Dot may be ill...

[UnicornSploosh]

Actually I'm just going to separate them. No reason to risk it with Dot already being ill. I'll just put him in a tank I have for now. I have extra bark and the grass seed sprouts quickly. I just wish the lights weren't so pricey lol

 

[Tom]

Even when they're asleep? I mean, I could be wrong but they looked pretty relaxed and unconscious.

How would it make you feel if I followed you around your house and when you went to bed I put my face a half inch from your face, staring right at you, and then when you woke up I was still right there a half inch in front of your face looking right at you? Were talking halitosis distance.

What message would this behavior convey to you? What would your reaction be? Suppose every time you tried to move away, I just followed you. Everywhere you go in your own house, I'm right behind you, eating off your plate, sitting on your food, shoving you out of the way of the best sitting spots, staring you down all the time, every day, all day.

Not a pleasant way to live, is it?

 

[wellington]

I know it's hard to understand the type of bullying that tortoises do. It's not normal for us humans. We see bullying very easy in humans and even dogs and cats androbably most animals. In tortoises, it's just not that obvious. So, separating them will be best. For Dot the most for now, while you try to get him back on track and in the future for them to thrive and live happy.
Good luck, I sure hope Dot can pull through.

 

[dmmj]

How would it make you feel if I followed you around your house and when you went to bed I put my face a half inch from your face, staring right at you, and then when you woke up I was still right there a half inch in front of your face looking right at you? Were talking halitosis distance.

What message would this behavior convey to you? What would your reaction be? Suppose every time you tried to move away, I just followed you. Everywhere you go in your own house, I'm right behind you, eating off your plate, sitting on your food, shoving you out of the way of the best sitting spots, staring you down all the time, every day, all day.

Not a pleasant way to live, is it?

it would be a little creepy

 

[Tom]

it would be a little creepy

Only a little?

 

[UnicornSploosh]

Only a little?

It depends. My daughter does this regularly. If I liked you I wouldn't mind. Otherwise you might be in danger of a mini freak out ending in your untimely exit from.. Well, life possibly. So okay, yeah - I can see where that would lead to aggressive behavior lol

 

[UnicornSploosh]

I know it's hard to understand the type of bullying that tortoises do. It's not normal for us humans. We see bullying very easy in humans and even dogs and cats androbably most animals. In tortoises, it's just not that obvious. So, separating them will be best. For Dot the most for now, while you try to get him back on track and in the future for them to thrive and live happy.
Good luck, I sure hope Dot can pull through.

Thank you. Me too.

 

[UnicornSploosh]

My little sickie chilling (not really, that's a heating pad under his water dish there) in his soaking pool.

 

[UnicornSploosh]

And we're still grazing so that's good, I think/hope.

 

[dmmj]

yes active eating are always good things its when those things stop that's when you have to worry

 

[Alaskamike]

Hello !
Welcome to the forum. The issue you are having is all too common. And may correct itself with time and good husbandry. I have a little redfoot that had a soft plastron and it took several months to firm up - but it was older.

I fully understand how it looks like these two are best buddies. We are social pack animals , so are our dogs and many animals we know about and keep as pets.

It's been found that torts do better in groups with 3 or more , rather than pairs. It is speculation that this is because with 3 , the most dominant one has 2 to control and it becomes a bit much so they give it up.

It is counter intuitive to us as social beings to think a tortoise is happier & healthier alone. We think they are Lonely, bored , unhappy , etc.
Putting human emotions into the animal.

When my 40 lb sulcata chases ( at a tortoise pace ) my cat around it looks like he just wants to be close to the cat. But in his world the cat is in HIS territory and has to go !

I had two very young Leopards once and would find one on top of the other sleeping. They were not cuddling. The one on top was dominating the other - I separated them immediately.

Even if they are okay , and grow up together , at some point one will likely bully the other - maybe even hurt him. Even if they are male / female , or female / female.

I would urge you to think about separate enclosures now. And what you will do when they are 5-10-15 or 20 lbs. what about 75lbs?

It's hard for us to interpret any way else but through our own emotions and experience. What the experienced keepers here are telling you is not over caution. It is experience and knowledge they offer

Good fortune with your two. I sincerely hope the little one gets stronger soon

 

[UnicornSploosh]

I am going to be separating them this weekend. I have to wait to get paid to get another MVB bulb and CHE as it's way too chilly at night for them to be without heat - especially while possibly ill. After a quick check this morning I'm thinking Dash is headed down the same road. I suppose I shouldn't be horribly surprised as they're from the same breeder.

The pluses are this: I know they're hydrated and eating because they're still pooping and peeing like crazy. I also have seen them both eating the last two days. They're both still active and have their eyes open and not sunken in.

The minuses: both seem really light. I know for sure Dot has lost weight but need to get a weight on Dash. Dot's shell is really soft and starting to look almost translucent on the bottom. Dash's seems slightly less firm today as well.

I'm not giving up but I am really worried I'll be losing them both before much longer. I'm still not able to have them outdoors because of a very odd and chilly storm. It should be back in the 90's this weekend and they'll get time outside then. I don't want to risk chilling them on top of whatever else is going on.

 

[wellington]

Maybe try soaking them with some puréed baby food carrots and some pedialite in the water. Don't risk getting them chilled, but do get them in the sun when it warms. Don't let them get over heated though. Little ones can get overheated fast. Be sure there is lots of shade and even filtered sun through plants, etc will help.

 

[cassieopia]

How are Dot and Dash doing?

 

[dmmj]

I would do bird vitamins in there soaking water babies baby food your soaks and if you can get some liquid calcium for them. I don't want to sound mean but don't spend a lot of money money will not help them time and luck basically is the only thing

 

[UnicornSploosh]

They are still much the same. Dot seems a little weaker to me the last 24 hours or so. I have plans on them spending some time outdoors today and tomorrow. I'm hoping the fresh air and sunshine will perk them up a little bit.

I've been using a food processor to chop up their hay, grass, leaves and flowers and mixing that with mazuri and reptile vitamins. I also have tried the baby food in their soaks. I think we're just on a wait and see thing now.

 

[wellington]

You can also add piedialyte to the soaks along with the babyfood.

 

[UnicornSploosh]

I will try that. I'll pick some up on the way home as I plan on soaking them before and after their outdoor adventures.

 

[pete55]

Hi there. So sorry to read that your baby ill and hope it pulls round. Just a thought but have you had the stools screened for protazoan infection. My friend had similar problems with a Mediterranean tortoise. The result was a protozoan infection that responed to treatment. May not be the case with you but thought its worth a mention.

Best of luck to you.

 

[UnicornSploosh]

Despite my best efforts things are not going well for Dot and Dash. They'll drink the water they soak in and I've been putting baby food in it for them. They move around a little bit but not much anymore. On yesterday's outdoor excursion Dot pretty well just sat in the grass not moving. Dash moved around some. Dash's shell is getting softer now too. They both continue to lose weight and Dot's shell seems soft on top now as well.

At this point I'm fairly sure I'm going to lose them both. We're still trying really hard to not have that be the case but they don't seem to respond to much.