Hermann Tortoise Checkup / Questions

[Kisobel]

hi peeps, sorry I been posting quite a bit recently but trying to be more active on the forum.

I am providing some photos down below, of my lil guy just so people can tell me if they see anything wrong with him.
He been acting a lil strange recently, and today I also WAYY over fed him thinking he wouldn't eat it all but put as much out as was getting fresh stuff tomorrow. (I was wrong this lil guy ate like 3x the size of him worth of food).

Due to this he has slept in places he hasn't before and well yeah I think I have a sort of PTSD off when I first got him, any signs of lethargicness I go hyper worry.

I just had him down on the floor to take them photos and he took a mega poop that took like 30 seconds for him to pass through, then he also jet spray weed like 20 seconds later with a lil bit of poop that came out too.

Im not sure if it were painful or not bc his right leg he seemed to just drag when walking (ill provide a video here:

)

How much "should" I feed him as when he is hungry he just tries to eat anything so I been giving him more food as of recent so he stops trying to eat his log or my fingers instead.

Don't get me wrong bc of shifts he does't get out a lot. I used to work 2 days 2 night (12 hours) now im just working a full 4 days (12 hours), yes I get 4 off too so not too bad but for those 4 days there is no interaction aside from his food gets put out. My mother occasionally says hello to him but that's about it.

I kinda want a bigger sized enclosure for him, I thought 4ft vivarium was massive originally but I want to give the little guy more space, hopefully try get a running wheel up for him.

I am just wondering if he looks fat or healthy at all, it's my first time and I've owned him for roughly a year in a few months. I don't think he is too old and I know he is microchipped, is there any way to know the exact age? The sellers said he was a year but others said he didn't look a year when I got him, so I am taking a guess and say he is about a year and a half old. The sellers (was a reptile shop) and they told me incorrect information to start with so im reluctant to believe them.

Thank you ppl, this the best place I know to make some tortoise expert friends and for me to ask questions B)

 

[Kisobel]

p.s. he seriously tries to eat anything rn, as of this post he is attempting to eat the solid floor. and no he is not under fed by anymeans

 

[Yvonne G]

The leg dragging thing is because of the slippery floor. I'll bet he doesn't do it on substrate.

 

[Kisobel]

The leg dragging thing is because of the slippery floor. I'll bet he doesn't do it on substrate.

yeah, after a while he managed to get a hold on walking correctly. I overly worry and over protect this little guy, I just seen a post of a little tortoise being allowed to just walk around the grass in someones backyard / in the forest. I would be wayyyyy to scared presuming he is really easily injured. im not sure how true this is but I do worry

 

[Tom]

hi peeps, sorry I been posting quite a bit recently but trying to be more active on the forum.

I am providing some photos down below, of my lil guy just so people can tell me if they see anything wrong with him.
He been acting a lil strange recently, and today I also WAYY over fed him thinking he wouldn't eat it all but put as much out as was getting fresh stuff tomorrow. (I was wrong this lil guy ate like 3x the size of him worth of food).

Due to this he has slept in places he hasn't before and well yeah I think I have a sort of PTSD off when I first got him, any signs of lethargicness I go hyper worry.

I just had him down on the floor to take them photos and he took a mega poop that took like 30 seconds for him to pass through, then he also jet spray weed like 20 seconds later with a lil bit of poop that came out too.

Im not sure if it were painful or not bc his right leg he seemed to just drag when walking (ill provide a video here:

)

How much "should" I feed him as when he is hungry he just tries to eat anything so I been giving him more food as of recent so he stops trying to eat his log or my fingers instead.

Don't get me wrong bc of shifts he does't get out a lot. I used to work 2 days 2 night (12 hours) now im just working a full 4 days (12 hours), yes I get 4 off too so not too bad but for those 4 days there is no interaction aside from his food gets put out. My mother occasionally says hello to him but that's about it.

I kinda want a bigger sized enclosure for him, I thought 4ft vivarium was massive originally but I want to give the little guy more space, hopefully try get a running wheel up for him.

I am just wondering if he looks fat or healthy at all, it's my first time and I've owned him for roughly a year in a few months. I don't think he is too old and I know he is microchipped, is there any way to know the exact age? The sellers said he was a year but others said he didn't look a year when I got him, so I am taking a guess and say he is about a year and a half old. The sellers (was a reptile shop) and they told me incorrect information to start with so im reluctant to believe them.

Thank you ppl, this the best place I know to make some tortoise expert friends and for me to ask questions B)

Here are my thoughts:
1. Tortoises are grazers. They need to be able to eat all day. Feed him as much of the right foods as he will eat daily.
2. The biting stuff may be hunger, or it may be mineral imbalance or lack of fiber. Are you feeding primarily grocery store greens? What supplements and amendments are you adding in?
3. Tortoises should never be loose on the floor or loose outside. A bigger indoor enclosure will be beneficial, but a large safe outdoor enclosure will also be good. Tortoises benefit tremendously from being outside as they get older and larger. Little babies do best mostly indoors. Your little one can be outside for a few hours a day now in fair weather.
4. What type of UV tube is that? It is mounted very close to the substrate. Do you have a Solarmeter 6.5 to check it with?
5. It should not be that difficult to have a bowel movement.How often are you soaking him and for how long?
6. Walking on slick floors is not good for tortoises.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Your guy doesn’t look overweight to me in the photos, generally speaking, a tortoise is overweight when you can see that they’re too chubby to even fit into their shell properly. Maybe start doing monthly weighings if you’re worried🙂
It’s impossible to tell a tortoises exact age without knowing their hatch date, your guy isn’t fully grown though so I’d say under 3, but they all have different growth rates too.

You’ve possibly already answered these questions in your other threads, but just to refresh..

What size enclosure do you plan to eventually house in?

What kind of lighting/heat are you using? Packaging photos are super helpful!
I think in the photos I see a floodlight and a che for back up/night heat which is 👍
The basking light should be an incandescent floodlight.

What type of uv do you use? Again packaging photos are good!
Looks like a tube light though which again is good, which brand is it out of interest? Is it a t5 bulb?

With lighting avoid things labelled halogen or mercury vapour.

What is your basking temperature directly under the bulb? Overall day temps in the rest of the enclosure? Night temps?

How’s your humidity?

What kind of substrate is it you’re using? Looks like orchid bark which is fine👍

How’s their diet been with you so far?🙂

 

[Kisobel]

hi gents, this is a response to both @Tom and @Littleredfootbigredheart

First thanks for the replies,

For food I have been using a supplier on ebay, (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/145579358719) its been really good at feeding him, lots of variety. However the last 2 weeks, due to super hot weather the food wasn't the greatest / much of it and also I had been then also implementing grocery store greens, rocket etc. I haven't been using Ace High (my supplement) however I do occasionally add sprinkles of it.

I unfortunately cannot let him outside, I have a very small garden, the weather is terrible where I live and lots of vicious birds where I live as well as cats and such. I live in a city. Primarily seagulls being the main pain here as they go for anything.

The UV tube is at the low end of what is required so I leave it on for longer, it is 6 and a half inches from the substrate. @Alex and the Redfoot said "If the lamp is correct (Desert, 12% or 10.0) - then UVB output is at lower margin of recommended." when I provided a photo. (thanks Alex!) I also will provide the same photo I took a while back.

I haven't been soaking him nearly as much as I should. I aim for once a week but sometimes I have forgot and it will be about 2-3 weeks what I'm aware is bad, he has had a bath today however. He however never seems to sit still always tries to get out and simply seems to hate water so I haven't bathed him much. If I do it was only for about 5-10 mins.

I have no idea what size I eventually plan to house him in, I aspire to move out my current house in about 5 years and I currently have a 4ft vivarium so hopefully that can do for him for now, but once I have the space im getting a much larger space for him to live a great life in.

Under the basking lamp is not certain, its about 35-40 occasionally. Hot side goes to a bout 32-35 and the cold side is about 25 (all degrees C). That is another thing, he has been under the basking lamp a lot recently, not like his usual behaviour, not sure bc the hot / cold weather England has been having. one min hot one min freezing cold and wet.

The humidity is still an issue, I have to crack the glass open so it doesn't get too hot and allow ventilation, however doing that the humidity drops. I do not have a humidity checker what I still do need to buy however I also do not know how to get humidity up. I attempted pouring water then stir up the substrate but it just leaked.

For substrate I am indeed using orchid bark fine.

I apologise if stuff I say or ask triggers the expects but I really am new still. I love this little guy but don't know the goods from bads and I know also most/if not all tortoises are unique so they react to different stuff individually.

Here is the vivarium setup,

Everything is on a timer aside from the backup heat that is on a sensor to prevent it getting too cold.

I want to get a better food / water bowl for him as I want to take both out at same time and put both in at the same time but I feel like they take too much room up atm, hence I have the water then put food on the slate, however a bowl would make lots less mess when adding supplements such as the ace high powder. If anyone could give me recommendations for some Ceramic bowls and sizes for these bowls so I can create a better feeding ground for him please do let me know.

Hopefully this answers everything that has been asked, do let me know if you wish to know other stuff

Thank you all

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Thanks for the in depth reply!

For the diet side of things perhaps you’ll find this website below handy to look through! If you click on the wildflowers section there’s so many plants that grow perfectly in uk climate, you perhaps you could order some seeds online, plant them in organic soil in a planter outside tortoise won’t have access to. You can forage from them as they grow🙂

The Tortoise Table - Home

The Tortoise Table plant database and resource site for Tortoise owners

www.thetortoisetable.org.uk

Yes from my understanding t8 bulbs are less powerful, when it comes time to replace I’d go for a t5 bulb with the same brand, I’ll go into that below.

Have you got a temp gun to check your temp under the basking light? If not I’d recommend one, they’re very useful.

Does the enclosure get too hot with just the basking light running? Because if the thermostat the CHE is on, is set to a night time temperature it shouldn’t be getting too warm in there, what watt is your floodlight? I wouldn’t worry about the ventilation side of things with opening the glass, opening up to daily husbandries is enough air exchange.

Does your enclosure have a lining? If not the pours will definitely cause leaks, I’d recommend putting some cheap pond liner, or a mould resistant shower curtain under the substrate to stop leaks, if your bottom layer of substrate is damp in an enclosed chamber like yours, humidity should be fine, the sooner you can get something to measure that the better.

I’m going to include some information below on the types of equipment to use, how to maintain humidity, and a cost effective way for you to get a suitable sized enclosure, hopefully it helps inspire an idea for you🙂

Basking light should be an incandescent floodlight(example attached) on a 12 hour timer.

Basking temperature directly under the floodlight should be 95-100f. The rest of the enclosure should be ranging 75-80 during the day.

You may also wish to add ambient lighting on the same timer, providing shady areas with hides and safe plants.

Then CHE/CHE’s(ceramic heat emitters) always on a thermostat, for night heat if your house drops below 60’s at night. Set the thermostat for a night temperature place the probe in their cooler end.

Uv should be a t5 fluorescent tube, avoid the compact and coil uv bulbs, they don’t give out enough uv and can hurt the tortoises eyes. The uv can be on a 4 hour timer from noon. I’ve attached the one I recommended you upgrade to when the time comes🙂

With lighting always avoid anything labelled halogen or mercury vapour.

For substrates, either coco coir, dampened and packed down by hand as a base, with a layer of orchid(fir not pine) bark or forest floor on top, or just the orchid bark/forest floor. Never use anything with sand mixed in, no top soils and no kinds of moss.

You want to aim to have the bottom layer of substrate damp, to do this pour lukewarm water into the corners, not loads but enough to dampen the entire bottom layer. To stop that top layer getting a little too dry/dusty, mix the substrate now n then, which also helps boosting humidity or give the top a spray. Check your monitors and substrate to do the pours as and when needed. I don’t recommend misters or foggers, they get the air too wet and cause respiratory problems.

Humidity for young growing tortoises needs to be maintained around 80%, 24/7, you’ll find that difficult to achieve with an open top so it’s good you’ve got a closed chamber, for the set up I’m recommending I’d get a greenhouse cover. Once the tortoise is older a cover won’t be needed.

To maintain humidity whilst the tortoise is younger a greenhouse style set up works well and provides more space, as an adult this tortoise is going to ideally need a minimum of an 8x4, the bigger you go the better, it’s ideal if you can build your own base to go as big as you can for the room you have.

If you can’t find an exact fit for your base with the cover, then place it over like the one with the white base in the photo, I’d put lining down under the base and cover though to stop condensate getting on your floor.
When making your base, just make sure the material is safe, some use flower beds or just make their own, for both these options I’d line with cheap pond liner to protect the base, making sure the liner goes up the sides too and make sure those sides are deep enough to prevent escapes.

Some people even hang their lighting from the greenhouse frame! Simply wrap the wire round so it’s at the height you need(check with temp gun/put thermostat in, 18-21 inches for uv I recommend) then secure with cable ties.
I’ve also included examples of stands people make/buy. You could throw some pvc covering over the stands if youre struggling for a topper, but again if you do that, I’d put lining down under the base to stop condensate.

For a water dish a shallow terracotta saucer is considered safest, they have grip in the event your tortoise flips themselves, most pet store options are a known hazard. The one you’re using is quite smooth.

Definitely try and up soaks to weekly.

Ignore whatever else is in these enclosures in the photos, they’re just to give you an idea👍

I’d also always recommend getting your hands on a temp gun, they’re SO handy when setting up a new environment or for checking your monitors are correct🙂

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

hi gents, this is a response to both @Tom and @Littleredfootbigredheart

First thanks for the replies,

For food I have been using a supplier on ebay, (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/145579358719) its been really good at feeding him, lots of variety. However the last 2 weeks, due to super hot weather the food wasn't the greatest / much of it and also I had been then also implementing grocery store greens, rocket etc. I haven't been using Ace High (my supplement) however I do occasionally add sprinkles of it.

I unfortunately cannot let him outside, I have a very small garden, the weather is terrible where I live and lots of vicious birds where I live as well as cats and such. I live in a city. Primarily seagulls being the main pain here as they go for anything.

The UV tube is at the low end of what is required so I leave it on for longer, it is 6 and a half inches from the substrate. @Alex and the Redfoot said "If the lamp is correct (Desert, 12% or 10.0) - then UVB output is at lower margin of recommended." when I provided a photo. (thanks Alex!) I also will provide the same photo I took a while back.

I haven't been soaking him nearly as much as I should. I aim for once a week but sometimes I have forgot and it will be about 2-3 weeks what I'm aware is bad, he has had a bath today however. He however never seems to sit still always tries to get out and simply seems to hate water so I haven't bathed him much. If I do it was only for about 5-10 mins.

I have no idea what size I eventually plan to house him in, I aspire to move out my current house in about 5 years and I currently have a 4ft vivarium so hopefully that can do for him for now, but once I have the space im getting a much larger space for him to live a great life in.

Under the basking lamp is not certain, its about 35-40 occasionally. Hot side goes to a bout 32-35 and the cold side is about 25 (all degrees C). That is another thing, he has been under the basking lamp a lot recently, not like his usual behaviour, not sure bc the hot / cold weather England has been having. one min hot one min freezing cold and wet.

The humidity is still an issue, I have to crack the glass open so it doesn't get too hot and allow ventilation, however doing that the humidity drops. I do not have a humidity checker what I still do need to buy however I also do not know how to get humidity up. I attempted pouring water then stir up the substrate but it just leaked.

For substrate I am indeed using orchid bark fine.

I apologise if stuff I say or ask triggers the expects but I really am new still. I love this little guy but don't know the goods from bads and I know also most/if not all tortoises are unique so they react to different stuff individually.

Here is the vivarium setup,

Everything is on a timer aside from the backup heat that is on a sensor to prevent it getting too cold.

I want to get a better food / water bowl for him as I want to take both out at same time and put both in at the same time but I feel like they take too much room up atm, hence I have the water then put food on the slate, however a bowl would make lots less mess when adding supplements such as the ace high powder. If anyone could give me recommendations for some Ceramic bowls and sizes for these bowls so I can create a better feeding ground for him please do let me know.

Hopefully this answers everything that has been asked, do let me know if you wish to know other stuff

Thank you all

Hello!
Thanks for posting the UVB lamp label (perhaps, I have overlooked it in your older posts). "Euro Range" are a bit cheaper and a bit weaker versions of D3+ lamps (10% UVB output instead of 12% for Desert series). At 6.5 inches under the middle of the lamp you will get approximate UVI of 3-3.5 (now even less, because this lamp was in use for 6 months). After 9 months this lamp will be an ineffective UVB source.

You can buy a replacement lamp or get a short (24") T5 HO fixture and lamp (Arcadia ProT5 Desert, mentioned a dozen of times, it seems). T5 lamp mounted at 21" and on 4-hour timer will serve you for 3-4 years. And then you can lower it to 14-16" eventually to maintain optimal UVB level for even longer time (something I would not recommend doing without a Solarmeter 6.5).

 

[Tom]

For food I have been using a supplier on ebay, (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/145579358719) its been really good at feeding him, lots of variety. However the last 2 weeks, due to super hot weather the food wasn't the greatest / much of it and also I had been then also implementing grocery store greens, rocket etc. I haven't been using Ace High (my supplement) however I do occasionally add sprinkles of it.

That food mix looks pretty good. We don't have anything like that over here that I know of. Still, I would look to add other things like grape leaves, weeds, flowers etc... Arugula, cilantro, collard greens and other things from the store are good for variety too.

We don't have Ace High over here, so I had to look it up. It appears to be a vitamin supplement. It says it is high in vitamins A, C, and E. Tortoises don't need A, and some supplements give them too much. I wouldn't use that. Your diet is already mixed enough that you really don't need a vitamin supplement. I would use a calcium supplement once or twice a week and that is all you should need with that mixed diet you are using.

I unfortunately cannot let him outside, I have a very small garden, the weather is terrible where I live and lots of vicious birds where I live as well as cats and such. I live in a city. Primarily seagulls being the main pain here as they go for anything.

Everybody has predators every where in the world. Make an enclosure that protects your tortoise from them.

The weather can't always be terrible. The sun must shine once in a while for part of the year. Summer occurs in the UK too. Figure out how to make this work for the benefit of your tortoise. A small dog kennel or chicken coop can work. Just make a visual barrier around the bottom. Ask for help to build something if you don't know how. Hire someone to help if need be. Tortoises are solar powered.

The UV tube is at the low end of what is required so I leave it on for longer, it is 6 and a half inches from the substrate. @Alex and the Redfoot said "If the lamp is correct (Desert, 12% or 10.0) - then UVB output is at lower margin of recommended." when I provided a photo. (thanks Alex!) I also will provide the same photo I took a while back.

Since your tortoise is never getting outside time, it is important to use a good quality indoor UV tube, and use it correctly. Your tube is the old T8 style. They don't make much UV. Without a meter we are only guessing at the correct mounting height and UV levels. It might be WAY too much, or it might be not nearly enough.

Get an Arcadia 12% ProT5 kit. Mount it at the correct height and use a meter to verify your UV levels. If you can't get him outside, it is imperative that you do inside correctly. For tortoises that don't get outside time and direct sunshine, indoor UV MUST be done correctly and verified with a Solarmeter 6.5.

I haven't been soaking him nearly as much as I should. I aim for once a week but sometimes I have forgot and it will be about 2-3 weeks what I'm aware is bad, he has had a bath today however. He however never seems to sit still always tries to get out and simply seems to hate water so I haven't bathed him much. If I do it was only for about 5-10 mins.

Your tortoise is demonstrating to you that it is dehydrated and constipated. Soak it every day for at least 30-40 minutes. Keep the water warm the entire time, and don't worry about the tortoise trying to climb out. That is good exercise and stimulation. We call that "the tortoise treadmill".

The humidity is still an issue, I have to crack the glass open so it doesn't get too hot and allow ventilation, however doing that the humidity drops. I do not have a humidity checker what I still do need to buy however I also do not know how to get humidity up. I attempted pouring water then stir up the substrate but it just leaked.

If your enclosure is overheating, that means you need a lower wattage basking bulb.

If your enclosure is leaking, you need to get something different that doesn't leak, or try to stop the leaks as suggested.

Low humidity is contributing to the dehydration and lumpy shell growth.

I apologise if stuff I say or ask triggers the expects but I really am new still. I love this little guy but don't know the goods from bads and I know also most/if not all tortoises are unique so they react to different stuff individually.

No apology necessary. The only thing your comments and questions trigger is a desire to answer them and try to help you out. We want you to succeed and have a happy tortoise experience, and we want your tortoise to remain healthy.

For food and water use terra cotta plant saucers sunk into the substrate. These are cheap, safe, and they work the best.

Feel free to join in conversations and ask all your questions. You are welcome here and you are among friends who want to help you.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

An outdoor area to enjoy during summer would be great, you can supervise if you’re nervous and bring them in at night.
As your guys is primarily going to be indoors I’d personally prioritise getting that upgraded first.

Daily soaks like Tom suggested would be very ideal and beneficial for your tort right now, if you can’t always do daily, do as many times a week as possible, and make it a 20-30minute soak instead of 10🙂

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

The weather can't always be terrible. The sun must shine once in a while for part of the year. Summer occurs in the UK too. Figure out how to make this work for the benefit of your tortoise. A small dog kennel or chicken coop can work. Just make a visual barrier around the bottom. Ask for help to build something if you don't know how. Hire someone to help if need be. Tortoises are solar powered.

Also for what it’s worth, being from the uk myself, I can safely say our weather is pretty terrible almost all year round😂
Our summer this year has been very mild baring the odd heat wave, and very wet, like none stop wetness haha🙃

 

[Tom]

Also for what it’s worth, being from the uk myself, I can safely say our weather is pretty terrible almost all year round😂
Our summer this year has been very mild baring the odd heat wave, and very wet, like none stop wetness haha🙃

I couldn't live that way. That's like people who live in Seattle here. Its the suicide capital of the world, and the weather is a big factor in that. I need sunshine and warmth. I'd be perfectly happy on some equatorial tropical island that is 85 degrees all day every day all year long.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

I couldn't live that way. That's like people who live in Seattle here. It’s the suicide capital of the world, and the weather is a big factor in that. I need sunshine and warmth. I'd be perfectly happy on some equatorial tropical island that is 85 degrees all day every day all year long.

Seasonal depression is pretty rampant here😬we’re a very cold wet country.. tbh though because I’m so climatized to it, for me anything above 23c and I’m suffering😂
I complain as soon as it hits the 20’s🤣

 

[Tom]

Seasonal depression is pretty rampant here😬we’re a very cold wet country.. tbh though because I’m so climatized to it, for me anything above 23c and I’m suffering😂
I complain as soon as it hits the 20’s🤣

Its all about perspective, isn't it? We had a very rare hot day last week that reached 49C. Not exaggerating. It was like living in an oven. Now, several days later, it was only 39C, and I was commenting to my wife how it doesn't "feel" all that hot. We just get used to whatever our weather is, don't we? Our nights are still dropping down to 15-16C.

My measure of good weather for the last couple of decades is how favorable it is for my tortoises. As in, "Ahhh... This is good tortoise weather!" or, "Man... this is NOT good tortoise weather."

 

[zovick]

I couldn't live that way. That's like people who live in Seattle here. Its the suicide capital of the world, and the weather is a big factor in that. I need sunshine and warmth. I'd be perfectly happy on some equatorial tropical island that is 85 degrees all day every day all year long.

Not quite equatorial, but you could move to Hawaii. If you can get over feeling island-bound, you probably would like it there. Average temps in many areas are about 78-80F.

 

[Tom]

Not quite equatorial, but you could move to Hawaii. If you can get over feeling island-bound, you probably would like it there. Average temps in many areas are about 78-80F.

I've been there. I do like it. I think I prefer warmer areas though like Moorea or some parts of tropical Mexico.

 

[Kisobel]

Thanks for the in depth reply!

For the diet side of things perhaps you’ll find this website below handy to look through! If you click on the wildflowers section there’s so many plants that grow perfectly in uk climate, you perhaps you could order some seeds online, plant them in organic soil in a planter outside tortoise won’t have access to. You can forage from them as they grow🙂

The Tortoise Table - Home

The Tortoise Table plant database and resource site for Tortoise owners

www.thetortoisetable.org.uk

Yes from my understanding t8 bulbs are less powerful, when it comes time to replace I’d go for a t5 bulb with the same brand, I’ll go into that below.

Have you got a temp gun to check your temp under the basking light? If not I’d recommend one, they’re very useful.

Does the enclosure get too hot with just the basking light running? Because if the thermostat the CHE is on, is set to a night time temperature it shouldn’t be getting too warm in there, what watt is your floodlight? I wouldn’t worry about the ventilation side of things with opening the glass, opening up to daily husbandries is enough air exchange.

Does your enclosure have a lining? If not the pours will definitely cause leaks, I’d recommend putting some cheap pond liner, or a mould resistant shower curtain under the substrate to stop leaks, if your bottom layer of substrate is damp in an enclosed chamber like yours, humidity should be fine, the sooner you can get something to measure that the better.

I’m going to include some information below on the types of equipment to use, how to maintain humidity, and a cost effective way for you to get a suitable sized enclosure, hopefully it helps inspire an idea for you🙂

Basking light should be an incandescent floodlight(example attached) on a 12 hour timer.

Basking temperature directly under the floodlight should be 95-100f. The rest of the enclosure should be ranging 75-80 during the day.

You may also wish to add ambient lighting on the same timer, providing shady areas with hides and safe plants.

Then CHE/CHE’s(ceramic heat emitters) always on a thermostat, for night heat if your house drops below 60’s at night. Set the thermostat for a night temperature place the probe in their cooler end.

Uv should be a t5 fluorescent tube, avoid the compact and coil uv bulbs, they don’t give out enough uv and can hurt the tortoises eyes. The uv can be on a 4 hour timer from noon. I’ve attached the one I recommended you upgrade to when the time comes🙂

With lighting always avoid anything labelled halogen or mercury vapour.

For substrates, either coco coir, dampened and packed down by hand as a base, with a layer of orchid(fir not pine) bark or forest floor on top, or just the orchid bark/forest floor. Never use anything with sand mixed in, no top soils and no kinds of moss.

You want to aim to have the bottom layer of substrate damp, to do this pour lukewarm water into the corners, not loads but enough to dampen the entire bottom layer. To stop that top layer getting a little too dry/dusty, mix the substrate now n then, which also helps boosting humidity or give the top a spray. Check your monitors and substrate to do the pours as and when needed. I don’t recommend misters or foggers, they get the air too wet and cause respiratory problems.

Humidity for young growing tortoises needs to be maintained around 80%, 24/7, you’ll find that difficult to achieve with an open top so it’s good you’ve got a closed chamber, for the set up I’m recommending I’d get a greenhouse cover. Once the tortoise is older a cover won’t be needed.

To maintain humidity whilst the tortoise is younger a greenhouse style set up works well and provides more space, as an adult this tortoise is going to ideally need a minimum of an 8x4, the bigger you go the better, it’s ideal if you can build your own base to go as big as you can for the room you have.

If you can’t find an exact fit for your base with the cover, then place it over like the one with the white base in the photo, I’d put lining down under the base and cover though to stop condensate getting on your floor.
When making your base, just make sure the material is safe, some use flower beds or just make their own, for both these options I’d line with cheap pond liner to protect the base, making sure the liner goes up the sides too and make sure those sides are deep enough to prevent escapes.

Some people even hang their lighting from the greenhouse frame! Simply wrap the wire round so it’s at the height you need(check with temp gun/put thermostat in, 18-21 inches for uv I recommend) then secure with cable ties.
I’ve also included examples of stands people make/buy. You could throw some pvc covering over the stands if youre struggling for a topper, but again if you do that, I’d put lining down under the base to stop condensate.

For a water dish a shallow terracotta saucer is considered safest, they have grip in the event your tortoise flips themselves, most pet store options are a known hazard. The one you’re using is quite smooth.

Definitely try and up soaks to weekly.

Ignore whatever else is in these enclosures in the photos, they’re just to give you an idea👍

I’d also always recommend getting your hands on a temp gun, they’re SO handy when setting up a new environment or for checking your monitors are correct🙂

Sorry for the late response I had a headache so just went to bed!

I have just ordered the T5 you provided in the image below, so thank you

I do not have a temp gun, however it does read to 35-40 when I did have one but it broke. The basking light thing you also provided below is the exact one I am using.

Does the enclosure get too hot with just the basking light running? Because if the thermostat the CHE is on, is set to a night time temperature it shouldn’t be getting too warm in there, what watt is your floodlight? I wouldn’t worry about the ventilation side of things with opening the glass, opening up to daily husbandries is enough air exchange.

Yeah the enclosure does get too hot however this could also be due to it being in my bedroom, I have a computer that heats up the room due to it being quite a gaming pc as well as my brother the room over so upstairs gets warm. This is why I open up the sides to let the heat out a bit. As previously said, I have the same heat light so it is 75 Watts. Is there any way I can keep the glass closed however not get it too hot?

Does your enclosure have a lining? If not the pours will definitely cause leaks, I’d recommend putting some cheap pond liner, or a mould resistant shower curtain under the substrate to stop leaks, if your bottom layer of substrate is damp in an enclosed chamber like yours, humidity should be fine, the sooner you can get something to measure that the better.

No my enclosure does not have lining, this is due to the original incorrect information I was told off the shop it was sold by, I got told I want essentially NO moisture in his enclosure, so I never added it in to allow moisture to escape. I now see the issue...

So currently I'm only using "Swell Reptile Premium Orchid Bark Fine", I have about 40L of it down, would you recommend 10L for a lower base of coco coir then the upper layer Orchid Bark? I mean I only recently changed it so it would get re changed around Christmas time. I aim to change the substrate 3 times a year.

Humidity for young growing tortoises needs to be maintained around 80%, 24/7, you’ll find that difficult to achieve with an open top so it’s good you’ve got a closed chamber, for the set up I’m recommending I’d get a greenhouse cover. Once the tortoise is older a cover won’t be needed.

I ordered a humidity and temp stat that I am going to place into the hot side as that probably counts more, however do you mean get a greenhouse cover if I had an open top? Say I also cannot achieve 80% humidity, what is the leniency on it?

For when he is older I will be making a custom enclosure, it will be rather big and take up most of an entire wall. But only once I move out can I achieve this.

The pond liner honestly isn't a bad idea, I will def either do this, or fully get some sort of material to fill in the gaps.

I have soaked herman today for about 30 mins (Herman is my Hermann tortoises name, very original lol), as its my 4 days off I'm going to soak him every day in these 4 days, then when at work I can't as I work 12 hours a day and his enclosure is on 12 hours timer so I don't see him for 4 days. Hopefully this can work anyways, I could always ask my mother to do a quick 10 min bath if needed as she doesn't get a lot of time!

Thank you for all that additional information that is all useful stuff and that website has been saved.
One question I don't understand is when ppl talk about the UV and some sorta measurement for it? I have no marks or whatever in my vivarium to say how high it is, I just measured it. This new T5 one I bough, how high does it need to be? at the very very top as its stronger? I also believe this one is shorter so do I have it in the middle? the cold side? the hot side? not a clue.

 

[Kisobel]

That food mix looks pretty good. We don't have anything like that over here that I know of. Still, I would look to add other things like grape leaves, weeds, flowers etc... Arugula, cilantro, collard greens and other things from the store are good for variety too.

We don't have Ace High over here, so I had to look it up. It appears to be a vitamin supplement. It says it is high in vitamins A, C, and E. Tortoises don't need A, and some supplements give them too much. I wouldn't use that. Your diet is already mixed enough that you really don't need a vitamin supplement. I would use a calcium supplement once or twice a week and that is all you should need with that mixed diet you are using.


Everybody has predators every where in the world. Make an enclosure that protects your tortoise from them.

The weather can't always be terrible. The sun must shine once in a while for part of the year. Summer occurs in the UK too. Figure out how to make this work for the benefit of your tortoise. A small dog kennel or chicken coop can work. Just make a visual barrier around the bottom. Ask for help to build something if you don't know how. Hire someone to help if need be. Tortoises are solar powered.


Since your tortoise is never getting outside time, it is important to use a good quality indoor UV tube, and use it correctly. Your tube is the old T8 style. They don't make much UV. Without a meter we are only guessing at the correct mounting height and UV levels. It might be WAY too much, or it might be not nearly enough.

Get an Arcadia 12% ProT5 kit. Mount it at the correct height and use a meter to verify your UV levels. If you can't get him outside, it is imperative that you do inside correctly. For tortoises that don't get outside time and direct sunshine, indoor UV MUST be done correctly and verified with a Solarmeter 6.5.


Your tortoise is demonstrating to you that it is dehydrated and constipated. Soak it every day for at least 30-40 minutes. Keep the water warm the entire time, and don't worry about the tortoise trying to climb out. That is good exercise and stimulation. We call that "the tortoise treadmill".


If your enclosure is overheating, that means you need a lower wattage basking bulb.

If your enclosure is leaking, you need to get something different that doesn't leak, or try to stop the leaks as suggested.

Low humidity is contributing to the dehydration and lumpy shell growth.


No apology necessary. The only thing your comments and questions trigger is a desire to answer them and try to help you out. We want you to succeed and have a happy tortoise experience, and we want your tortoise to remain healthy.

For food and water use terra cotta plant saucers sunk into the substrate. These are cheap, safe, and they work the best.

Feel free to join in conversations and ask all your questions. You are welcome here and you are among friends who want to help you.

The main shop I would use for grocery shopping is Asda and we don't seem to have a larger variety of additional greens for the tortoise unless there is an exact grocery store guide, would be good to create one actually. I may do so for UK people

I used ace high as it was advised I used it back when my little guy was not feeling great (turns out lad just had all the wrong setup that you later helped me fix and he all happy now)

The rest of this was answered in my response to @Littleredfootbigredheart Sorry I forgot to @ you in it too.

Thank you for the help btw, just want the best for the little guy.

An additional thing tho, recently he has been sleeping directly under the heat lamp, like napping. when he sleeps fully he goes and hides. Is this normal to nap in the open? I always though it was peculiar behaviour, I provided a photo.

It still terrifies me with the thought or anything remotely similar to him being lethargic due to him being ill when I first got him. Does he seem alright?

However you saying this,

The weather can't always be terrible. The sun must shine once in a while for part of the year. Summer occurs in the UK too.

Come to England and you will see how crap the weather is most / if not all year around, the heatwaves are either wayy too hot and rarely happen. Or there is nothing but rain. The last 5-6 days where I live right now has been badly raining, the sun may shine in a few days however the actual "Air" will still be -1298418. UK weather makes no sense.

 

[Kisobel]

An outdoor area to enjoy during summer would be great, you can supervise if you’re nervous and bring them in at night.
As your guys is primarily going to be indoors I’d personally prioritise getting that upgraded first.

Daily soaks like Tom suggested would be very ideal and beneficial for your tort right now, if you can’t always do daily, do as many times a week as possible, and make it a 20-30minute soak instead of 10🙂

yep, I have purchased the upgrade, bought some monitors as I said too.

I will aim to try get an outdoor thing, preferably something that I can assemble and disassemble with ease.

I will aim to get him 20-30 min soaks at least 4 times a week. My weeks currently are 8 days as I work 4 on 4 off, its much easier for me to see it that way, so I will do it on my days off as said B)