Nigel has lost his appetite

[tortoisenerd]

What kind of food dish does he have? Maybe it needs to be larger, and in a corner, so he has to face into the corner to eat, and then reduce the tracking? I try to reduce how much food Trevor tracks around because he'll eat the food with the aspen on it. A piece every once in awhile is ok with me, but not on a regular basis. I have his slate tile (half a 12 inch by 12 inch for his 3 inch shell) on a wall. Haven't had to resort to the corner yet. I have it where I can view it best on the web cam, lol. We have lunch together a lot.

That's great Nigel ate! As far as his weight...do you think he might just be at a good weight for him? I could imagine some torts may not meet the "average" goal, even with a lot of food offered. Do you worry about him actually being underweight (in a bad way), or just under average?

 

[Meg90]

I have a tile in there, I think about 4x4 inches. I wanted to pick up a bigger one for him yesterday, but I ended up babysitting the whole day. I will def get a bigger one and try putting it in a corner so he can't walk all over his food

I am not sure about his weight...Nigel was my first tortoise. Anouk is a little piggy, and I can see gain in her every month, but Nigel came "light" and maybe you are right, and he is just under average.....

 

[tortoisenerd]

If you end up taking him to the vet you can ask their opinion. If he just doesn't want more to eat though, not much you can do about that. Does he look scrawny, or just show that way on paper? Right now Trevor looks to have some chub, but it depends how mush he has his head out and what way you look at him. Just an example that there are some variables in the equation. The larger tile sounds good! That's not even large enough for him to get his whole body on. Trevor seems to do well with the tile several times larger than him so he has space to push the food around. Helps with his nails too. The slate tiles are about $2. If you need to break it to fit, you can use a curb...I found that to work well. Sanded the edges just in case too. The whole one would probably do well for him. What temperature would it be in the corner for him? I have Trevor's food in an area about 80 and he seems to like that. But he's still a grazer, going back and forth between basking and eating for a few hours at least.

 

[Meg90]

Nigel weighed 505g today. He hasn't touched food of his own free will for two days. I put him in front of his tile and he'll eat a little, but not nearly all of it. I added an extra light on the cool side, thinking maybe visibility might have been the problem....

I am taking him to the vet. What I want to know is, where should blood be taken from, etc.

Tell me what is OK and not OK. I don't want them manhandling him, "reptile" specialist or no.

Please help.

With school, and Eglantine, and work, and now poor Nigel I am just about to crack up.

 

[Yvonne G]

You know what? That's a darned good question! In all my years of tortoise-keeping and treating for illnesses, I've never had any blood work done. We went through a Russian tortoise DNA study a couple years ago and all they did was short-clip a toe nail and take a couple dabs of blood from that. But I doubt that would be enough blood for blood-tests. Interested in an answer to this one.

Yvonne

 

[Tim/Robin]

They have a nice jugular vein on either side of their neck. One tortoise book we have says this is the best and easiest place to get a sample from. It is not too difficult to do, you just have to grap the head before they pull it inside. Robin and I drew a blood sample on our Indian Star and it wasn't too bad. But remember, we are nurses and insert IV's all the time. In fact, Robin is an IV nurse at our local hospital, so it is possible to do, but maybe not just any one can or should attempt.

 

[egyptiandan]

As well as there you can get blood from a vein on top of the tail and you can get blood from the elbow joint of the front leg.

Danny

 

[Meg90]

Anybody have any idea what could be wrong with him?? Any other practices that I should be wary of? Poor fellow.

 

[tortoisenerd]

How did it go? I would want to look any medications up online before my tort was giving them. Are you familiar with this vet at all? Get a personal recommendation? I have come to trust Trevor's vet even with only two visits. Did Nigel lose weight (what was his weight before)? Best wishes.

 

[Meg90]

I have been so damned busy all week, I didn't even have time to make an appointment, let alone go to one. He must have heard me say "vet" though, because he's been eating since I posted that. I feed a small pile in the morning, and he eats most of it, and another small pile in the afternoon.

I am giving him the "baby" treatment. IE waking his butt up when I put food down, and putting him right in front of it. It seems to help.

He'll still be going to the vet. I want him checked over. But I am glad that he is eating. He still goes for the radicchio with gusto....I'm thinking of getting a small head of it, grating it, and sprinkling it over his entire pile, so that he can't pick around the other stuff.

Nigel has lost weight. He used to be 570g (which is STILL underweight) but back then, he ate twice a day.

At this point, I am musing the idea that he might have parasites. They are known to halt weight gain, and aid in losing it.

What is the proper procedure at the vets for worming? I know ABSOLUTELY NO Ivermectrin. But what should be used?

I know everyone says squash will worm at home. Can I have exact directions on how to do that (quantity, raw/cooked, how many days in a row?)? I am wanting to try everything else that I can, before I stress him with a car ride to the vet, and an office exam.

 

[Tim/Robin]

You can use fenbendazole(Panacur). It is a common wormer. It is given orally at 50-100mg/kg every 2-3 weeks until a clean fecal. Panacur is a wormer, it will not work on Protozoans, that would need metrondiazole(Flagyl). You can buy fenbendazole at many feed stores. The liquid form is easiest to calculate doses, but it also comes in a paste. Here is what the liquid form looks like at feed stores http://www.wammocks.com/Safe-Guard-...2EA1862A1850CAF3060AF2FC02B7FB94.qscstrfrnt03
We have used it. It has a very safe margin and is nearly impossible to overdose an animal.

 

[tortoisenerd]

I would think it's much easier to get a test for parasites and decide to treat accordingly than guess that's what he has or doesn't have. I wouldn't want to wait and see, and I also wouldn't want to worm a tort unnecessarily. My vet cost $50 plus $20 for a fecal. There are other possibilities for weight loss. You say he eats twice a day--how much? You can also try feeding higher calorie foods like Mazuri. Any other symptoms at this time besides lethargy and loss of appetite?

 

[Gulf Coast]

Meg, I'm sorry Nigel is feeling bad.. I would try and get him to the vet on Monday. Do they take walk ins? I would't worry about him riding in the car. If we need to take Waldo anywhere, he just rides in our laps and he is fine with that. Maybe you can try a dark box so as not to upset him.. Will his rubbermaid box fit in your car? Thing is if something is really wrong you need to get treatment going sooner than later.. I sure hope the little guy is okay.. Everyone here knows how much you love him.

 

[tortoisenerd]

A shoebox or whatever works great. I have a small Rubbermaid I take Trevor in (same one he's in when we change his substrate or he goes out on the patio for a bit).

 

[bettinge]

I cook Butternut squash and serve once a week! I buy the whole squash, cut and freeze it raw, and cook the one square inch chunks when needed. I steam it! They love it! I hear Pumpkin is great as well, start to look for one at a farm market.

I don't think you can OD on squash, so serving for a week or more should not be a problem. If he loves squash like mine do, it may help put weight on as well!

 

[Meg90]

That's just it--he's not lethargic. He is up and about just like normal. He just seems to not be interested in his food. And I have tried Mazuri. He turns his nose up.

Dr. Pope's office is a 25-35 minute drive for us.

 

[Crazy1]

Meg, I am sorry Nigel is still not feeling himself. I know Dr. Pope is about a 35 minute drive but it may just be worth the trip. I would ask for a culture to be done. My vet took a swab and slid it gently down to the stomach area and then had it cultured. it should show any protozoa, Worms etc. Here are just a short list of some things that can curb appetite and cause wt loss.
Parasites
Sterile gut syndrome
Renal or Liver dysfunction
Anorexia
Diabetes
Protozoa
Mycoplasma
Herpes
I do not want to alarm you this can just rule out what Nigel does not have. Perhaps it is just hot and he is responding to it. Or to your very active lifestyle at this time. But better safe than sorry.

 

[Stazz]

Awwww little Nigel !!!! I will pray for him Meg. Give him a kissy from Tallula hehe, maybe that will make him feel better.

 

[Marshman]

Sorry Meg,
I here ya tho Walter is still not eating much of anything and seems fairly active noticed lately that when i pick him up when he is asleep it takes awhile for his eyes to open but the whole time he is trying to get away he pushes with legs still seems really strong. I with the VET advice because that's what I decided this weekend just to be sure luckily for me my wife is a VET Tech although I now more about reptiles and stuff I have became good friends with the docs at here clinic and trust them very much.

 

[Crazy1]

Marshman sorry to hear Chico our boxer passed.

Meg don't want to scare you or anything. But even 2 weeks before I lost Lilbit the vet said she seemed pretty strong and active. But I had noticed how much she was inactive and weak, compared to her before she was ill. Nigel may also be feeling the effects of the new kid on the block even though they are not kept together. Have you tried taking him outside and see how he is out there?

It may be the time of the year that has caused him to slow down. But mine are outside and eating up a storm weather has been hot 87F-109F. The ones inside are doing good even Biggie who was not eating much and Dotsy who seemed to have a runny nose is fine now and eating up a storm.