Red foot tortoise humidity m

[Dawsonduro]

I just recently got a baby red-foot tortoise last week, I’ve been doing thorough research on them but everywhere I go seems to lead me to different answers.
I have plenty of spaghnum moss in here for him I keep it wet as well as the substrate, but I’m reading some places that you don’t want the substrate wet do to shell rot?
This is the enclosure I keep him in, on the side with his hide humidity usually stays between 75-85% but where I have his lamps it seems to dry up very fast to 55-70% humidity depending on which corner. Just wondering how I can better keep humidity , I can’t close the tops due to some of my lamps needing to clamp on the side…

I also hear mixed things on the temperatures you want , I keep his feeding/play area 80-90 during day and his hide is usually 80 during day
At night I keep all temps above 75 with his hide (usually where he sleeps) being very high 70s or low 80s
If anyone could help me I would appreciate it a lot, I want what’s best for this little guy/gal

 

[Dawsonduro]

I just recently got a baby red-foot tortoise last week, I’ve been doing thorough research on them but everywhere I go seems to lead me to different answers.
I have plenty of spaghnum moss in here for him I keep it wet as well as the substrate, but I’m reading some places that you don’t want the substrate wet do to shell rot?
This is the enclosure I keep him in, on the side with his hide humidity usually stays between 75-85% but where I have his lamps it seems to dry up very fast to 55-70% humidity depending on which corner. Just wondering how I can better keep humidity , I can’t close the tops due to some of my lamps needing to clamp on the side…

I also hear mixed things on the temperatures you want , I keep his feeding/play area 80-90 during day and his hide is usually 80 during day
At night I keep all temps above 75 with his hide (usually where he sleeps) being very high 70s or low 80s
If anyone could help me I would appreciate it a lot, I want what’s best for this little guy/gal

Also I have a spray bottle and do use it to keep humidity levels but it only works for so long, and sometimes I can’t be here to constantly spray it.

 

[mojo_1]

Don't take this the wrong way. But everything you have is wrong.
The enclosure needs to be a closed chamber enclosure, moss of any flavor is a no, it can cause impacted intestines. Water and food dishes need to be terracotta saucers sunk into the substrate so they can get in and out easily. Easiest substrate would be orchid bark. Keep top layer dry pour a cup of hot water in the corners as needed to bring up humidity. Lights and heating no mercury vapor bulbs no colored bulbs. You want a 5500K to 6500K flood light for daylight simulation on a timer for 12 to 14 hrs, for UV you want a T5 long tube style light on a timer from noon to 4pm, for heat you want to use a ceramic heat emitter on a thermostat controller. Temperature and humidity should be consistently mid 80's for both all the time in the entire enclosure remember redfoots are a tropical tortoise. Also misters and humidifiers are also a no, once you close up the enclosure you will not need to spray the enclosureeither. Redfoots don't need hot and cold sides. Give them lots of hides and some shade plants. Here's example of my enclosure.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Hello and welcome! I’m glad you've made your way here❤️Care advice for these guys is painfully behind, fb pages, YouTube, pet stores, they’re all repeating the same outdated advice, this forum is made of people who have spent years finding the best ways to care for them that actually result in healthy tortoise, you’re best using this as your only source of care information to save yourself confusion.

First the bad news, I’m afraid you’ve been sold all the wrong set up for this baby, all the moss needs removing asap, it’s an impaction hazard.
Lighting will need changing and the baby needs to be in a closed chamber set up.

The good news is, we can help guide you every step of the way in getting this baby appropriately set up, this hatchling phase is vital to get right for their future health🙂

I’m going to include a bunch of information below you’ll find useful, take your time going over everything, and if you need anything breaking down, please ask, more than happy to do so😊

When a hatchling, they do best in a closed chamber set up to better control the temperature and humidity, I would never recommend housing a hatchling outside of enclosed chamber. This set up you have, the wood will not last you long for the humidity you need to maintain, and the size won’t last until they’re big enough to be outdoors, they need to measure at least 10 inches.

I’m going to include some information below on examples of the correct kind of equipment to use and levels etc, hopefully it helps!

If using a light emitting heat source it should be an incandescent floodlight(example attached)on a 12 hour timer, using a CHE(ceramic heat emitter) for night heat.

However I think ceramics as a heat source are more suited to red foot’s and far less desiccating on their shells.

Red foot’s don’t necessarily need a ‘basking area’ they aren’t typically a basking species coming from the forest floor(some do though, it depends on the individual) there’s no need for a ‘cooler end’ and ‘warmer end’ with these guys, aim for an overall ambient temperature range of 80-86(82-84 being optimal)temps shouldn’t ever be going below 80 both night&day.

Personally we rely on CHE’s(ceramic heat emitters) as our heat source 24/7, on thermostats, they’re a non light emitting bulb and I think you’ll find it easier switching to these as your heat source to keep your temps nice and stable. When using multiple hang them equal distance to distribute the heat more evenly.

Large wide dome fittings will help project the heat down, but don’t rely on the clamps that come with them, always hang them securely.

You can then hang some ambient lighting on a 12hour timer, it can being either a led strip or a led bulb in 5000k-65000k colour range. Create lots of shady areas with safe plants and hides, red foots don’t like things too bright.

Any indoor UV needs to be provided as a t5 tube fluorescent light, the compact or all in one bulbs either are too harsh creating uv hot spots that can damage their eyes, or are far too weak. I’ve attached the brands to go for and examples of stands to mount them. Arcadia proT5 kit 12% comes with the reflector fitting, the reptisun needs it buying separately.

If you’re able to get them out for a few hours of natural sunlight daily, don’t worry about the uv. Just make sure it’s not too warm and they’re in a secure run with lots of shade. Supervise them closely and only let them be outside for a few hours to get their uv.

Your little one will need around 80+% humidity 24/7 to thrive, the right substrate and a good closed chamber set up goes a long way in making this work. You’ll constantly struggle with an open top like that.

We personally keep our red foot on orchid bark, we focus on the under layer of the substrate being nice and damp to create the humidity, then the top layer being dry, the trouble with constantly spraying is, one, it can only lasts so long, and two, keeping that top layer constantly damp will leave them more prone to a fungal infection, avoid misters/foggers for this reason too, the humidifiers can also make the air too wet leading to respiratory issues. To stop that top layer getting a little too dry because you don’t want dusty substrate, we mix it now n then, which also helps gives a humidity boost without extra water🙂to maintain our humidity we simply pour some lukewarm water into the corners of the substrate, not loads! Just enough to dampen the whole under layer. You can keep an eye on your monitors&substrate to do the pours as and when needed, which in a good closed chamber set up, you shouldn’t have to do loads😊

Substrate wise never add any kind of moss, that’s something some stores think nothing of, but it can actually cause lethal impactions, so as I’ve said, definitely get that out of there.

Don’t use any top soils or anything mixed with sand.

Safe substrate options are coco coir, damp and packed down by hand as a base, with orchid bark(fir not pine) on top, or forest floor on top, or just the orchid bark/ forest floor on their own.

Size wise I’d generally recommend you make your own base to go as big as you possibly can for the space you have, this tortoise full grown is going to need a large, secure outdoor space if your climate is good for it, if not, a room sized enclosure is going to be needed as an adult. Go as big as you can to last them till they’re big enough. A good cost effective closed chamber set up would be a greenhouse style enclosure by making your own large base out of a safe material, or even use a garden bed frame! For both these options line with some cheap pond liner, the lining going up the sides too and make sure those sides are high enough. Then simply secure a greenhouse topper on top, if you can’t find an exact fit, place it over like the one with the white base in the photo, I’d place some lining under the cover and base though to avoid condensate getting on your floor.

Some people even hang their lighting and heat from the greenhouse frame!(if sturdy enough) Simply wrap the wire around for the height you need(check with a temperature gun/add thermostats, roughly 18-21 inches for the uv) and secure with cable ties and chains. Or you could make your own stands out of safe timber, again I’ll attach some pics.

For a water dish a large terracotta saucer, sitting flush with the substrate is safest, they have grip in the event the tortoise flips, most pet store options are a hazard, avoid using them.

Id definitely recommend a temp gun to make sure your monitors are reading correctly. Have digital monitors that read both temp and humidity.

Ignore whatever else is in the photos in the enclosures, they’re just to give you an idea😊and ignore that some of the fittings in the pics are floodlights, ches will work great, just examples on how to hang your bulbs👍

Also as this is a closed chamber set up, the materials like the lining and cover will need time to off gas, I’d leave it all running up to a week, or until there is no odour, if there’s no smell, it’s safe for use.

I’ll include a diet list of some stuff we feed ours in my next reply, to hopefully help give you some ideas for variety, their dietary requirements differ from most tortoise🙂

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

These are some greens to feed(bear in mind the lettuce isn’t the most nutritional but fine to add as part of a varied diet);

Lambs lettuce
Romaine
Red leaf lettuce
Frisèe lettuce
Endive(chicory)
Spring greens
Kale
Rocket
Cress on occasion
The odd Brussel sprout on occasion

There’s also plenty of different weeds you can add! Providing you’re sourcing them from an area that is free of any harmful chemicals like pesticides and fertiliser, so be WARY! There’s lots of lookalikes that can be toxic, it might be best to grow your own from seeds online. We add dandelions and broadleaf plantain, I’ll add a link below you might find useful to look through🙂

The Tortoise Table - Home

The Tortoise Table plant database and resource site for Tortoise owners

www.thetortoisetable.org.uk

Now let’s talk fruit! We remove any pips/seed/stones that are either toxic or a chocking hazard, so for my list, we’d remove the mango stone, plum stone, peach stone, nectarine stone, cherry stones(chocking hazard!), apricot stones, appel&pear seeds(toxic)

Ones we feed more regularly(but rotate cause variety is key):

Mango
Papaya
Pineapple
Raspberries
Melon
Strawberries
Watermelon(not super nutritional but a good hydration boost)
Plum
Peach
Nectarines
Cherries
Apricot
Blueberries
Figs
Guava
Prickly pear


Ones we feel less regularly:

Appel
Banana
Blackberries
Grapes
Pear

Those last ones are more of a treat basis. You can also try cherry tomatoes on occasion but not often.

We also sometimes grate a bit of carrot on our red foots food(not a lot) or some courgette, you can also add bell peppers on occasion, and they’ll also enjoy some mushroom once a week or so!

Hope this helps give you some ideas for variety🙂 we try not to give ours too much of just the one type of fruit in any given week, however she gets papaya pretty much daily, it makes up a large majority of their diet in the wild so definitely get your hands on some!

Also they’ll need some protein every 7-10 days, we personally give ours a head sized protein of steamed chicken breast, or a mouse we defrost from the reptile shop.

Calcium power can be added on 3 feeds a week.

Hope all this helps, any further questions, please ask😊

 

[Dawsonduro]

These are some greens to feed(bear in mind the lettuce isn’t the most nutritional but fine to add as part of a varied diet);

Lambs lettuce
Romaine
Red leaf lettuce
Frisèe lettuce
Endive(chicory)
Spring greens
Kale
Rocket
Cress on occasion
The odd Brussel sprout on occasion

There’s also plenty of different weeds you can add! Providing you’re sourcing them from an area that is free of any harmful chemicals like pesticides and fertiliser, so be WARY! There’s lots of lookalikes that can be toxic, it might be best to grow your own from seeds online. We add dandelions and broadleaf plantain, I’ll add a link below you might find useful to look through🙂

The Tortoise Table - Home

The Tortoise Table plant database and resource site for Tortoise owners

www.thetortoisetable.org.uk

Now let’s talk fruit! We remove any pips/seed/stones that are either toxic or a chocking hazard, so for my list, we’d remove the mango stone, plum stone, peach stone, nectarine stone, cherry stones(chocking hazard!), apricot stones, appel&pear seeds(toxic)

Ones we feed more regularly(but rotate cause variety is key):

Mango
Papaya
Pineapple
Raspberries
Melon
Strawberries
Watermelon(not super nutritional but a good hydration boost)
Plum
Peach
Nectarines
Cherries
Apricot
Blueberries
Figs
Guava
Prickly pear


Ones we feel less regularly:

Appel
Banana
Blackberries
Grapes
Pear

Those last ones are more of a treat basis. You can also try cherry tomatoes on occasion but not often.

We also sometimes grate a bit of carrot on our red foots food(not a lot) or some courgette, you can also add bell peppers on occasion, and they’ll also enjoy some mushroom once a week or so!

Hope this helps give you some ideas for variety🙂 we try not to give ours too much of just the one type of fruit in any given week, however she gets papaya pretty much daily, it makes up a large majority of their diet in the wild so definitely get your hands on some!

Also they’ll need some protein every 7-10 days, we personally give ours a head sized protein of steamed chicken breast, or a mouse we defrost from the reptile shop.

Calcium power can be added on 3 feeds a week.

Hope all this helps, any further questions, please ask😊

Is there any discord server or anything of the sort i could join and chat with you or anybody that could help me i have a lot of questions and im hesitant to go and buy a bunch of more stuff before i know exactly what will work for my tortoise. Pretty frustrating to hear i have spent all this money and time thinking it was correct, when in reality im being mislead everywhere i look for information.
I appreciate both you guys for the honest help!

 

[mojo_1]

Is there any discord server or anything of the sort i could join and chat with you or anybody that could help me i have a lot of questions and im hesitant to go and buy a bunch of more stuff before i know exactly what will work for my tortoise. Pretty frustrating to hear i have spent all this money and time thinking it was correct, when in reality im being mislead everywhere i look for information.
I appreciate both you guys for the honest help!

This is the place for all your questions. Ask away. The correct and most up to date information is on this forum.

 

[Dawsonduro]

This is the place for all your questions. Ask away. The correct and most up to date information is on this forum.

Understood, was wondering if there is discords because talking is easier then typing though...But all these "famous reptile owners" kamp kenan etc are completely full of **** then? Not doubting your guys smarts you both seem very knowledgable and i really do appreciate you taking your own time to help me out. but just want to make sure im fully understanding. Because i see these youtubers own many healthy fully grown tortoises, and i used kenan ,for example he had a video on setting up enclosure for baby redfoots and he included moss and basically the same exact setup i have but it was outside only difference (he even pours water all over substrate). But my question is are they just showing this all to mislead thousands of people because theyre sponsored by these companies? And if these arent the correct ways to care for them how do they have many thriving tortoises

 

[mojo_1]

Understood, was wondering if there is discords because talking is easier then typing though...But all these "famous reptile owners" kamp kenan etc are completely full of **** then? Not doubting your guys smarts you both seem very knowledgable and i really do appreciate you taking your own time to help me out. but just want to make sure im fully understanding. Because i see these youtubers own many healthy fully grown tortoises, and i used kenan ,for example he had a video on setting up enclosure for baby redfoots and he included moss and basically the same exact setup i have but it was outside only difference (he even pours water all over substrate). But my question is are they just showing this all to mislead thousands of people because theyre sponsored by these companies? And if these arent the correct ways to care for them how do they have many thriving tortoises

Yes these youtube people have many thriving tortoises but think of it like this you don't see videos of the ones that don't make it and why they didn't make it. You see the strongest tortoises in the group that have survived. How many redfoot tortoises do you want to gamble with to have 1 successfully survive. You can do what they do but the odds are not in your favor. There is more knowledgeable people then the 2 of us on this species of tortoises that will chime in when they log in to the forum. I promise you won't be guided wrong here.

 

[Dawsonduro]

Yes these youtube people have many thriving tortoises but think of it like this you don't see videos of the ones that don't make it and why they didn't make it. You see the strongest tortoises in the group that have survived. How many redfoot tortoises do you want to gamble with to have 1 successfully survive. You can do what they do but the odds are not in your favor. There is more knowledgeable people then the 2 of us on this species of tortoises that will chime in when they log in to the forum. I promise you won't be guided wrong here.

100% not gonna follow them, I’m an animal lover my self I don’t want to hurt these guys. I’m open to all information you guys are giving me but you have to understand after spending tons of money and time and being mislead by others im not quick to jump the gun on it happening again. Just want to make sure I fully understand before purchasing a whole new setup..
But you said this forum is very great for information which I have relied on when very first purchasing my tortoise this person gave me this info and they’re a long time member on here. Just want to clear any confusion, not arguing your points I just need to understand my self.
Here’s what they said though, wondering your thoughts on it
Also what would be best dimensions for a new enclosure and do you guys know any good closed enclosures I can buy?

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Unfortunately with YouTube and the like, it’s like like mojo says, they only show you what you’re wanting to see, they don’t include the problems they encounter, or the problems people get from following their care.

Don’t feel bad thought, lots folks like yourself have come to this forum after following this kind of advice, sometimes in their cases, their tortoises are already suffering. That isn’t the case for you, there’s time to turn this around❤️
Bear in mind with sources like YouTube, they’re making money off their content, not saying it’s loads, but it gives them more incentive to keep pumping out outdated info for a quick buck.

No one is making money on this forum, we all simply just want to see people have a positive experience raising tortoise🐢💚

Any questions you have, no matter how many, fire away here and bit by bit we’ll go through them for you, you can take your time reading and refer back to the thread whenever needed. Get yourself a list together of stuff you need, have a look online and take some screenshots, before ordering anything, post them here and we can help guide you on what is appropriate🙂there’s no such thing as a silly question here, so please don’t be shy😊

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

100% not gonna follow them, I’m an animal lover my self I don’t want to hurt these guys. I’m open to all information you guys are giving me but you have to understand after spending tons of money and time and being mislead by others im not quick to jump the gun on it happening again. Just want to make sure I fully understand before purchasing a whole new setup..
But you said this forum is very great for information which I have relied on when very first purchasing my tortoise this person gave me this info and they’re a long time member on here. Just want to clear any confusion, not arguing your points I just need to understand my self.
Here’s what they said though, wondering your thoughts on it
Also what would be best dimensions for a new enclosure and do you guys know any good closed enclosures I can buy?

With some of the threads on here, you have to look at the date they were posted, there is definitely outdated information on this forum from years back, we do our best to make sure all the correct updated information is given. But yeah definitely be aware of that when navigating the site, it’s been up and running over 15 years, lots has changed.

You will sometimes still get the odd member giving out incorrect info, we again do our best to amend that where possible, but for the most part, everyone on here is currently on the same page🙂

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Also what would be best dimensions for a new enclosure and do you guys know any good closed enclosures I can buy?

Dimension wise, some people go for a 4x2 foot size for a hatchling, which is fine but I just don’t know if that size keeps right up until they’re big enough for outside. I’d personally go closer to a 6x2 size, let me see if I can find you some links for a greenhouse set up, bare with🙂

 

[mojo_1]

Agree. Mojo's enclosure is 4x2x2 in about months to a year I'll have to get a bigger enclosure for him.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Ok so I’ve got some links but I’m not certain they’ll work because you’re across the pond, I’ll include them anyway but just incase I’ve also included some pictures from US members to show you what to go for, the 6x3 sizes are pretty ideal I think, should last you🙂

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0CPTR4STM/?tag=

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0CJ6KJFN9/?tag=

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Understood, was wondering if there is discords because talking is easier then typing though...But all these "famous reptile owners" kamp kenan etc are completely full of **** then? Not doubting your guys smarts you both seem very knowledgable and i really do appreciate you taking your own time to help me out. but just want to make sure im fully understanding. Because i see these youtubers own many healthy fully grown tortoises, and i used kenan ,for example he had a video on setting up enclosure for baby redfoots and he included moss and basically the same exact setup i have but it was outside only difference (he even pours water all over substrate). But my question is are they just showing this all to mislead thousands of people because theyre sponsored by these companies? And if these arent the correct ways to care for them how do they have many thriving tortoises

Hi!
Not every YouTube video is a misinformation. There are different approaches to keeping as well. What's more important are details which often get omitted. For example, you can raise a redfoot in an open top enclosure, but you need your whole room hot and humid (basically, the room itself is a "closed chamber"). You can use basking lamps for redfoots, but you should prevent "overbasking" with 1-2 hours bulb timer and high ambient temperatures. You can wet top substrate layer but you need to provide dry substrate areas as well. You can use moss but you need to provide perfect diet, decent size enclosure and have a good vet at hand with a little margin for error. Not every tortoise eats moss, not every tortoise gets impacted by moss, not every tortoise can't pass it on its own. Also, there different types of mosses and they can be used in different ways (in bioactive substrate mixes, in netted bags on top hides and so on).

Anyfoot, author of the post on the screenshot, is an experienced keeper, but he isn't posting for a while - husbandry methods have advanced since then.

In the beginning of your "tortoise journey" it's better to use safer options and keep things simple.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

The enclosure for Mojo - is a PVC enclosure made by Animal Plastics.

You can make your own:

Building your own Expanded PVC Enclosed Chamber – For Beginners

I have recently been asked to do a post on building an enclosed chamber using PVC, and to tailor the post to those that have NO fabrication / wood working experience and the resultant lack of tools. So, that’s what this post is about. If you have even basic wood working or metal working skills...

tortoiseforum.org

Or get a pre-built one from Kages, Animal Plastics, Toad Ranch and so on. Also, you can PM a forum member markw84 who makes Smart Enclosures (really well built).

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Hi!
Not every YouTube video is a misinformation. There are different approaches to keeping as well. What's more important are details which often get omitted. For example, you can raise a redfoot in an open top enclosure, but you need your whole room hot and humid (basically, the room itself is a "closed chamber"). You can use basking lamps for redfoots, but you should prevent "overbasking" with 1-2 hours bulb timer and high ambient temperatures. You can wet top substrate layer but you need to provide dry substrate areas as well. You can use moss but you need to provide perfect diet, decent size enclosure and have a good vet at hand with a little margin for error. Not every tortoise eats moss, not every tortoise gets impacted by moss, not every tortoise can't pass it on its own. Also, there different types of mosses and they can be used in different ways (in bioactive substrate mixes, in netted bags on top hides and so on).

Anyfoot, author of the post on the screenshot, is an experienced keeper, but he isn't posting for a while - husbandry methods have advanced since then.

In the beginning of your "tortoise journey" it's better to use safer options and keep things simple.

Hopefully this response gives you a better insight on the YouTube front, there are definitely multiple ways of doing things. I would also personally recommend a closed chamber regardless of room temp because indoors we just can’t provide the humidity they need without wrecking you room or spending more making it appropriate.

You can use a floodlight for basking if you wish, I just think it’s much simpler and more suited for them having ceramics 24/7🙂

For the moss, like Alex says, there’s little to no margin for error using it. Even then it could become an issue, hence we’ll always say to air on the side of caution and not use it. Not just the impaction but sphagnum moss for example, has too acidic a ph. But they can be used out of tortoises reach to help humidity, hopefully that clears things up more😊

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

The enclosure for Mojo - is a PVC enclosure made by Animal Plastics.

You can make your own:

Building your own Expanded PVC Enclosed Chamber – For Beginners

I have recently been asked to do a post on building an enclosed chamber using PVC, and to tailor the post to those that have NO fabrication / wood working experience and the resultant lack of tools. So, that’s what this post is about. If you have even basic wood working or metal working skills...

tortoiseforum.org

Or get a pre-built one from Kages, Animal Plastics, Toad Ranch and so on. Also, you can PM a forum member markw84 who makes Smart Enclosures (really well built).

They are great but definitely on the more expensive side, especially when you’ve brought a load of the wrong stuff already😣

 

[Dawsonduro]

Ok so I’ve got some links but I’m not certain they’ll work because you’re across the pond, I’ll include them anyway but just incase I’ve also included some pictures from US members to show you what to go for, the 6x3 sizes are pretty ideal I think, should last you🙂

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0CPTR4STM/?tag=

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B0CJ6KJFN9/?tag=

Heres what i found that i think will work , thoughts?
35.43 x 70.87 x 35.83 inches