SLEEPING ALL DAY! NEW MOM NEEDS ADVICE!!!

[Aristotle]

Hi Everyone. This is my first post and sorry, but it's about a problem. I have a baby greek (approx 7 months old) and for the past 2 days he has been sleeping non-stop in his hide (placed half-way in enclosure so part cool and part warm). Temp is 79.8F where he's been sleeping. Yesterday morning he ate his green lettuce and a tiny bit of endive (I read somewhere that greeks like endive - hope it wasn't bad info) and I soaked him very briefly (he wanted out after he had a poop). He's been sleeping ever since. I'm in CA and it's 2 pm here so it's been over 24 hours. He may have moved at night but his water dish is clean and nothing is moved around like it usually is. Mid morning I tried to wake him up by singing to him and placing food within eye shot, which usually works. He moved his head and opened his eyes and then went back to sleep - there was a piece of romaine lettuce about 1/2 inch away from his head. IS THIS NORMAL FOR A BABY, OR IS HE SICK OR DEHYDRATED? My instinct is dehydration but I don't want to force a soak if dehydration isn't the issue. I'm a new tortoise mom and I'm madly in love with my little Aristotle and I pray that I didn't poison him with the endive yesterday! HELP!!!

BTW - he's in a glass enclosure (which I am about a day away from replacing with a wood tortoise house (zoo-med)), substrate is mix of coco coir and zoo-med repti-bark (fir), which he LOVES burrowing in and moving into piles. Warm side and cool side are both within appropriate ranges. His food often ends up in the substrate so I'm going to get a food dish with a small lip to replace the flat dish I currently have. Could it be that some food he ate included urine and or feces???? (I do spot cleaning daily but no one is perfect)

Thanks in advance.

Kristina

---

Yay!! He just woke up and is happily eating some romaine lettuce spritzed with water and with a little vita-max sprinkled on it. Now I can run out to my accountant meeting to get my taxes done without a worried, heavy heart! This blog is amazing! No replies but Aristotle awakens within a 1/2 hour of my post! That said, can someone let me know if endive is ok?

Thanks,
Kristina

 

[pdrobber]

Welcome.

endive is fine, variety is key. escarole, green leaf lettuce, red leaf lettuce, romaine lettuce, collard greens, kale, radicchio, spring mix (which has most of these) are all good. what kind of lights do you use?

 

[Aristotle]

Hi Peter. Thanks for the welcome. I'm so happy I found this forum - I have learned so much reading all the threads. For heat I have an under-the-tank warmer ("Desert Small" - 8" x 8" from Exo-Terra) and above it is a 60W Nightlight Red Reptile bulb from zoo-med. For UVB I use a side-mounted (bulb facing down) 20" Reptisun 5.0 UVB which I turn on when I wake up and off when I go to sleep - UVB time averages to 14-16 hours daily. All of these were sold to me in the inane starter package with that glass tank. They convinced me that the glass was ok, even though I knew better! My bad.
If you reply with more questions and I don't respond, I'm not being rude. Rather I'm jumping in my car to drive to an appointment. I will respond at my first opportunity.
Thanks for your response and for the food info. I'm relieved that endive is ok!

Best,
Kristina

 

[pdrobber]

I personally don't have any problem with the UTH as long as you are monitoring the temp with a temp gun and a thermostat is a good idea too. The colored bulbs can sometimes be a problem for tortoises since it may cause them to try to eat the substrate. The reptisun is a compact UVB bulb, Those are also not recommended because it has been experienced that they cause eye problems including blindness. I personally had one in my redfoot's enclosure and switched to a long tube fixture and bulb and she has been more active, out of hiding. I don't have experience with Greeks or babies but others here do.


Where in CA are you located? A lot, if not most of the active and experienced members here are from CA.

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Kristina:

Welcome to the forum!!

Where 'bouts in Calif. are you? I'm in Clovis.

Don't worry about picking up your baby. I pick mine up all the time and place them in front of the food.

With babies (not Greeks, but other kinds) I get the babies and place them in a warm water soak, then I go about chopping up the food. Once I have the food at the different feeding stations, I'll get the babies and place them around the food. I do this every morning until they're about a year old, then I only soak them maybe three times a week. But I still pull them out and place them in front of the food.

 

[Torty Mom]

Welcome to TFO Glad to hear the little one is doing better!

 

[ALDABRAMAN]

Welcome!

 

[Aristotle]

Thanks Peter, Yvonne, Mary Anne & Aldabraman. I am very happy to be here! I live in the LA area, in the South Bay. I would be very grateful to hear from any Angelenos out there who know of good reptile supply stores in the LA area with employees who have experience with tortoises and aren't just trying to make a sale. I would also love a referral to a vet with expertise re: tortoises.
Peter - thanks for the advice regarding my heating and UVB set up. I just want to clarify that the UVB I have is a long tube fixture (mounted on the back wall of the tank) that sounds like the one you have. But maybe I am misunderstanding what you mean in your response. If the colored bulbs aren't a good idea, are there heat bulbs with no color? I don't recall seeing any but then again I wasn't looking for them. I do monitor the temperature consistently (digital thermometer with a probe).

Yvonne - thanks for the advice re: handling babies. Aristotle is very sweet - I pick him up and sing to him every day. And I have placed him in front of his food if I can't entice him with by leading him to his meal by holding a piece of lettuce close to him and slowly moving it toward his meal (I'm not sure how well tortoises can see). I'll try your "soak before a meal" idea, but in general Aristotle doesn't last in a soak very long. But I'll keep trying!
Mary Anne - I love your photos! Your torts are adorable!

Best,
Kristina

 

[bikerchicspain]

Hi and welcome,

If he is dehydrated his eyes would be slightly sunken, but a daily bath would not hurt him at all,
I have a baby and he eats more than the one twice the size,
Sometimes you just have to trust your tort, if he is not I'll,

A trip to the vets once or twice a year for check ups is a good idea for babies,or even just taking a sample of the poop every now and then.

 

[dmmj]

Welcome to another So Cal member, So is the little one doing better?

 

[pdrobber]

Yes there are normal uncolored heat bulbs. Some people use just a normal fluorescent light bulb for heat and visible light. For heat, you can use a ceramic heat emitter as well (CHE). OH ok I misread one of your original posts, the 20" UVB bulb is great, no problem.

 

[Aristotle]

Thanks all. Yes, dmmj - Ari is back to his normal active self, eating heartily and pushing his substrate into piles. That said, he MAY be dehydrated based on what bikerchicspain wrote re: sunken eyes. I thought they were "sleepy eyes" and many times I started singing to him, leading to a few yawns and Ari drifting off to sleep. I did try to soak him this morning - he was okay for about a minute or two, then started trying to climb out of his "bath". Either I am doing something wrong (very small amount of slightly warm water, heat lamp above - anything wrong with that?), or he just wants to decide for himself the time of his soak. When I got home this afternoon it was obvious that he had used his water dish. Does anyone else have a tort who won't soak for more than a few minutes? It kind of worries me because Aristotle is a baby and is possibly dehydrated, and I have read so many posts about soaking for 15-20 minutes. Geez - being a tortoise mom is challenging! It was easier caring for my daughter when she was an infant!
@ Peter: thanks for the advice re: lights. Re: CHEs - are they widely available, or carried only by reptile supply stores? If a normal fluorescent bulb is used rather than a colored heat bulb (like my evil red bulb), is the under-tank warmer sufficient for an additional heat source? How many watts should the "normal" bulb be? I can't wait to "remodel" the entire set up when I get my hands on that tortoise house. I'm taking notes of all the good advice I am receiving. Still looking for a good vet in my area . . .

 

[bikerchicspain]

I have a 7 year old on holiday with me,
He will not soak or drink, as the owner hand feeds him etc, so he is very spoilt.
What I do is put some Luke warm water in the bath, put him in and leave him for 15/20 mins,
Make sure there is not enough water for the tort to drown, especially if he flips,
You could do it in a Tupperware or bowl and just sit watching for that time.

I do this with my other torts when I am cleaning their enclosure.
They love their baths.

Takes me ages to clean and disinfect my bath afterwards.

I don't care much for under heaters, I have a full spectrum 250w and a ceramic also 250w.
You can get both online or at a petshop.
Please don't take the advice of the petshop, most havent got a clue, so before purchasing ask the people on here first.

You lighting and heating all depends on how large the enclosure is and where it is, also the temps in your part of the country.

 

[dmmj]

when I feed mine, I always wet down their food, use a spray bottle and pray water onto their greens.

 

[DocNezzy]

I soak my leos in the sink while I cut their greens up. After a quick drink, they always try to climb out! It's not going to hurt them to get a little extra moisture! Congrats on your new baby! So funny how addicted you get so quick!

 

[pdrobber]

I've seen CHEs in pet stores and online. As was said already, wattage depends on your situation, how your temps are now, how big the enclosure is...I'd say just make sure you use a ceramic socket fixture with a high wattage rating just so you CAN use a higher wattage bulb should you need to.

 

[Aristotle]

Thanks yet AGAIN! I just got back from PetSmart (told all the salespeople [very politely no thank you, I don't need their assistance!). PetSmart is my new "Target" in terms of shopping sprees!! LOVE IT! Anyway, I found CHEs for my Aristotle and my son's Slader (Leopard Tort - caring for Slader is what led to my finding & falling in love w/ Ari), so thanks for the advice on lighting. I found another hide that can be the "cool" hide so now Ari will have both. I just went crazy buying stuff that will work now in the [shudder!! ] glass tank as well as with the tortoise house when it comes. I am spraying Ari's food with water as he still continues to resist soaking. I will keep trying! I think he just may be stubbornly independent like my youngest son - in the long run it becomes a wonderfully positive characteristic to have.
Just want to thank you all for your nice welcome and great advice and for not making me feel stupid with my questions. I feel so much better educated and I know I have just begun. I anticipate posting here pretty often. My next issue is confirming that Ari is male as my gut decision when I first laid eyes on him may not be correct [but the odds are in my favor!]. Eventually I will post a picture of Ari - the ones I have now fail to show his winning personality!

Best,
Kristina