Hermann's with my other pets . . .

LeBeauMonde

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I have a Hermann's in an indoor enclosure with an open roof. My house has a ferret that is never allowed in the same room. However a cat will be joining the household this weekend and a puppy withing a couple of months.
The enclosure is raised up about two feet off the ground, but obviously not enough to keep out a dog or cat that really wanted in.
I have a friend who assures me that the puppy can be trained to avoid the enclosue entirely, but I want more advice for the coming of the cat and puppy. It will be next to impossible to not allow the puppy access to the room of the tortoise as it is the room that leads to the yard.
Any advice or help would be appreciated!
 

lisa127

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I would not trust even the most well trained dog to have access to the tortoise. As for the cat, my experience has been that they will more likely use the enclosure/substrate as a litterbox than harm the tortoise. Dogs on the other hand will see the tortoise as a chew toy. Again even a well trained dog should not have access to a tortoise unsupervised. Can you make a lid for the enclosure?
 

Nolan1992

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I have a Hermann's in an indoor enclosure with an open roof. My house has a ferret that is never allowed in the same room. However a cat will be joining the household this weekend and a puppy withing a couple of months.
The enclosure is raised up about two feet off the ground, but obviously not enough to keep out a dog or cat that really wanted in.
I have a friend who assures me that the puppy can be trained to avoid the enclosue entirely, but I want more advice for the coming of the cat and puppy. It will be next to impossible to not allow the puppy access to the room of the tortoise as it is the room that leads to the yard.
Any advice or help would be appreciated!

Why can't it be elevated using a table or something? That would solve the problem for the dog at least.
 

Tom

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Why can't it be elevated using a table or something? That would solve the problem for the dog at least.
Well that depends on the dog and its level of determination and drive. I have dogs that can and have jumped 13' straight up from flat ground.

I think a better solution would be a large closed chamber. this will ensure that the tortoise is protected by a full physical barrier. It will also prevent the cat or ferret from knocking over heat lamps or using the enclosure as a litter box.

Like this: http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/closed-chambers.32333/
 

Kele7710

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My Hermanns is in a tortoise table at waist height, after 3 days of having Stanley my dog jumped up and stole him from tort table, luckily I walked in room just in time, another bite he would've been dead, after a massive vet bill and months of treatment Stanley made it, his shell will never be the same, but that makes him special, I learnt the hard and expensive way wouldn't wish that on any tort or person, we have now made a lid for tort table, Stanley is now safe from my very naughty dog :)
 
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Maggie Cummings

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Any experienced tortoise keeper will tell you that dogs and tortoises do not mix, ever. Tom is a very experienced dog trainer with a lot of tortoises and somewhere on this forum he has a thread about a dog eating his tortoise. And his dogs are extremely well trained.
I have numerous tortoises and 2 cats. One cat is 13 and the other is 5. The older one loves to soak her old bones under the UVB light in any of my habitats, but as soon as the tort moves Lil Roxie leaves. Neither cat has ever knocked over a light(sorry Tom) or used it as a littler box. Your danger comes from the dog.
 

LeBeauMonde

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Any experienced tortoise keeper will tell you that dogs and tortoises do not mix, ever. Tom is a very experienced dog trainer with a lot of tortoises and somewhere on this forum he has a thread about a dog eating his tortoise. And his dogs are extremely well trained.
I have numerous tortoises and 2 cats. One cat is 13 and the other is 5. The older one loves to soak her old bones under the UVB light in any of my habitats, but as soon as the tort moves Lil Roxie leaves. Neither cat has ever knocked over a light(sorry Tom) or used it as a littler box. Your danger comes from the dog.
So, you do not think I need to keep the cat out of my room? He is an older cat from an adoption, he supposedly is very friendly.
 

LeBeauMonde

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This is my current enclosure. It is my bottom bunk and I sleep above the tortoise. I cannot an entirely new enclosure, but perhaps I should close it off somehow?
 

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LeBeauMonde

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I would not trust even the most well trained dog to have access to the tortoise. As for the cat, my experience has been that they will more likely use the enclosure/substrate as a litterbox than harm the tortoise. Dogs on the other hand will see the tortoise as a chew toy. Again even a well trained dog should not have access to a tortoise unsupervised. Can you make a lid for the enclosure?
I attached a couple images in the thread - any ideas would be welcome!
 
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Maggie Cummings

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So, you do not think I need to keep the cat out of my room? He is an older cat from an adoption, he supposedly is very friendly.

Most cats don't care about the tortoises. I think your's would be the same...
 

Tom

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That's a pretty neat enclosure and what a great idea. At least with that set up, your other animals can't knock over a heat lamp and start a fire.

Yes. I would close it in. You could use black vinyl coated wire, which would look nicer than plain wire, or you could use plexi-glass or glass.

Here is the thread Maggie mentioned. It was not my tortoises or dogs, it was a friends. The mods changed the title too for some reason, but here it is:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/thread...ortoises-dogs-do-not-mix-no-exceptions.45850/
 
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Maggie Cummings

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This is my current enclosure. It is my bottom bunk and I sleep above the tortoise. I cannot an entirely new enclosure, but perhaps I should close it off somehow?
That's really clever! But, that small tortoise needs a smaller hide to feel more safe and secure. That light (hope it's a UVB) needs to be more like 12 inches away from the substrate. Add some plants and rocks n stuff so the tortoise can burrow under and walk over. You might just think about stapling some chicken wire over the whole thing so the new puppy can't get to the tortoise. That small a tort would be gone in 2 bites...Overall tho I like it. It's pretty innovative.
 

StarSapphire22

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I have 3 cats. If given the chance, they would most definitely swat/scratch him, if not more serious harm. One of my cats really wants in because of his weird obsession with dirt, but I've seen them watch him in his soaks and swat at the glass when he walks on the edges of his enclosure...I don't doubt they'd kill him if they could. Even the sweetest kitty has an incredible hunting drive. I wouldn't allow the cat access either. Not only is it unsanitary if "litterbox" issues arise, but all it takes is one swipe to lose an eye, sever an artery, or one bite to lose a limb or worse. It's just not good to risk it. Put a lid on the enclosure or keep the cat out.
 

Saleama

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The tortoise will eat cat poop so I would not let the cat think that is a place he can go to releave himself. It is pretty simple to train even an old cat new tricks so that shouldn't be a problem. Dogs can be trained as well but like children, they might let curiosity get the best of them when you are not around. Raise the enclosure so he never sees what is in there and put a top on it that he can not get into. Hang some bells off of the table so you can hear if there is an attempt at getting into it until Fido has been trained to keep out. I had a friend that had his dogs trained not to eat or chew anything unless they were given a verbal command to do so. We could offer their dogs steak and they would starve to death before eating it unless Joe or his Dad told them it was ok. So I know it can be done.
 
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Maggie Cummings

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That's a pretty neat enclosure and what a great idea. At least with that set up, your other animals can't knock over a heat lamp and start a fire.

Yes. I would close it in. You could use black vinyl coated wire, which would look nicer than plain wire, or you could use plexi-glass or glass.

Here is the thread Maggie mentioned. It was not my tortoises or dogs, it was a friends. The mods changed the title too for some reason, but here it is:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/thread...ortoises-dogs-do-not-mix-no-exceptions.45850/
Tom, thanks for the link, sorry I got the details wrong. I reread it just now and got shivers and goose bumps again. Terrible....
 
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Maggie Cummings

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I have 3 cats. If given the chance, they would most definitely swat/scratch him, if not more serious harm. One of my cats really wants in because of his weird obsession with dirt, but I've seen them watch him in his soaks and swat at the glass when he walks on the edges of his enclosure...I don't doubt they'd kill him if they could. Even the sweetest kitty has an incredible hunting drive. I wouldn't allow the cat access either. Not only is it unsanitary if "litterbox" issues arise, but all it takes is one swipe to lose an eye, sever an artery, or one bite to lose a limb or worse. It's just not good to risk it. Put a lid on the enclosure or keep the cat out.

I have had cats all my life and I am old as dirt. I have never seen or heard of any cat using a damp substrate as a litter box, especially if their own is clean. There's always something new to learn, and possibly because I don't believe in outside cats and always have inside cats mine and some others I know of are different. I know I can't trust my one cat around my birds, but neither really cares about my tortoises. I will remember what you have said, and make my comments about cats and tortoises more personal to my own...thanks for your input.
 

jaredherman

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I would be more carefull of the ferrett, mine figured out how to get on the kitchen counter so he could knock over cups. They are super smart.
 

StarSapphire22

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I have had cats all my life and I am old as dirt. I have never seen or heard of any cat using a damp substrate as a litter box, especially if their own is clean. There's always something new to learn, and possibly because I don't believe in outside cats and always have inside cats mine and some others I know of are different. I know I can't trust my one cat around my birds, but neither really cares about my tortoises. I will remember what you have said, and make my comments about cats and tortoises more personal to my own...thanks for your input.

I've never had the litterbox issue, but others have brought it up. My cats are all indoor but one was a feral rescue and he still retains some of his old habits (namely digging in dirt if he can).

I'm not saying there are aren't cats out there who don't give a crap about torts, for some people that's entirely true. But all it takes is a cat getting a little too curious one time for your tort to get seriously hurt. Why risk it?
 
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