Double-Clutching

[NoScutesAboutIt]

Who knows/uses this technique?

It can be done, if done correctly. (example: prep & timing) It might even be harmful short/long term for the animal, I don't know. I've never done this myself, so I can't say that I back it or not. And I'm not a seller/breeder.
So at most, if at all, should only be practiced every so years, giving time inbetween, I'd say.

It's likely possible with all animals who are able to store their sperm over each season..

 

[TammyJ]

I am only replying to this because nobody else has so far and because I have no idea what double clutching is...

 

[Yvonne G]

I doubt very much if one could 'force' a female to lay a clutch of eggs. I've had tortoises for over 60 years and my tortoises and box turtles only ever laid one clutch a year.

 

[zovick]

Who knows/uses this technique?

It can be done, if done correctly. (example: prep & timing) It might even be harmful short/long term for the animal, I don't know. I've never done this myself, so I can't say that I back it or not. And I'm not a seller/breeder.
So at most, if at all, should only be practiced every so years, giving time inbetween, I'd say.

It's likely possible with all animals who are able to store their sperm over each season..

Double clutching is not a "technique" per se which can be implemented at will by the animal's owner, but is rather an event which may or may not occur depending upon the health and condition of the female tortoise in question.

 

[DoubleD1996!]

My females will lay two to three, sometimes four clutches without intervention. It's what they do naturally depending on the females age and size.

One female laid one clutch this year, one female didn't lay any, and one laid three

 

[NoScutesAboutIt]

I doubt very much if one could 'force' a female to lay a clutch of eggs. I've had tortoises for over 60 years and my tortoises and box turtles only ever laid one clutch a year.

I will say no more about the topic, then...since I don't really promote it myself. (But we're not talking in normal terms.)
Again: It's possible.

 

[NoScutesAboutIt]

Double clutching is not a "technique" per se which can be implemented at will by the animal's owner, but is rather an event which may or may not occur depending upon the health and condition of the female tortoise in question.

You don't get it, but that's OK.
I will say no more about the topic...since I don't really promote it myself. (But we're not talking in normal terms.)
Again: It's possible.

 

[TammyJ]

Wow. Curiouser and curiouser.

 

[Fluffy]

You don't get it, but that's OK.
I will say no more about the topic...since I don't really promote it myself. (But we're not talking in normal terms.)
Again: It's possible.

I've heard of this with birds but never a tortoise. Please explain more about your experience with this.

 

[TammyJ]

My females will lay two to three, sometimes four clutches without intervention. It's what they do naturally depending on the females age and size.

One female laid one clutch this year, one female didn't lay any, and one laid three

Triple clutching... awesome !

 

[zovick]

You don't get it, but that's OK.
I will say no more about the topic...since I don't really promote it myself. (But we're not talking in normal terms.)
Again: It's possible.

After 60+ years of keeping all kinds of reptiles including turtles and tortoises, I would love to be enlightened about that which you claim to know that I "don't get". Please elaborate.

Your statements on this forum seem to be particularly obtuse. Please tell me how it is possible to "force" a tortoise to lay more clutches of eggs.

 

[NoScutesAboutIt]

"Obtuse" was my nickname in high school.
Seriously, though.
--I'm not talking your tortoises.
Again, it's probably possible with those, too.
..The ones which can/do retain sperm from season to season.

 

[NoScutesAboutIt]

I care to share no more.
I would have deleted this post/thread by now if I was able to.

-Wrong discussion. Wrong people.

 

[Yvonne G]

I had occasion to visit with a very knowledgeable tortoise keeper this past week end, Will Espenshade, and his insight on double clutching was informative. He said it's species related. For example, sulcatas have two or three clutches a year, pancakes lay one egg then another in a certain number of days, he said radiata may lay two clutches a year. He said storing sperm has to do with fertility, and not with egg laying.

So I guess to answer your concerns, you should always provide calcium rich food to egg laying females whether or not they lay more than one clutch. And MY take on it is double clutches is up to the tortoise, not the keeper.

 

[zovick]

"Obtuse" was my nickname in high school.
Seriously, though.
--I'm not talking your tortoises.
Again, it's probably possible with those, too.
..The ones which can/do retain sperm from season to season.

Yes, lots of tortoises do lay multiple clutches in a single year. My point is/was that the animals cannot be "made" to do so by their owners. The phenomenon is not controllable by humans. If the eggs aren't there, you can't make them lay any. And by the same token, if they are there, you can't stop them from laying them.

Thanks a bunch for a really informative discussion. NOT!!!

Why delete this super educational thread? Are you concerned that it shows that your posts have made absolutely no sense?

 

[Markw84]

Many of our Galapagos lay more than one clutch in a year. Some will lay three clutches in the laying season. With good conditions and good diet I would say 2 is pretty normal.

My Burmese almost always lay more than one clutch. 3 clutches is average for my females with one female having laid 5 clutches in a year.

The radiata also often double and even triple clutch.

Our spotted turtles normally double or triple clutch. As do the cooters, painted and maps. The Kinosternon and the Actinemys are very secretive when laying so not sure who is doing what there!

All considering, my experience is double clutching is not just possible, but quite normal.

 

[zovick]

Many of our Galapagos lay more than one clutch in a year. Some will lay three clutches in the laying season. With good conditions and good diet I would say 2 is pretty normal.

My Burmese almost always lay more than one clutch. 3 clutches is average for my females with one female having laid 5 clutches in a year.

The radiata also often double and even triple clutch.

Our spotted turtles normally double or triple clutch. As do the cooters, painted and maps. The Kinosternon and the Actinemys are very secretive when laying so not sure who is doing what there!

All considering, my experience is double clutching is not just possible, but quite normal.

Your statements above have been my observations as well, Mark.

If you read post #1, it appears that the OP is implying/saying that the double clutching can be somehow "initiated" by human manipulation and that he is against it. I have been trying to communicate to him that multiple clutch production is not something that the owner can control.

He has insulted both me and Yvonne a couple of times for our statements saying it is not a controllable phenomenon, yet refuses to post his reasoning.

 

[Fluffy]

Your statements above have been my observations as well, Mark.

If you read post #1, it appears that the OP is implying/saying that the double clutching can be somehow "initiated" by human manipulation and that he is against it. I have been trying to communicate to him that multiple clutch production is not something that the owner can control.

He has insulted both me and Yvonne a couple of times for our statements saying it is not a controllable phenomenon, yet refuses to post his reasoning.

I may have totally misunderstood his claim but, I thought he was referring to the practice of removing the eggs from the nest to get them to lay replacement eggs. I know this has been done with birds. Particularly the California Condor. I understand that this works because birds actually raise their young. Once the tortoise or turtle lays it's eggs it leaves. This is why I was confused. He refused to elaborate any further so I guess we'll never know.