New redfoot owner -- enclosure set up help

[ArtemisRedFoot]

Hi! I am new Red foot owner and was wondering if someone with more experience could look over my current setup and give me pointers. I just got him a week ago. I've been browsing the forums and have been trying to update it where I can but am nervous there is still so much more I could do. I have pictures attached.

- Substrate: Coconut coir with cypress mulch covering part of the setup. I also have a tupperware container with sphagnum moss on the hidden part of the enclosure.
- Decorations: One plastic plant that he loves to hide under for shade and has showed no interest in eating. Two water dishes, One on a ramp and another in a blue plate for extra humidity. I also have some small pieces of driftwood that are arriving soon to breakup the enclosure and make it more interesting for him.
- Lighting: Mercury vapor light around 16inches from the substrate. I keep on for 12hours a day and then turn off.
- Enclosure: Aituvin tortoise house (understand I will need to increase the size when he gets older and am hoping I can get a bigger set up for when I put him outside in the summer)
- Humidity: Moist coconut coir. Spray the enclosure with water twice a day. Two sources of water and Sphagnum moss corner.

Daily care:
- I am feeding him greens daily (spring mix lettuce and arugula) topped with T-rex tortoise supplement for added calcium, Fruit twice a week (so far has had blueberries and banana pieces) and then going to feed a protein once a week (currently have freeze dried crickets).
- Haven't started soaking him yet but considering starting this every other day or every 3 days.

I also recently got a Govee thermometer/hygrometer so I can better monitor mp ad humidity. I just added this today but I've attached a picture of the current readings.

Also should I add a basking rock to increase temps under basking light? Considering adding a heat lamp at night.

Any help would be appreciated! Thank you so much

 

[zolasmum]

Welcome - your little one looks very cute. However - please don't use spaghnum moss anywhere - it is often eaten by tortoises , and can swell up in their gut and cause impaction, as it is not digested - this can be fatal. I am not an expert on lighting, but I'm fairly sure that mercury vapour lamps are not ever a good idea.
Angie

 

[ArtemisRedFoot]

Welcome - your little one looks very cute. However - please don't use spaghnum moss anywhere - it is often eaten by tortoises , and can swell up in their gut and cause impaction, as it is not digested - this can be fatal. I am not an expert on lighting, but I'm fairly sure that mercury vapour lamps are not ever a good idea.
Angie

Hi! Thanks for your comment!

Ok, yea the sphagnum moss is easy enough to remove. I just saw some post saying it was helpful to increase moisture in the habitat and a lot of youtubers seem to add it to their enclosure. He hasn't showed interest in eating it, just likes to lay in that area. But I'll remove it to be safe.

I thought MVB was ok if I kept it far enough away from the tortoise and parallel to the substrate to not hurt his eyes. but I can look into changing that too. There's just so much conflicting info out there. Would you have any recommendations instead?

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Moss is really great to maintain humidity. But it's hard to keep it from tortoise' reach (when it dries the flakes are everywhere). So please remove it.

Moisture the substrate by pouring water in the corners. Spraying on top is not working well - dries to quickly and top wet surface might result in plastron (shell bottom) fungus. Redfoots are prone to this kind of problems.

MVB is good in theory. In practice UV output is not very predictable (level, spectrum and lifetime). Heat output is too drying for shell. And you cannot use at night to keep temperatures under control.

This ramped water dishes are told to be a flipping/drowning hazard. Cheap shallow terracota/clay saucer from garden shop will work better (sink it in substrate for easy climbing in and out). As a quick fix leave just the blue dish.

For Redfoots you need consistent humidity of 85+% and temperatures in 82-84F, all day round. This is double important for young tortoises. It is hard if at all possible to achieve without covering the enclosure. Some ways to do that: plexiglass sheet, aluminium foil, plastic container, portable greenhouse.

On lightning and heating:
1. For heating the enclosure you will need CHE (ceramic heat emitter). It must be used with a thermostat. I guess, your dome lamp maybe used to screw in CHE.
2. UVB lamp: flourescent tube, T5 HO (High Output) with fixture. Small lengths are fine. Suitable good lamps are Arcadia Forest 10% or Desert 12% (depends on mounting height, over the mesh or not) or ZooMed Reptisun 5.0 or 10.0. They should be run on timer for 3-4 hours a day.
3. Ambient light - something like a LED strip. Color temperature - "cold day light", around 6000-6500K. It should be running 13-14 hours a day.

And don't be too nervous. Step by step you'll tweak all the things. For the beginning, use this forum as a source of information. There are many really experienced people here.

If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.

 

[ArtemisRedFoot]

Moss is really great to maintain humidity. But it's hard to keep it from tortoise' reach (when it dries the flakes are everywhere). So please remove it.

Moisture the substrate by pouring water in the corners. Spraying on top is not working well - dries to quickly and top wet surface might result in plastron (shell bottom) fungus. Redfoots are prone to this kind of problems.

MVB is good in theory. In practice UV output is not very predictable (level, spectrum and lifetime). Heat output is too drying for shell. And you cannot use at night to keep temperatures under control.

This ramped water dishes are told to be a flipping/drowning hazard. Cheap shallow terracota/clay saucer from garden shop will work better (sink it in substrate for easy climbing in and out). As a quick fix leave just the blue dish.

For Redfoots you need consistent humidity of 85+% and temperatures in 82-84F, all day round. This is double important for young tortoises. It is hard if at all possible to achieve without covering the enclosure. Some ways to do that: plexiglass sheet, aluminium foil, plastic container, portable greenhouse.

On lightning and heating:
1. For heating the enclosure you will need CHE (ceramic heat emitter). It must be used with a thermostat. I guess, your dome lamp maybe used to screw in CHE.
2. UVB lamp: flourescent tube, T5 HO (High Output) with fixture. Small lengths are fine. Suitable good lamps are Arcadia Forest 10% or Desert 12% (depends on mounting height, over the mesh or not) or ZooMed Reptisun 5.0 or 10.0. They should be run on timer for 3-4 hours a day.
3. Ambient light - something like a LED strip. Color temperature - "cold day light", around 6000-6500K. It should be running 13-14 hours a day.

And don't be too nervous. Step by step you'll tweak all the things. For the beginning, use this forum as a source of information. There are many really experienced people here.

If you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.

Hi! Thanks for your overview! This is really helpful.

Some followup questions:
1. For covering my enclosure, how do I do this without blocking out the UV-B? Since UV-B can't penetrate glass.
2. I thought UVB needed to be on 10-12 hours a day to prevent metabolic bone disease vs. just the ambient temperature?

I'll change out my ramped dish and I've already removed the sphagnum moss. Looking into the heatlamps and changing out UV-B now

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

And a bit on daily routines:
1. Soak him daily, when he gets older, then you can switch to every other day and once a week.
2. Calcium supplements are needed once or twice a week. You can put a cuttlefish bone in the enclosure, so he can get calcium whenever he needs (and it helps to trim the beak).
3. Diet needs more variety. Add some kale, endive, chickory, mustard greens, romaine lettuce, bok choi, dandelions, plantain, squash.. Hibiscus, mulberry and young grape leaves, opuntia cactus pads - check ethnic grocery stores. They love mushrooms and some low-fat boiled meat (e.g. chicken breast). Fruits could be papaya, mango, prickly pear (opuntia once again), figs. Overall proportions are 40-60% fruits, 40-60% greens and veggies and 10-20% protein. You can vary the proportions and rotate foods week to week (no need to chop all of this in a daily plate). And you can give occasional treats (like a couple of cherry tomatoes, an iceberg lettuce leaf or a quarter of dragonfruit).

 

[SuzanneZ]

Yes, I own many mercury vapor bulbs that I stocked up on before I got to TF.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hi! Thanks for your overview! This is really helpful.

Some followup questions:
1. For covering my enclosure, how do I do this without blocking out the UV-B? Since UV-B can't penetrate glass.
2. I thought UVB needed to be on 10-12 hours a day to prevent metabolic bone disease vs. just the ambient temperature?

I'll change out my ramped dish and I've already removed the sphagnum moss. Looking into the heatlamps and changing out UV-B now

1. You are right, any common kind of cover would block UVB. So you need to put UVB light under the cover or cut a cover around the light fixture. Easiest ways to do this are alumium foil (cut around option) and greenhouse top (cover the lights option). I've used a big plastic container for a while in the past.
2. UVB is required to prevent MBD, that's right. UVB is needed for vitamin D3 synthesis, which is essential for calcium intake. However, 3-4 hours is enough (it mimics natural sunlight spectrum as well - high UVI is just several hours around midday). Also, redfoots are one of the species who have lower requirements for UVB.

 

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[Alex and the Redfoot]

Yes, I own many mercury vapor bulbs that I stocked up on before I got to TF.

Oh, yes. I have some useless bulbs and lamps as well Maybe I need another reptile to make use of them

 

[SinLA]

Please remove that water bowl right away - its a potential flipping and drowning hazard. Look at the link that zeropilot provided above it will give you lots of good information

 

[ArtemisRedFoot]

Please remove that water bowl right away - its a potential flipping and drowning hazard. Look at the link that zeropilot provided above it will give you lots of good information

Already removed! and have been reading over that link

 

[ArtemisRedFoot]

1. You are right, any common kind of cover would block UVB. So you need to put UVB light under the cover or cut a cover around the light fixture. Easiest ways to do this are alumium foil (cut around option) and greenhouse top (cover the lights option). I've used a big plastic container for a while in the past.
2. UVB is required to prevent MBD, that's right. UVB is needed for vitamin D3 synthesis, which is essential for calcium intake. However, 3-4 hours is enough (it mimics natural sunlight spectrum as well - high UVI is just several hours around midday). Also, redfoots are one of the species who have lower requirements for UVB.

Ok, this makes sense...looking into options for covering the enclosure. Will start with the aluminm foil to start and then looking up some green house covers on amazon. Considering just getting like a greenhouse film for more longterm.

Is this what you were thinking for UVB? https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08TPFRFNW/?tag=exoticpetnetw-20 ... Do I just set it right on the mesh? I found a timer I'll use too.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hm. Maybe it's the Amazon trick... But the link shows me E27 all-in-one heat lamp. It's definitely not the lamp we need.

Here is an example fixture (click through photos and sizes to get an idea how it looks like with lamp): https://www.chewy.com/zoo-med-reptisun-t5-ho-reptile/dp/345002 (the lamp itself is in "Bought together"). The shortest one of 13 inches is okay. This is another example: https://www.arcadiareptile.com/lighting/prot5/

I've checked enclosure height.... It is only 13 inches high, right? With 3-4 inches of substrate we have about 9-10 inches to mesh top from tortoise shell. ReptiSun 10.0 and Desert 12% lamps can't be placed directly on mesh as UV level would be unsafe with such height, you will need to hang the fixture or make some kind of stand on the mesh top (to achieve the distance between the lamp and tortoise carapace around 15-16 inches). Later, when lamp starts to fade out you can lower them. ReptiSun 5.0 and Forest 6% can be put just on the mesh top, however when they start to fade out you will have to move them under the mesh or replace the lamps.

 

[ArtemisRedFoot]

Hm. Maybe it's the Amazon trick... But the link shows me E27 all-in-one heat lamp. It's definitely not the lamp we need.

Here is an example fixture (click through photos and sizes to get an idea how it looks like with lamp): https://www.chewy.com/zoo-med-reptisun-t5-ho-reptile/dp/345002 (the lamp itself is in "Bought together"). The shortest one of 13 inches is okay. This is another example: https://www.arcadiareptile.com/lighting/prot5/

I've checked enclosure height.... It is only 13 inches high, right? With 3-4 inches of substrate we have about 9-10 inches to mesh top from tortoise shell. ReptiSun 10.0 and Desert 12% lamps can't be placed directly on mesh as UV level would be unsafe with such height, you will need to hang the fixture or make some kind of stand on the mesh top (to achieve the distance between the lamp and tortoise carapace around 15-16 inches). Later, when lamp starts to fade out you can lower them. ReptiSun 5.0 and Forest 6% can be put just on the mesh top, however when they start to fade out you will have to move them under the mesh or replace the lamps.

Hmmm might have been something wrong with Amazon...it was similar to what you sent on Chewy. But it came with a 5.0 light, sounds like a 10.0 is easier to manage with placing higher than the mesh.
I'm working on changing and ordering everything within this next week! I'll try to report back once I have a better setup
Thanks for all your help! 🤗

 

[mojo_1]

Hmmm might have been something wrong with Amazon...it was similar to what you sent on Chewy. But it came with a 5.0 light, sounds like a 10.0 is easier to manage with placing higher than the mesh.
I'm working on changing and ordering everything within this next week! I'll try to report back once I have a better setup
Thanks for all your help! 🤗

As someone who also started out with that tortoise table I recommend getting rid of it trust me on this it will be less headache for you to get a closed chamber enclosure. I purchased a 4x2x2 enclosure from Animal plastics but you can use a deep Rubbermaid tote in the meantime. I battled with the tortoise table for a few months and the little tort was unhappy and not feeling well till I made the switch to the new enclosure. There is people selling them on Facebook marketplace, if you buy a used one make sure to clean it very well with appropriate cleaning solution that's tortoise safe. Also lower your temperature/humidity sensor to the tortoises level so your getting the readings for the air the tortoise is living in shell height level is good.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

There were a few members here, who used custom hoods and greenhouse tops with a success to achieve proper humidity and temperatures with this type of enclosures. No doubt, that purpose-built closed chamber enclosure works much better. However, in the moment I think correct lightning and heating are more important.

Agree on thermometer/humidity sensor placement.

 

[ArtemisRedFoot]

As someone who also started out with that tortoise table I recommend getting rid of it trust me on this it will be less headache for you to get a closed chamber enclosure. I purchased a 4x2x2 enclosure from Animal plastics but you can use a deep Rubbermaid tote in the meantime. I battled with the tortoise table for a few months and the little tort was unhappy and not feeling well till I made the switch to the new enclosure. There is people selling them on Facebook marketplace, if you buy a used one make sure to clean it very well with appropriate cleaning solution that's tortoise safe. Also lower your temperature/humidity sensor to the tortoises level so your getting the readings for the air the tortoise is living in shell height level is good.

Ok am starting to look into the animal plastics enclosure. Will have to figure out humidity in the mean time and am working on changing temp and uvb in my current set up. How do you hang light fixtures in the animal plastics enclosures? I'll lower my temp and humidity sensor.

 

[mojo_1]

You attach them to the top with short screws. I also am using the Arcadia CHE bracket

 

[ArtemisRedFoot]

@mojo_1 : Thanks for taking pictures! This was really helpful I really like the look of your setup too. Will try to keep everyone updated as I continue to work on my own setup