Food Ratings Idea

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Madkins007

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A recent post about 'going to the Whole Foods store' mentioned that the chain lists the nutritional values of foods as a total score out of 1000. Hy Vee stores lis the NuVal score of 1-100 of many of their foods (http://www.hy-vee.com/health/nuval/default.aspx).

So- why not create our own scoring system of tortoise foods so we can assign a number so when we are out shopping, we can carry a wallet card and quickly figure out what is good to serve and what we should avoid?

Josh suggested (in the Whole Foods thread) that we could rate nutrients on a -5 to +5 scale and then basically just add them up, which makes perfect sense. So...

1. What nutrients do we care about? I would say that we would start with things like:
- total calcium
- calcium/phosphorous ratio
- fiber
- protein
- net carbs (total carbs minus fiber)
- vitamins a, d, and E
- oxalates (and which database do we trust the most for this?)
- salt
- preservatives and chemicals
- added sugars and sweeteners
(the last few would lower the total score)

But what about things like iron, magnesium, vitamins B and C, etc. Do we make a 'catch all' category for the more minor nutrients?

2. Should everything count equally? The scores used by the chains supposedly use special logarithms and such. I can see counting some things more than others, and using some things, like added salt, as a way to reduce a score's subtotal.

3. Would there be a need or benefit in having different numbers for different species? I am thinking here of whether protein counts the same way for protein-tolerant species like Red-foots and for grassland species like Sulcatas.

I would bet that if we put our minds to it we could create a relatively easy system- maybe like a simple tax form- figure the baseline score, figure in bonus points that raise the score, then figure in 'hits' that reduce the score.

Once we get a simple working formula, then we could just all take a chunk of a nutrition database and crank out some numbers! The Official Tortoise Forums .Org "Tortoise Diet Nutrition Score"- ToNut for short (rhymes with 'donut')
 

Madkins007

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So far, I am playing with these ideas...

For 100 grams of food, figure the following...

CALCIUM: Round off to the nearest 10 mg, divide by 10, subtract 5
(128mg becomes 8 points, 34mg becomes -1 point)

Ca: P RATIO: State it so one side of the ratio is '1'. If the calcium number is bigger, use it as a positive number of points, if the phosphorus is, use it as a negative number of points. Multiply the points by 5 (which may be too much??)
(1:1 = 0 points, 2:1 = 10 points, 0.5:1 = 1:2 = -10 points.)

CARBS, FIBER, PROTEIN: Use the # of milligrams as the points values.

OXALATES: Multiply the mg by 10, round off, subtract from total score.
(0.3mg = -3 points, .68mg = -7 points)

With what I have so far, some common foods would score:
- Bell Peppers- -9
- Cabbage- 15
- Collard greens- 87
- Spinach- 4

I'm still working on...
1. How to figure calories? I want a way to remove calories from 'empty carbs'. Divide the calories by the carbs, maybe?

2. How to score vitamins and trace minerals? This would be easier if we had a baseline dosage recommendation.

3. My chart does not currently show fats and a lot of other stuff that probably should get figured in somehow.

4. Do the numbers so far reflect things accurately? I feel like bell peppers took too big a hit, and collards got too much benefit from their 14.5:1 Ca: P.

Any one have any ideas?
 

terryo

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Mark that's great, but if I had to do that, I wouldn't have a tortoise. Here's my idea....I go around and pick a bunch of dandelions...chop them up with a wide verity of veggies, fruit, and sometimes a little mazuri......dinner! Once a month a few pieces of protein sprinkled with calcium.....Any plants he want to munch on in his pen for more verity are OK too.
But.....if you make the list, I'm use it.
 

Stephanie Logan

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Maybe for us simple folk, you could divide all common tortoise foods into 4 categories, such as "highly nutritious", "nutrient dense, only small amounts needed/recommended", "mostly bulk/water", and "over-valued, feed more for your own satisfaction than for the tortoise's". :p
 

Josh

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I think you're onto something here... Could you simplify the vitamins/minerals down to just +1 or -1? If they really are trace, they shouldn't have too big of an impact...

CaP ratio does seem to hold too much weight as-is... maybe lessen the multiplier to 2? or 3?
 

bettinge

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I missed this thread the first time around. I really like the idea! I think your right on by comparing good and bad foods and seeing how "the score" is effected, and adjust weightings as necessary.

When I first got torts, I was constantly trying to create a top down value of foods.
 

Madkins007

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Status report: I am reformating my nutrition chart to make it easier to add new items, update items, and compare things. I am trying to figure out the best format. program, or site to use to make it sharable, but that is a lower priority.
 
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