My Greek hatchling is lethargic.

[ismail]

For the last couple of weeks i noticed that one of my greeks (hatched September 12) is not eating as much as the other two are eating. yesterday, when he woke up, i noticed some mucus on his left eye. i used some saline water drops to clear it away and placed him in a hospital box with tissue paper instead of substrate. Now his eye seems normal. it is not swollen, and this morning there was no mucus. Yet he is still lethargic and tends to sleep even during his bath soaks, (Wheares his brothers try to manouvre themselves out of the water!)

Now, my first question is whether its normal for greeks to have some mucus on their eyes in the morning? and whether you know what i can do to make him eat.

 

[luvpetz27]

Hi, I dont know much about the kind of tort you have. I bet you will hear from someone soon.
Good luck!!

 

[Laura]

what kind of lights, Temps, Diet.
Could the other two be bullying?

 

[wellington]

As Laura asked, a run down of your enclosure, temps, humidity, substrate, etc and type of items using, coil bulb, CHE, mvb, etc would help us. Also, you can try to do the carrot baby food soaks. I would also keep him warmer then norm.

 

[ismail]

My Substrate is 70% compost and 30% sterilized play pit sand.
Light is an MVB, yet i must admit that when i started, my setup had (a month ago) a CFL, however i only kept it for a few days before i read all your negative feedback. i can't latch the mucus with the bulb as the mucus showed more than twenty days after i switched bulbs.
humidity is at 40-50%
Temp 27deg C basking, 21degC in the other corner
I give them bath soaks in water with vitamins everyday
I can't see any form of bullying altough i must admit that he started his lethargy when i introduced one of his brothers in the vivarium he was sharing with his sister. (i know that i can't sex 2 month old hatchlings but my daughter said she could so now i have to abide!!) yet now that i seperated them he still is lethargic

 

[ismail]

Help!! my greek is not eating

So i have three 5 month old greeks, probably nabeulensis. Two of them are doing fine, eating, looking for food and sleeping! They do their baths alone, yet i still soak them. They have a spot at 28deg, and the other end at 23deg. I feed them mainly dandelions, sowthistle, lamb's lettuce, hibiscus leaves/flowers, cactus pads (which they still don't eat) and komodo tortoise food. Occasionally (once in a month) i give them spinach, small larvae, (which they seem they really like), and turnip leaves.

My problem is with my third tortoise who i call Tom. He seemed less interested in food from day one. so after a couple of weeks i seperated him from his brothers as i thought he was being bullied. Yet there was no improvement. He alwyas seemed very normal, just lethargic and used to eat just once in a week. One day i noticed mucus in his eye so i suspected an eye infection. For a week i applied saline water and he become more active and started eating. his favourite food were the larvae (which i must admit i gave him everyday as i tought some food is better than none - at least until he'll pass the infection)

After 15 days he started being lethargic again. I decided to take him to the vet. he seemed quite happy with him and told me he is the healtiest and heaviest (24g vice the 32g and 34g of his brothers) he ever saw! this made me think i was probably overreacting.

Now a month passed from my visit to the vet and Tom is so lethargic that when i poke his foot there is no reaction. he used to retreat, now he just remains still.

I always look at his nostrils to see whether there is any mucus and never noticed anything, however, yesterday i saw him make some water bubbles from his mouth. I read that this is a symptom of RI and that normally baytril is applied. I'm a bird breeder and do have some baytril at home. will some of you gurus recommend me a dosage?

Also, do you think something else maybe the culprit for him being so apathetic? I really would like him to thrive but i am afraid he'll soon pass away.

Sorry for being long and i look forward for your replies!

 

[ismail]

My Substrate is 70% compost and 30% sterilized play pit sand.
Light is an MVB, yet i must admit that when i started, my setup had (a month ago) a CFL, however i only kept it for a few days before i read all your negative feedback. i can't latch the mucus with the bulb as the mucus showed more than twenty days after i switched bulbs.
humidity is at 40-50%
Temp 27deg C basking, 21degC in the other corner
I give them bath soaks in water with vitamins everyday
I can't see any form of bullying altough i must admit that he started his lethargy when i introduced one of his brothers in the vivarium he was sharing with his sister. (i know that i can't sex 2 month old hatchlings but my daughter said she could so now i have to abide!!) yet now that i seperated them he still is lethargic

anyone there?:shy:

 

[Tim/Robin]

It is not normal to have any eye discharge. Your basking area is not hot enough. You need to shoot for about 35C for the basking area. Keeping them too cool will cause lethargy. I suggest increasing the basking temp. Make sure you continue the daily soaking.

 

[biochemnerd808]

Hi again! Sorry to hear one of your little torts may be sick.

I'm so glad to hear you got an MVB. Those are good bulbs. Do you have a laser temp gun so you can check the temp right in the hot spot under the bulb? 27 degrees C is a little cool, as mentioned. You want to aim for 95-100 degrees F, which is 35-37 degrees Celsius. This refers to the temp RIGHT under the bulb - the area around the bulb is then probably around 27-30 degrees, and that's fine. You can adjust the temp by moving the bulb a little closer to the substrate, OR by putting some rocks under the bulb so the little torts are closer to the light (and get warmed from below by the warm rocks).

Hopefully the increased heat will help your little tortoise. Good that you washed out his eye - if it happens again, I'd recommend washing it again. You might soak the little tortoise in warm water that has baby food in it - so he gets some nutrients when he drinks as he soaks.

It is not normal to have any eye discharge. Your basking area is not hot enough. You need to shoot for about 35C for the basking area. Keeping them too cool will cause lethargy. I suggest increasing the basking temp. Make sure you continue the daily soaking.

 

[lvstorts]

RE: Help!! my greek is not eating

If I calculate the C to F conversion I arrive at 82F. I would recommend increasing the heat to at least 90F to 95F. I think another vet visit is in order...is the vet an actual reptile vet? If he indeed has a RI its a race against time when they are that young. Increase its heat and get him to the vet!

As for Batryil, it's a common antibiotic but I believe the policy of this forum does not allow for dosages to be recommended.

I'm sure others will chime in with advice.

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[ascott]

RE: Help!! my greek is not eating

May we see a pic of the little one? Of his face and of his limbs please...

 

[ismail]

I aimed at 28deg because i read in other threads that they can become dehydrated. Anyways, i lowered the ceramic heater and the temp under the lamp is now 94degF, i'll let it settle and lower it a bit more. I'll aim to keep it 100degF. At least i noticed that as i increased the temperature he opened his eyes!

As from yesterday i started adding carrot and potato baby food to his daily soaks. After the bath he tries to nibble some dandelion but seems so lethargic that he had not enough strength to cut the leave

I will continue soaking and monitoring temperature.

I will post some pics later...

Thanks all for your input!

 

[ismail]

RE: Help!! my greek is not eating

i increased temperature to 100degF under basking area and am soaking him in baby carrot and potato soup diluted in warm water. at least he opened his eyes...

i will upload some pics later...

thanks for your help!

 

[colatoise]

RE: Help!! my greek is not eating

Definitely get to a vet. The increased temps should help. If you are soaking daily there shouldn't be risk of dehydration. I feed mine a mix of spring mix, collards, mustard greens, and zoo med tortoise pellets soaked until moist.

 

[biochemnerd808]

If your little one hasn't eaten in a few days and it seems to be getting too weak, you may put some leaves and a little water and a little calcium in a blender, then feed that with a syringe. They are so small, they won't need much. You should be able to get the plastic tip of the syringe into its mouth by carefully pressing in at the corner of it's mouth. Just give a few drops, then let it rest, then give a few more drops later.

I aimed at 28deg because i read in other threads that they can become dehydrated. Anyways, i lowered the ceramic heater and the temp under the lamp is now 94degF, i'll let it settle and lower it a bit more. I'll aim to keep it 100degF. At least i noticed that as i increased the temperature he opened his eyes!

As from yesterday i started adding carrot and potato baby food to his daily soaks. After the bath he tries to nibble some dandelion but seems so lethargic that he had not enough strength to cut the leave

I will continue soaking and monitoring temperature.

I will post some pics later...

Thanks all for your input!

 

[ismail]

RE: My Greek hatchling is lethargic. - UPDATE1

So i increased his basking temperature. Right under the che is 110degF. I started soaking him twice daily in lukewarm water with carrot baby food in it. I can observe him drinking whreas in the past he didn't immerse his head in the water. He is much more active now. he looks for food, yet he seems too unwell to chew big leaves. when i cut the leaves he tries to pick them up unsuccessfully. Yesterday i placed the teaspoon full of babyfood next to his mouth and he started eating it! So this is what i am feeding him right now.

i think you were right, the temperaute made him lethargic. what surprizes me is how come his other two brothers are happy in the same old setup. Nonetheless tomorrow i'll try and blend some sowthistle leaves and supplements with the baby food.

Thanks all for the help. i'll keep you uodated. As regards the photos i will try and find a better camera because the good photos focusing on the eyes are too big to upload, whereas with the small sized photos resolution you cannot recognize the eye from the nose! (which does not help!)

Anyways, all the best to a happy new year mto you and your loved ones.

ismail

 

[biochemnerd808]

RE: My Greek hatchling is lethargic. - UPDATE1

I am so glad to hear that your little guy seems to be on the mend!

My guess is that the other two might just be stronger, so they weren't as bothered by the lower basking temp... good that you caught it now. I am sure that with the more frequent soaks, the increased temp, and the baby food he'll be as good as new before you know it!

Here's a link (RESIZING AP)to a handy little application that will help you resize a pic. Make sure you save a copy of the 'big' version before resizing. Then you can post the resized version on here if you'd like....

So i increased his basking temperature. Right under the che is 110degF. I started soaking him twice daily in lukewarm water with carrot baby food in it. I can observe him drinking whreas in the past he didn't immerse his head in the water. He is much more active now. he looks for food, yet he seems too unwell to chew big leaves. when i cut the leaves he tries to pick them up unsuccessfully. Yesterday i placed the teaspoon full of babyfood next to his mouth and he started eating it! So this is what i am feeding him right now.

i think you were right, the temperaute made him lethargic. what surprizes me is how come his other two brothers are happy in the same old setup. Nonetheless tomorrow i'll try and blend some sowthistle leaves and supplements with the baby food.

Thanks all for the help. i'll keep you uodated. As regards the photos i will try and find a better camera because the good photos focusing on the eyes are too big to upload, whereas with the small sized photos resolution you cannot recognize the eye from the nose! (which does not help!)

Anyways, all the best to a happy new year mto you and your loved ones.

ismail

 

[ismail]

So, these are some pictures of Tom. What i forgot to mention is that his underbelly is rather soft compared to his brothers..

What do you think of his eyes? are they considered as swollen? Also, are the limbs too thin? i notice that he has some relative strentgh in them...Do you suggest he is unhealthy from these pictures?

Like yesterday, he is much more active than when i first posted, but he has not yet ate any leaves just babyfood. Tomorrow i go and get a syringe and will give him some blended leaves and calcium like you suggested.

Thanks to all for your help.

 

[ismail]

RE: Help!! my greek is not eating

May we see a pic of the little one? Of his face and of his limbs please...

Here you go

What do you think of his eyes? and the limbs?

He is much more active now after regular soaks in carrot food and increases basking temperature but he still is not strong enough to cut leaves to eat them. furthermore, when i cut the leaves in small bits he does not manage to chew them.

 

[ismail]

Anyone there plsssss?! :shy: