime' product on my tortoise lawn. It is mostly calcium.
If I can find some info on it online, I will post it in the product forum.

 

[Itort]

"Limeing" the soil is to correct the ph of the soil in order to get a better forage crop. Plants have an ideal ph level for optimum growth. The calcium is not absorbed into the plant at any large extent but makes for a more favorable enviornment. Animals grazing on the forage will ingest some the calcium incidently through soil picked up. When I raised dairy goats, I would "lime" the pasture for this better forage productivity and would suppliment the animals with mineral blocks (a major component of which is calcium). What I am saying is "liming" will improve the forage but they still need a sure calcium source i.e. cuttlebone.

 

[kbaker]

"Limeing" the soil is to correct the ph of the soil in order to get a better forage crop. Plants have an ideal ph level for optimum growth. The calcium is not absorbed into the plant at any large extent but makes for a more favorable enviornment. Animals grazing on the forage will ingest some the calcium incidently through soil picked up. When I raised dairy goats, I would "lime" the pasture for this better forage productivity and would suppliment the animals with mineral blocks (a major component of which is calcium). What I am saying is "liming" will improve the forage but they still need a sure calcium source i.e. cuttlebone.

You are correct in many ways. In the wild, there might be a bone or two lying aroung to be chewed, but no cuttlebone. Captivity and wild conditions are two different things, but I look at the wild part to try to improve my captive conditions. How do wild tortoises get everything they need without any supplimentation??? And yes, tortoises do take in dirt naturally.

Liming will improve soil which will improve the plant. I also believe what is in the soil, ends up in the plant. Now, when you read things on lawns, they come from an angle of improving the look/health of the lawn and not how nutritious it is if you eat it.

I am glad to hear someone else looked at using lime. I don't know much about goats, but I am sure the biology is different with a tortoise and calcium.

I don't claim to know everything about "liming", but if you choose to try it, make sure it's the safe stuff. There are many forms of 'lime' for your lawn/soil.

 

[Itort]

"Limeing" the soil is to correct the ph of the soil in order to get a better forage crop. Plants have an ideal ph level for optimum growth. The calcium is not absorbed into the plant at any large extent but makes for a more favorable enviornment. Animals grazing on the forage will ingest some the calcium incidently through soil picked up. When I raised dairy goats, I would "lime" the pasture for this better forage productivity and would suppliment the animals with mineral blocks (a major component of which is calcium). What I am saying is "liming" will improve the forage but they still need a sure calcium source i.e. cuttlebone.

You are correct in many ways. In the wild, there might be a bone or two lying aroung to be chewed, but no cuttlebone. Captivity and wild conditions are two different things, but I look at the wild part to try to improve my captive conditions. How do wild tortoises get everything they need without any supplimentation??? And yes, tortoises do take in dirt naturally.

Liming will improve soil which will improve the plant. I also believe what is in the soil, ends up in the plant. Now, when you read things on lawns, they come from an angle of improving the look/health of the lawn and not how nutritious it is if you eat it.

I am glad to hear someone else looked at using lime. I don't know much about goats, but I am sure the biology is different with a tortoise and calcium.

I don't claim to know everything about "liming", but if you choose to try it, make sure it's the safe stuff. There are many forms of 'lime' for your lawn/soil.

I've be curious about calcium sources in wild torts myself. Do they utilize mineral licks like mammals and birds do or do they depend on vegetabile sources and the occassional bone ? My point is that liming grows a healther forage (grass) and therefore a healthier animal. I believe that a majority of the calcium is from nonplant sources.

 

[chairman]

Sorry, can't add to the calcifying grass debate, but I do know that here in the states one of the dissolved solids that is removed from our drinking water in exceptionally large quantities is calcium, I think in the form of calcium carbonate. I believe that this is one of the larger contributors to hard/soft water conditions. Perhaps torts out in the wild get a fair share of their calcium through normal, untreated water sources?

 

[moswen]

Sorry, can't add to the calcifying grass debate, but I do know that here in the states one of the dissolved solids that is removed from our drinking water in exceptionally large quantities is calcium, I think in the form of calcium carbonate. I believe that this is one of the larger contributors to hard/soft water conditions. Perhaps torts out in the wild get a fair share of their calcium through normal, untreated water sources?

does this mean that if i buy untreated bottled water to use in my tortoise's water dishes (instead of my tap water that i am currently using) that they may have more of a chance to get some calcium that way?

and i've never heard of "liming" the soil before, where can i get some of that? can i use a small amout of my calcium supplement that i already have until i get the liming stuff? and if i do these things, should i give them less calcium powder on their food?

right now i chop up a small slice of opuntia and shake it in a little baggy with calcium powder until it's coated and feed that daily.

 

[chairman]

I wouldn't think that it'd be necessary to buy special water... just find someone who has very hard water and ask for a couple jugs.

Or, to stick with the theme of the thread, use hard water to water grass growing in soil that's been limed to really give things a boost! (Assuming it works.)

 

[snake_girl85]

It would be interesting to learn what nutrient content in the soil is like in their natural habitat. I think I will try growing of grass hydroponically, just to experiment. Our friend said all you need to do is add the calcium (and whatever other minerals you would want in it) and a little miracle grow to the water...

Worth a try anyway.

 

[N2TORTS]

My husband has a friend who does water treatment for all sorts of things, works with water testing, water softeners etc... We asked him where we could find a cheap large source of calcium to mix into our homemade roach feed, and he mentioned something interesting...

He said that one thing we could do for our animals is to treat potting soil with calcium and other minerals for the plants to absorb, making the minerals more digestible for the animal eating them. He said that some people grow grass/plants for livestock hydroponically in calcium fortified water. He even said that we could have the plants analyzed to determine what mineral content they ended up with...

Theoretically any nutrition found in the plant would be more naturally absorbed by the animal than straight up supplements, would it not? Depending on how much calcium could be absorbed by the plant, I would think it would be possible to hydroponically grow "Calcium grass" that would (theoretically) be a natural, overdose-proof source of easily digested calcium (or other minerals) that would need little or no supplementation.

Thoughts? Anyone ever tried this?

First we must define Calcium*
The most common and generally least expensive form of calcium is calcium carbonate, although there are many different types of calcium available, including calcium malate, calcium citrate malate, calcium lactate and calcium gluconate.
Calcium is not absorbed easily by the “ hosts” body by itself and needs other vitamins and minerals to help the absorption process.
For a calcium intake to be most useful, it must fully disintegrate prior to leaving the stomach, delivering its contents for absorption in the gut. This is why “ dusting “ is very useful and most optimal . Most calcium intake for tortoises, The so called “ greens” can pass through the body completely or partially intact, depriving the tort’ of its desired nutrients and minerals.
Magnesium helps the body absorb minerals, such as calcium, so it’s a combination of desired minerals to get the “ whole “ effect.
Like other bitter greens, endives are nutritionally important for what they do rather than the nutrients they contain. Endives produce a special class of carbohydrates known as fructans, a group containing inulin (not to be confused with insulin) and oligofructoses.
These carbohydrates feed the symbiotic bacteria living in the intestine rather than the body itself. The bacterial fermentation of fructans in the intestine changes its chemistry so that the “host” body absorbs calcium and magnesium much more readily .
I bring this up because SO much is talked about “ CALCIUM” yet ..it is not a Fast acting remedy for any health issues with your tortoise and requires “ build up” in the torts system along with all other minerals and nutrients Why a varied “proper diet” is essential along with the added bonus of “ Dusting” their foods.
People have genetically enhanced foods for “ more calcium” already.

Genetically Modified Carrot Helps Body Absorb More Calcium
January 15, 2008 9:19 p.m. EST
Windsor Genova - AHN News Writer
College Station, TX (AHN) - Researchers from two Texas universities have developed a genetically modified carrot that helps the body absorb more calcium to strengthen bones and teeth.

Read more: http://www.allheadlinenews.com/articles/7009727864#ixzz0iolMvxMX
JD~

 

[kbaker]

Here is what I used last for "liming". I have used other similiar brands, but I mainly look for the type of Calcium that's in it.

I look at liming as what it might do for my tortoises. And when I read the label, I look for what it can do for my tortoises. I do keep in mind that the information given for the product is for other purposes and what they say may not apply for my intent. Which really sucks because I can't always find answers to my questions because it does not apply to the manufacturer.