Huge rock impaction TT-TT

[VeeSulTor]

Poor 3 & 1/2 year old baby girl began not eating nor pooping 2 weeks ago. Barium xray showed numerous rocks impaction as shown below. Vet suggested hospitalization for 3 days for $1240 or $2450 for 5 days. Prior to this recommendation, I spent $280 on initial consultation + vitaminA & D injection+3D SQ meloxica daily, $475 for barium xray + tube feeding (with nutrients and lactulose) done 2 days ago. Plus home remedies including various vegetable & fruits w/ warm soaks for 10 days. Nothing worked so far :-( She only tried probably under 5 ml of water every other day and zero solids intake going on 17 days now.The Vet recommends plastronotomy rather than prefemoral, which she's never done a plastronotomy in the past. She warned me about the only plastronotomy case she observed during her residency and the tor died of infection 2 years later. I made another appointment for my bb girl on Monday with a pretty reputable Vet. But just wondering what else I'm able to do at this point & if I should proceed with the surgical option. PLS ANYTHING HELPS AT THIS POINT! TY SOOOOOO MUCH!!!

 

[Tom]

Long soaks in a tall sided opaque tub usually get things moving. Car rides do it too. If you can get the tortoise to eat. Spineless opuntia pads have good lubrication properties. If these things all fail, surgery may be the only option. But I wouldn't want a first timer doing it on my animal. Find a vet that has done it before and knows what they are doing. The vitamin A &D injection tells me that your vet isn't experienced with tortoises and is reading from a manual or vet website.

What do you normally feed this tortoise? Any supplementation? How much and how often?

 

[VeeSulTor]

Thanks for the recommendation. Romaine lettuce has been 90% of her diet since I got her when she was 2 weeks old. I have to confess that my mom's been the primary care taker for her, and I didn't do much research abt avoiding small rocks or small anything within her reach. I found out she's been munching on my mom's succulent and cactuses plants which had lots of small rocks as decoration since beginning of this year. Other than that, she usually eats 3 times a day and poops once or twice daily. Thx again for the reply! I'm desperate at this point :-(

 

[Yvonne G]

All of those rocks should pass. Feed the tortoise wet food like cucumber, watermelon, aloe, etc. If you feel more comfortable going with the vet's advice, by all means, go that route, however, I would try the wet foods and long soaks first. You can also spread a layer of mineral oil over a leaf of romaine lettuce then roll it up into a tube and hand feed it to him. You can also draw some mineral oil up into a dropper and squirt it up into his cloaca, but DO NOT PUT MINERAL OIL ALL BY ITSELF INTO HIS MOUTH! He might breathe it into his lungs.

Eating mainly romaine lettuce in the past has caused the tortoise to have a mineral imbalance and that made him resort to rock eating to try to reverse that imbalance.

 

[VeeSulTor]

Oh no wonder. I tried to feed her cucumbers, carrot slices, bananas, strawberries in the past week but she wouldn't even open her mouth. I got very little banana onto her mouth and she wouldn't lick it even. I read that banana could rot their mouths so I wiped it clean afterwards. I will try dropping some mineral oil in her warm bath & see if that'll work. I thought the big chunk was too big inside of her which was the reason for all this impaction. You think there's chance that the big one will be able to pass? She's on 1.3 kg btw :-(

 

[Tom]

Oh no wonder. I tried to feed her cucumbers, carrot slices, bananas, strawberries in the past week but she wouldn't even open her mouth. I got very little banana onto her mouth and she wouldn't lick it even. I read that banana could rot their mouths so I wiped it clean afterwards. I will try dropping some mineral oil in her warm bath & see if that'll work. I thought the big chunk was too big inside of her which was the reason for all this impaction. You think there's chance that the big one will be able to pass? She's on 1.3 kg btw :-(

Incorrect diet is the typical cause of this problem. If your tortoise survives, you'll need to start feeding it a much better diet. Romaine is not a good tortoise food. It doesn't meet their needs in many ways. They should never be fed bananas, strawberries, or any other fruit. Cucumber and carrot are not toxic, but they aren't good foods either. Grasses, weeds, leaves, flowers and succulents of the right type, are what you should be feeding your tortoise. When they get bigger, grass hay and spineless opuntia pads are mainstays that are easy to provide.

In the meantime, get some "MinerAll" from Sticky Tongue Farms to help correct the mineral imbalance that is causing the rock eating.

Read these for more info:
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/for-those-who-have-a-young-sulcata.76744/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
https://tortoiseforum.org/threads/how-to-raise-a-healthy-sulcata-or-leopard-version-2-0.79895/

 

[Yvonne G]

Oh no wonder. I tried to feed her cucumbers, carrot slices, bananas, strawberries in the past week but she wouldn't even open her mouth. I got very little banana onto her mouth and she wouldn't lick it even. I read that banana could rot their mouths so I wiped it clean afterwards. I will try dropping some mineral oil in her warm bath & see if that'll work. I thought the big chunk was too big inside of her which was the reason for all this impaction. You think there's chance that the big one will be able to pass? She's on 1.3 kg btw :-(

Don't waste your time. Mineral oil in the bath will do nothing to help the tortoise.

 

[VeeSulTor]

I was reluctant to try it. I'm worried about what if it actually helped the stone pass but not fully pass. Can't imagine the how amount of pain that would bring her. The new Vet's appointment is tmr am, I'll hold off on supportive measures for now until advised otherwise. Thank you for the reply!

 

[Yvonne G]

I was reluctant to try it. I'm worried about what if it actually helped the stone pass but not fully pass. Can't imagine the how amount of pain that would bring her. The new Vet's appointment is tmr am, I'll hold off on supportive measures for now until advised otherwise. Thank you for the reply!

Please understand, I operated a turtle and tortoise rescue for 20 years or so. I took in all manner of sick and injured turtles and tortoises. The mineral oil and feeding methods I gave you in post #4 come from my own personal experience in handling tortoises with stone impaction. If I didn't know that it worked, I wouldn't have offered it to you.

 

[VeeSulTor]

With all due respect, I'm a healthcare provider myself for 13 years now. I was afraid of all the air and stones would make her uncomfortable. She hasn't defecated for 18 days now, I'm so afraid of perforation. If you don't mind, can you please share some of the post op care tips & recovery time? Truly appreciate your expertise!

 

[Yvonne G]

The mineral oil coats the inside of the digestive tract, making it easier for the stones to slip past and out. Once they start passing the rocks it takes several bowel movements to get rid of them all. Sometimes a couple weeks. So I keep feeding the mineral oil/romaine leaf burrito daily for a couple weeks. You'll know when all the rocks have passed because the tortoise gets his appetite back.

 

[VeeSulTor]

So she's been refusing to eat for the entire 2 weeks regardless of what I fed her i.e. lettuce, cumcumber, tomatoes, etc. Can I just add mineral oil to her warm soak bath? From your experience, sth this big is able to pass? She's 3 years old but only wts 1.3kg. Anyhow, will get to the mineral oil ASAP. Thank you so much!

 

[Blackdog1714]

Google gives you a whole host of reasons why humans should. In smaller doses many human medications work wonderfully in animals- take Benadryl for dogs. I have been a member for just under a year and placed my faith in the massive amount of years of experience that call TFO home. While not the end all be all I would be hard pressed to find smarter and more caring persons than on here. Just please make sure the Vet is Herp qualified and I wish you and your Tort the best of luck!

 

[VeeSulTor]

Got 2nd opinion today, way cheaper for everything they are abt to do. Pretty much 50% the cost compared to the 1st hospital. Left her there for anesthesia for esophagostomy, inhouse labs, tube feeding, & abx injection, and fluids. There's 50/50 chance that she might not need surgery. I remember sb mentioned that Vit injection isn't recommended for Sulcata (other tortoises ok, but not in Sulcatas) & this was confirmed by the Vet today. Plus, for 100 dollars physical exam, the 1sr Vet didn't do any of the physical assessments like the way today's Vet did for 50 bux, which made me wonder if there's problem with competency & their exotic animal specialists :-( Anyways, SHE'S IN GOOD HANDS NOW!!!

 

[Nujie]

How did everything work out? Is she ok now?