Need advice (egg question)

[ben awes]

Sometimes yes. Not always. Weighing her regularly will help you know. Always make sure she has plenty of calcium in case.

I never found that weighing my female ever told me if she had eggs or not. She honestly could easily poop far more than eggs weigh in one sitting. She could also drink 2 pounds of water. I would not go by weight.

 

[Jodie]

I never found that weighing my female ever told me if she had eggs or not. She honestly could easily poop far more than eggs weigh in one sitting. She could also drink 2 pounds of water. I would not go by weight.

Oh that sucks. I had heard this worked.

 

[ben awes]

I hope there will be more. Would love any tips you have. She will be outside summer. I just got her in September and the vet thinks she had calcium deficiency, and soft eggs before i got her. She did try to lay inside but her uterus ripped because they were broken and wouldn't pass.
Any tips for future prevention of this would be greatly appreciated. Thank you @ben awes!

Hi Jodi - I hope she's still doing well! The following comments are just my humble opinion - you will have to decide what works for you and your torts.

I raised both my P. Pardalis Leopard breeders from 3 months. My female laid her first clutch at 7 years old and laid 4-6 clutches per year once she got going. She laid one clutch a month like clockwork - and every clutch was laid indoors. I started worrying about eggs when she was about 5 years and I built a 4'x4' "addition" onto her enclosure that had a 12" base of dirt/sand mix. I covered the whole thing with plywood and waited for her to do her thing. The rest of her enclosure is a plywood floor only - no bark, no nothing. Much easier to clean, stays dry, no rot, no nothing. I tried a bunch of substrates and finally said forget it - and my torts were happy and VERY healthy. Anyway, two years later I walked in and found one egg on the plywood floor. I freaked out and uncovered the dirt and set her in there and she marched right out over to the plywood floor. She clearly was pacing around and was not behaving normally. I was very concerned with being egg bound. I moved her to the dirt a dozen time with the same result. Eventually i blocked off the way out and forced her to stay in the 4'x4' area. After a day she clearly wanted out and so I let her out and she marched right back to the plywood and started digging ON the plywood floor. My 11 year old son said "why don't you put dirt where she is digging" - brilliant! I cut a large hole in the plywood and sunk a huge plastic tub full of dirt and sand right where she was trying to dig. She avoided it for a while and tried to dig on the plywood floor nearby but i moved her over to the dirt and eventually she started to dig in the dirt - and once she got going she didn't stop until eggs were laid all safe and sound. she laid over 20 clutches in that same place. I have a few short video's on youtube you can find under aphrodite egg laying I think. She NEVER went to the dirt spot on her own. However the hole in the floor was the original place she picked and so something about it was good enough. Every time she would start to dig nearby and I would quietly/slowly walk up while she was digging (made sure she was literally digging when I picked her up) and would gently but direcltly move her the foot or two over to the dirt. this would cause her to pause her digging for a moment, but often she was enough in the zone that she would start up again. Many times she would just walk off the dirt over to the plywood 1 foot away and start digging there. Many times she would dig the nest all the way and then for some reason would walk away. Once she leaves a nest, she has to start all over again. Laying eggs indoors take a LOT of patience on the owners part too to be aware of her needs, moving her back to the digging spot multiple times. Funny how the place mattered more than the tactile sense of whatever she was on.

I am sure that there is a better way - like an entire enclosure with diggable ground - but even if you provide it they might not take to it. In my case I let her tell me where she wanted to dig and then I made it so she could dig there.

Lastly, my humble opinion on food. I believe strongly in tough love when it comes to food. From the day my hatchlings were born I offered only soaked and chopped orchard grass with a little bit of soaked maszuri mixed. Fresh greens are only a treat. I don't believe in a widely varied diet. in the wild they eat mostly grasses - that's what they are designed to eat. I do offer fresh every now for fun, and I do let them graze the yard for weeds in the warm months and I do chop in some cactus, but not as the base of their diet. And I never feed romaine. There is little in it for them except water. If you offer only orchard grass (small and soaked in water so it smells good, with some mazuri) she will eat it eventually. She won't kill herself waiting for the lettuce . I soak it as a primary way to get water, because I never kept a water dish in the enclosure with my leopards because they just make a damn mess. The first thing they do is poop in it. I gave them a long soaking every other day. It's never too late to change their diet. And, frankly, grass and mazuri is WAY easier and WAY cheaper than fresh. Might not be a good reason, but I am a realist when it comes to pets - if the task is a hassle, likely we'll get lazy and won't do it well. Much better to set up routine that is easy. I buy orchard grass by the 50lb bale from Oxbow and Mazuri by the 25 bag from Purina. easy peasy.

That's a very long winded response, and just one perspective. Others have more experience and knowledge, but that's what i've done and it's worked for me. My vet was always very impressed with the health of my breeders and the beauty of the babies. It's funny because I just had this food conversation with a woman who breeds parrots. The trend out there is to offer fresh fresh fresh veggies/fruit/greens - which she did for years, eventually she decided to stop and only offer seeds and nuts and parrot chow. within a few months her parrots were healthier than ever, her hatch rates doubled or tripled, and some other stuff. Not that parrots and torts are the same, but the closer we can get to their natural diet the better I think. And so far for leopards that seems to be good quality hays/grasses and mazuri (the new mix).

Take it or leave, and best of luck with your leopards!
Ben

 

[Jodie]

Thank you very much, Ben. That was very helpful. I really appreciate you taking the time to share.

 

[Jodie]

Scarlett is doing well. She is eating a better variety. I cut Timothy hay into very small pieces and mix it with finely chopped green. 3-4 different kinds. I am still using small amounts of romaine, but hay is close to 50 percent. She will only eat small amounts of Mazuri mixed in other stuff. She loved Mazuri before the surgery so this seems weird. She has very soft stools still, so really focusing on getting romaine out of the diet.

 

[Jodie]

She is definitely digging a nest. Sent an email to the vet. Was really hoping my drama with her was over. I have no idea if this is just left over urges even though the eggs are gone, or if she has developed more. No idea if she would be able to lay. Her uterus wouldn't be healed enough, I wouldn't think.

 

[Jodie]

No idea if anyone is reading this still, but hoping it will help someone in the future so here is an update. Scarlett last dug on Tuesday. We built a box/dirt bridge. Essentially it is a podium, like they would use in the Olympics for medalists. Instead of putting a top on each step though we filled it with Coir. She can walk over the top of it this way and has a box that is 14 inches deep on top. Anyway we added that Tuesday and it is now Saturday. Murphy's law says she won't dig anymore, but if she does at least I know she has someplace that should be good for a nest. We built it where she has dug the most. She is eating good and behaving normal. Becoming hopeful that the nesting was just left over urges.

 

[Yvonne G]

Thanks for the update.

 

[katfinlou]

Good to hear she's doing ok! Thanks for updating, have been thinking about her