A Sad Horsfeld...

[Birchie]

Hi guys,

We have had our Horsfeld (Norma) for a couple of years and she is thriving However this week we have seen some changes in her behaviour and I wondered if anyone could shed some light on this.

She has been scratching her shell on anything she can and she has been spending long periods of time with her chin in the water! She often sits in the water and this helps her 'go' but in the last few days her back end is on one of the rocks and her chin is sat in the water?

We have talked tot he chidlren a about her and have come up with her being lonely, it being spring, wanting a mate ... but havent found any confirming information on the web.

She appears a little 'sad' but this may be us reading too much into it!

Any help would be appreciated

Birchie

 

[dmmj]

First off welcome to the forum, I hope you enjoy your visits here.
Now as to your question, tortoises don't get lonely like you and I do, they usually prefer to be alone. If you have ever seen males mate with females ( I have) you would know she does not really desire a mate. A male would pester her 24/7 never giving up.

 

[wellington]

Ditto, on they don't need a friend and would rather be alone. Is everything else normal. Eating, pooping, has anything else changed?
By the way, WELCOME and I hope all will be well with your tort.

 

[JoesMum]

Welcome

As others have said... they don't get lonely as humans see it.

Horsfields are solitary in the wild and often don't take kindly to newcomers in their enclosure and don't want to share food or territory. Disputes Horsfield-style, regardless of gender, involve biting, butting and mounting and blood is often drawn. The male approach to mating can only be described as aggravated rape! The less dominant tortoise goes into decline and can become ill and die.

Any new tortoise would, in any case, have to be kept in quarantine entirely separately from yours for at least 6 months.

You must only get a second tortoise if you can keep it entirely separately from yours and are prepared to accept that this may be a permanent arrangement.

As for your tort's behaviour... she is clearly out of sorts.

Do the usual things and double check the temperatures in the 4 important places: 1. Cool end, 2. Warm end, 3. under the basking lamp, 4. Overnight minimum

Get a fresh poop sample tested for a parasites too.

Does she go outside? It's amazing what an hour's sunshine each day can do for tortoise spirits. Natural UVB is best

 

[GeoTerraTestudo]

How old is this "sad" Russian tortoise? If she is an adult (6 inches or longer), then maybe she is acting this way because she is gravid. This means that she has eggs inside of her, and whether they have been fertilized or not, she may need to lay them. However, maybe she is refraining from laying them because there is no good spot in her enclosure to do so. If she does not lay them, she could become egg-bound, meaning that the eggs will get stuck inside inside of her, and that is a dangerous condition.

However, she might not be gravid or egg-bound at all. Here are some questions you want to ask yourself, to make sure she has a basically good environment to live in:

- How big is her enclosure? Does she have enough room to walk around?
- Does she have a nice, moist (but not wet) substrate she can dig into?
- What's the ambient humidity? Does the substrate provide a humid microclimate?
- Is the ambient temperature in the 70s, and is the basking spot 95-100*F?
- What part of the country do you live in? Is the weather nice enough to take her outside?
- What are you feeding her? Is she getting a nice variety of leafy greens to eat? Is she getting enough vitamins and minerals?
- Did she hibernate this year? If so, did she emerge healthy, or did she have some trouble?
- Are her eyes clear? Is her nose dry? If not, might she have an infection or a vitamin deficiency.

Maybe there's something simple in her environment you can tweak, to make her feel right again. However, if all of these factors check out, then you might want to take her to a vet for an X-ray, to see if she might be egg-bound.

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Birchie:

Welcome to the Tortoise Forum!!

What would you like us to call you?

...and may we know appx. where in the world you are?

I'm guessing the tortoise has parasites.

Is this an indoor tortoise or an outdoor tortoise? If its indoors, it probably would show a marked improvement once you set it up outside. A tortoise would much rather live outside than have a room mate.

 

[Birchie]

Hi Guys,

Thank you so much for all your advice Its lovely to come accross so many tortoise friendly people!

Our tortoise is called Norma (She was Norman before an annual trip to the vet declared her female!). We got her this time last year and when she arrived we were told she was about a year old. We did a huge amount of research into keeping her, conditions, diet etc before she arrived. We are a school in quite a deprived area and she has been a huge support to some of our more challenging children (aged 4-11).

When we researched Norma we came accross the indoor v outdoor arguement, different opinions on feeding, environment and some who would say being around children would be far too stressful. We did the best we could in making an informed descision (not always easy). We went for a vivarium. We took her to the vet shortly after we got her and he said that was best for the time being and she was too small to hibernate. In the classroom we also have a large tortoise table with lamp which she spends most warmer days in and the chidlren take her outside on sunny days during lunch time.

The children love her! And I must say I think she loves them. As soon as they are in in the morning she is up and at the glass and appears to enjoy the attention they give her. Dont get me wrong, we have difficult children but they have only ever shown her the most love and care.

I'm coming round to the idea that she may be getting too hot. She is eating well, she has a range of weeds every day and some dried/complete (with water) every 3 or 4 days. Her bowel movements seem the same as before. I turned her lamp off today and she stayed out of the water and then this afternoon she moved under the lamp, so I turned it on. I have changed her timer so that the lamp is on for a few hours in the morning and in the afternoon. I am also going to invest in a thermometer which has been recommended which will control the heat during the day and night at standard temperatures.

Any other advice would be greatefully recieved

Will upload a photo of our Norma soon!

Judy

 

[cemmons12]

My girl Ophelia "seems" sad all the time when compared to my very social Sulcata Cooper. But truth is she hates to be messed with very much and she will poo on you to show her damn displeasure. Its really very funny to me altho cleaning up poo isn't! Lol! So I wouldn't read to much into it just make sure your tort has all it needs! Have a great day!

 

[ascott]

Well sometimes content can be mistaken for sad when we put our human emotions into play.....

How deep is the substrate in her enclosure? What type of substrate are you using? Do you offer warm water soaks each day or every other day? What does she eat? What are your temps on the basking side the middle and the cool side? How large is the enclosure?

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You also mention she is taken outside during lunchtime sometimes...does she just run all over or does she sit in one spot? Are there loads of children around her when she is outside? Also...you say she has a tortoise table and she is there most of the day? Is there a reason she does not simply remain there as her home? Does she have a heat lamp in her tank at night? Most times classrooms have the a/c or heater on alot....? Is there anyway for you to post a pic of her/tortoise table/tank? Sometimes pictures say alot....