Dry vs Humid on Facebook

[krh11b23]

This is a post from a guy on Facebook who argues against high humidity. Sad some people are still putting out wrong out dated information. When I try and help someone out who's tort is pyramiding. This guy is always on there arguing against high humidity. I've shown him numerous pics. The funny thing is, after asking several times he refuses to post pictures of his torts.

 

[krh11b23]

I also never once claimed to be an expert. In fact I simply posted Tom's hatchling care sheet, and stated it was written by a man named Tom and not me.

 

[DawnH]

What he says is true though and he proves it by not showing pics of his own torts. I love people like this (insert sarcasm font here!) It's like people who tell you what your sulcata should be doing but they don't have one. Or like the BEST parents in the world are the ones who have yet to have a child...lol

 

[krh11b23]

What he says is true though and he proves it by not showing pics of his own torts. I love people like this (insert sarcasm font here!) It's like people who tell you what your sulcata should be doing but they don't have one. Or like the BEST parents in the world are the ones who have yet to have a child...lol

Yeah I got a kick out of it. Sucks because when I try and help somebody out, he goes on arguing and more than likely confusing people.

 

[Levi the Leopard]

Try less talk and more visual.

Show some photos of your humid raised Sulcata and then instead of telling others what to do, tell then what YOU do.

People sometimes like to argue with you when they feel you are unqualified (based on their opinion) to give advice. But if you share YOUR routines, YOUR set up and photos of YOUR tortoise, they can't argue with you. They can take it or leave it.

Remember, pictures really are worth a thousand words.

 

[krh11b23]

This is one response he wrote

 

[ZEROPILOT]

He seems to be convinced that he is correct.
It doesn't look like he's just trying to argue.

 

[Tom]

Yeah I got a kick out of it. Sucks because when I try and help somebody out, he goes on arguing and more than likely confusing people.

HA! WELCOME TO MY WORLD!!!!!!!!

Sorry for shouting, but man did this guy hit the nail on the head. He has no idea he is proving YOUR point though...

 

[Tom]

He seems to be convinced that he is correct.
It doesn't look like he's just trying to argue.

He does believe he is correct. Why? Because every sulcata book, most vets (...who learned from reading said books), and most websites all parrot the old incorrect info. I can show you 3 different tortoise books that say hot and dry. None of them mentions the humid rainy season. None of them mentions tortoises living underground during weather that is hot and dry above ground. None of them can explain why all the captive tortoises are stunted and pyramided when grown following their advice. And NONE of them can explain why tortoises grown in humid climates like Florida look fantastic and grow at more normal rates.

I can hardly blame people like this for thinking the way they do, but I do blame them for shutting their eyes to thousands of examples of obvious proof and closing their minds to learning new things.

 

[Tom]

View attachment 137072
This is one response he wrote

This demonstrates this man's ignorance completely. I have never heard of one single breeder who tries to achieve accelerated growth rates in an effort to get more money. This is stupid. Money oriented breeders just want to move the babies out the door as fast as possible. People are buying a baby in most cases. They don't care if the baby is 2.5 or 2.6 inches.

If they were trying to make them grow faster, they would have to hold on to them longer, which they do not want to do.

While starting them dry and deprived of water and humidity does stunt their growth and slow them way down, starting them hydrated and humid does NOT make them grow "fast". They just grow at a normal healthy rate. Fast growth is not the goal. A healthy tortoise is the goal. Dry, desiccated, stunted tortoises should never be the goal. I have never cared how fast any of my tortoises grow. I care how healthy they grow.

His claims of health problems are fabricated too. If what he said was accurate then I would have all sorts of problems with the hundreds of babies that I have started and raised this way. How come I don't see any skin, shell or respiratory problems? Surely if what he says is true, a guy who has used these humid methods literally hundreds if times with multiple species would have seen at least ONE of these problems somwhere along the way, right? Well, I have not. NOT ONE SINGLE TIME.

All these people who want to knock what we promote here have to grasp at straws, make stuff up, use all sorts of scare tactics, etc..., but they just can't argue with pic after pic after pic of smooth, healthy tortoises. I think Heather's method is the way to go. Her thought process there is why I started "he End of Pyramiding" thread. I have challenged every single naysayer to "put up or shut up", and not a single on has taken me up on the challenge. I keep putting up anyway.

All we can do is keep trying and lead by example.

 

[DawnH]

He does believe he is correct. Why? Because every sulcata book, most vets (...who learned from reading said books), and most websites all parrot the old incorrect info. I can show you 3 different tortoise books that say hot and dry. None of them mentions the humid rainy season. None of them mentions tortoises living underground during weather that is hot and dry above ground. None of them can explain why all the captive tortoises are stunted and pyramided when grown following their advice. And NONE of them can explain why tortoises grown in humid climates like Florida look fantastic and grow at more normal rates.

I can hardly blame people like this for thinking the way they do, but I do blame them for shutting their eyes to thousands of examples of obvious proof and closing their minds to learning new things.

This is very true. We are heading on a pretty long road trip and I have been researching books on Sulcata's to purchase/bring as reading material. Oh my gosh - they are so dated and horrible!! SOMEONE needs to write a new one. *nudging Tom*

 

[krh11b23]

Come to find out. This guys only experience is one 9 month old tort that is pyramided

 

[keepergale]

Come to find out. This guys only experience is one 9 month old tort that is pyramided

Well no wonder he is such an expert.

 

[Cowboy_Ken]

Come to find out. This guys only experience is one 9 month old tort that is pyramided

That is really too bad.

 

[Killerrookie]

So 9 months makes you a expert? So I'm more educated and also a expert to because I've had my torts for almost a year now... No. I was always told by my English teacher you're not a expert at anything yet till you have years of experience with it. I've had the torts I have for a year and I'm still learning a crap ton and I still consider myself a HUGE noobie. I think this guy is just making a huge fool of himself. Sucks that some people actually believe him and then come here to ask why their tort is in a really horrible condition. Tom you sir are one smart man because I've read the things you post everyday so I can be even better than what I am today and also Yvonne and other tortoise owners who had their tortoises for years and years. This is just the stuff I wanted to say on this thread because I kept thinking it all day haha.

 

[krh11b23]

This demonstrates this man's ignorance completely. I have never heard of one single breeder who tries to achieve accelerated growth rates in an effort to get more money. This is stupid. Money oriented breeders just want to move the babies out the door as fast as possible. People are buying a baby in most cases. They don't care if the baby is 2.5 or 2.6 inches.

If they were trying to make them grow faster, they would have to hold on to them longer, which they do not want to do.

While starting them dry and deprived of water and humidity does stunt their growth and slow them way down, starting them hydrated and humid does NOT make them grow "fast". They just grow at a normal healthy rate. Fast growth is not the goal. A healthy tortoise is the goal. Dry, desiccated, stunted tortoises should never be the goal. I have never cared how fast any of my tortoises grow. I care how healthy they grow.

His claims of health problems are fabricated too. If what he said was accurate then I would have all sorts of problems with the hundreds of babies that I have started and raised this way. How come I don't see any skin, shell or respiratory problems? Surely if what he says is true, a guy who has used these humid methods literally hundreds if times with multiple species would have seen at least ONE of these problems somwhere along the way, right? Well, I have not. NOT ONE SINGLE TIME.

All these people who want to knock what we promote here have to grasp at straws, make stuff up, use all sorts of scare tactics, etc..., but they just can't argue with pic after pic after pic of smooth, healthy tortoises. I think Heather's method is the way to go. Her thought process there is why I started "he End of Pyramiding" thread. I have challenged every single naysayer to "put up or shut up", and not a single on has taken me up on the challenge. I keep putting up anyway.

All we can do is keep trying and lead by example.

Yeah Tom you should write a book!