Is he sick or grumpy?

[timmy_tortoise]

Hi,
I've been concerned about my Horsefield tortoise. He's been sleeping in the corner of his enclosure all day everyday and only eating when woken up. He did the same thing last summer but perked up by the winter so I thought that it might be brumation related. However, it's getting colder again and he's still the same as he was this summer. Over the summer, he'd walk around and be active if I put him on the garden to play, but immediately went back to sleep when put back in his enclosure. I can't put him out anymore now that it's almost winter. I was concerned that he might be sick, but he perked up this time last year... is he just grumpy? Am I doing something wrong? I know that his beak/ claws could do with a trim but none of the vets I contacted got back to me and I'm too scared of hurting him to do it myself. Could this be related?

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

This might still be brumation related.

How are his temps in his enclosure?
How many hours per day do you have the heating and lighting on?
Do you provide UVB?
Do you have ambient lighting for him?

 

[wellington]

It sounds pretty normal. If you don't brumate him, then you need to keep his enclosure brightly lighted for 12-14 hours a day. Also keep night temps a little warmer, 70F.
Nails of tortoises usually don't need trimming but beaks do.
Post a pic of both and we can tell you if they do need some work. However, if they do, you either have to find a vet that can do it or you will have to do it. You can't just let it go.

 

[timmy_tortoise]

This might still be brumation related.

How are his temps in his enclosure?
How many hours per day do you have the heating and lighting on?
Do you provide UVB?
Do you have ambient lighting for him?

Thanks for your reply! I'm not sure of the answer to most of those questions yet (currently at uni so family is taking care of him) but I'll be sure o find out and get back to you ASAP. The lighting is usually on for 12 hours a day I believe, but I'll check that.

 

[timmy_tortoise]

It sounds pretty normal. If you don't brumate him, then you need to keep his enclosure brightly lighted for 12-14 hours a day. Also keep night temps a little warmer, 70F.
Nails of tortoises usually don't need trimming but beaks do.
Post a pic of both and we can tell you if they do need some work. However, if they do, you either have to find a vet that can do it or you will have to do it. You can't just let it go.

Thanks for your reply, I'm glad you said that it's probably normal! He did have a thermometer in his enclosure but he kept pulling it down.. I'll get him a new one! Pics of him attached from a couple of months ago when he let me get a good look of him. If I was going to trim his beak myself, how would I do it without hurting him/ cutting too much of/ keep his head in place? We've been feeding him grated carrot and cuttlefish in the hopes that'll help.

 

[wellington]

Nails look fine from what I can tell in the pic.
Beak needs a little trimming.
When I rescued my Russian and needed to trim the beak, I got him to bite down of a long metal skewer. He couldn't break it and because it was long, he couldn't pull his head in. I used toe nail clippers and took off just a little at a time. You can try a file and file it or a Dremel sanding wheel.
Then be sure to feed him on a flat rock or piece of tuff tile. Lay the food out flat on the rock, not in a pile. Grazing naturally helps to keep it filed down too.

 

[timmy_tortoise]

Nails look fine from what I can tell in the pic.
Beak needs a little trimming.
When I rescued my Russian and needed to trim the beak, I got him to bite down of a long metal skewer. He couldn't break it and because it was long, he couldn't pull his head in. I used toe nail clippers and took off just a little at a time. You can try a file and file it or a Dremel sanding wheel.
Then be sure to feed him on a flat rock or piece of tuff tile. Lay the food out flat on the rock, not in a pile. Grazing naturally helps to keep it filed down too.

Thanks for your help! Is it likely to hurt him if it's my first time trying it? I don't want to do something wrong and end up making things worse

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Thanks for your help! Is it likely to hurt him if it's my first time trying it? I don't want to do something wrong and end up making things worse

Using an emery board (nail file) is the safest option (not very effective but you don't need to trim much). If you manage to catch his head and stay calm and work quickly and accurately you won't hurt him.

Some tortoises are more calm when you wrap them in a towel. To catch the head - push his back legs in the shell and catch the head with index finger and thumb right behind his "ears". You may ask someone to help and hold the tortoise. Their neck muscles are surprisingly strong - you need a good grip.

 

[wellington]

Using an emery board (nail file) is the safest option (not very effective but you don't need to trim much). If you manage to catch his head and stay calm and work quickly and accurately you won't hurt him.

Some tortoises are more calm when you wrap them in a towel. To catch the head - push his back legs in the shell and catch the head with index finger and thumb right behind his "ears". You may ask someone to help and hold the tortoise. Their neck muscles are surprisingly strong - you need a good grip.

This way of getting the head to stay out can work but is harder in my opinion than it sounds. You also have to be careful not too squeeze to hard.

 

[wellington]

Thanks for your help! Is it likely to hurt him if it's my first time trying it? I don't want to do something wrong and end up making things worse

No, it shouldn't hurt him. Just file or snip a little at a time. You can go it a little each time over a couple days or so if you want.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Hello!

If you can answer these questions once you’re back from uni we can definitely help advising on set up etc! And might help us understand why he’s behaving how he is

What are your temperatures like? Ie basking temp(directly under the bulb), overall day temps, night temps?
What kind of basking bulb are you using specifically? Packaging photos are good if you have any
What’s your indoor uv type?
How’s humidity reading?
What kind of substrate?

A photo of the set up would be wonderful when you’re able! Welcome to the forum!!

 

[timmy_tortoise]

This might still be brumation related.

How are his temps in his enclosure?
How many hours per day do you have the heating and lighting on?
Do you provide UVB?
Do you have ambient lighting for him?

Just heard back, it's a yes to UVB and ambient lighting

 

[timmy_tortoise]

No, it shouldn't hurt him. Just file or snip a little at a time. You can go it a little each time over a couple days or so if you want.

Thanks for your help! Is there such thing as trimming too much off?

 

[timmy_tortoise]

Hello!

If you can answer these questions once you’re back from uni we can definitely help advising on set up etc! And might help us understand why he’s behaving how he is

What are your temperatures like? Ie basking temp(directly under the bulb), overall day temps, night temps?
What kind of basking bulb are you using specifically? Packaging photos are good if you have any
What’s your indoor uv type?
How’s humidity reading?
What kind of substrate?

A photo of the set up would be wonderful when you’re able! Welcome to the forum!!

Hi, thanks for your reply! I'm not sure of the exact temps because he broke his thermometer, but I'll try and find out I'll get back to you about the other questions too- I don't know the name of his substrate off the top of my head but it's chippings rather than soil, and he has Timothy Hay in the cooler part of his enclosure. I have a photo of his setup that I'll post here (the cooler part usually has a closed lid on)

 

[timmy_tortoise]

Thanks for your help! Will it hurt him

Using an emery board (nail file) is the safest option (not very effective but you don't need to trim much). If you manage to catch his head and stay calm and work quickly and accurately you won't hurt him.

Some tortoises are more calm when you wrap them in a towel. To catch the head - push his back legs in the shell and catch the head with index finger and thumb right behind his "ears". You may ask someone to help and hold the tortoise. Their neck muscles are surprisingly strong - you need a good grip.

if I grip his head too hard?

 

[wellington]

Thanks for your help! Is there such thing as trimming too much off?

Yes

 

[wellington]

That enclosure is all wrong. No hay/straw as a substrate, needs to be coconut coir or orchid/fir bark.
The enclosure is way too small, needs a minimum of a 4x8 foot
Clay saucer water dish big enough he can get in it.
Incandescent flood bulb for basking, tube flourescent for uvb, 30-50% humidity for an adult.

 

[timmy_tortoise]

Hello!

If you can answer these questions once you’re back from uni we can definitely help advising on set up etc! And might help us understand why he’s behaving how he is

What are your temperatures like? Ie basking temp(directly under the bulb), overall day temps, night temps?
What kind of basking bulb are you using specifically? Packaging photos are good if you have any
What’s your indoor uv type?
How’s humidity reading?
What kind of substrate?

A photo of the set up would be wonderful when you’re able! Welcome to the forum!!

Photos of the substrate and bulb attached

 

[timmy_tortoise]

That enclosure is all wrong. No hay/straw as a substrate, needs to be coconut coir or orchid/fir bark.
The enclosure is way too small, needs a minimum of a 4x8 foot
Clay saucer water dish big enough he can get in it.
Incandescent flood bulb for basking, tube flourescent for uvb, 30-50% humidity for an adult.

Maybe I wasn't clear, sorry! He has straw to hide in inside his shaded area but he has the bark type stuff as well (image on another reply). He does fit in his water dish, but I can definitely get him a new one if you think he'd like a bigger one

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Hi, thanks for your reply! I'm not sure of the exact temps because he broke his thermometer, but I'll try and find out I'll get back to you about the other questions too- I don't know the name of his substrate off the top of my head but it's chippings rather than soil, and he has Timothy Hay in the cooler part of his enclosure. I have a photo of his setup that I'll post here (the cooler part usually has a closed lid on)

Thanks for getting back to us! There are some things of note I hope you don’t mind me mentioning, I hate for you to run into problems!

First up sizing, for an adult this is far to small a space to spend any significant amount of time in unfortunately, this can eventually come with its own health issues if he doesn’t have enough roaming room.

For substrate, hemp will mould when maintaining any kind of humidity, I’d also strongly suggest removing the hay, you don’t want him accidentally eating long dry strands like that, they aren’t grass eaters, the hay will also mould when you maintain humidity.

Photos of the substrate and bulb attached

The bulb does definitely need changing when you’re able, those all in one uv bulbs aren’t the safest or most efficient option unfortunately.

I think you’ll find this housing thread I made useful! it covers correct equipment(lighting, heating, uv), levels, sizing, appropriately maintaining humidity, substrates, there’s lots of visual examples for everything and a really handy diet link to check out!

Housing adult Russian and Hermans indoors

Hello there! In this thread I’m going to include some information an example of an appropriate indoor set up for an older Herman/russian. As much as it’s encouraged to have tortoises in a safe outdoor enclosure, I understand being from the uk myself, that some climates make it difficult to...

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This one includes some indoor adult set ups

Enclosure inspiration

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Lastly, this one is also really good to familiarise yourself with, it’ll help you avoid the wrong bulbs, substrates, housing etc, I always encourage double checking purchases on the forum too before buying

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I hope they help! Give them all a read and please come back with any further questions!