My Redfoot pyramiding study

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Someone liked one of my comments on this post today so I was reminded of this post and figured I would share the results of my efforts with my first hatchling. Very happy with how she has turned out

Stunning!!

 

[ZEROPILOT]

Someone liked one of my comments on this post today so I was reminded of this post and figured I would share the results of my efforts with my first hatchling. Very happy with how she has turned out

I had forgotten about it also.
Nice work

 

[Anyfoot]

This is true according to @Markw84 . I'm running some experiments to determine right now. Raising some with no inside UV. Need more time.

How did this experiment turn out Tom?

 

[wellington]

My theory is that somehow, someway artificial UVB is one of the things possibly contributing to Pyramiding.

That's what I was wondering. That or the artificial heat we need to provide, whether che or basking bulb or Rhp.

 

[Anyfoot]

Do you think that the weathering causes that perfect smoothness?

I think it plays a role. On females you can see where males have mounted and created smooth areas. So I’d imagine in the undergrowth, burrows and weather has some toll on the carapace. The plastron is usually smoother and I’ve always assumed that’s because of constant abrasion on ground objects. Some of mine are stubborn as hell and will spend ages trying to push through a bush instead of going around it. . Thats just one bush, imagine in the wild with dense foliage, try probably be all day pushing through.

 

[Anyfoot]

@ZEROPILOT Look at these a saw in a zoo.

Obviously wild caught. Look closely and you can see growth rings. But it also looks like wear has smoothed them off to me.

 

[Anyfoot]

I’ve often wondered if drought, dry periods play a role too. Does the carapace dry out that much that abrasion wears it away faster.


Kind of like how chalk reacts, when dry it wears fast, when wet it wears slowly.

 

[ZEROPILOT]

@ZEROPILOT Look at these a saw in a zoo.

Obviously wild caught. Look closely and you can see growth rings. But it also looks like wear has smoothed them off to me.

I've seen bowling balls that were less smooth. They also look to be nice and "chunky" absolute specimens of good health

 

[Anyfoot]

So with this wild caught tortoise still showing growth rings. Does it prove that abrasion is what gives the marble effect. Has this tortoise been taken out of the wild before abrasion took full effect. Or is the marble affect related to age and deterioration of the older keratin surface?

 

[ZEROPILOT]

So with this wild caught tortoise still showing growth rings. Does it prove that abrasion is what gives the marble effect. Has this tortoise been taken out of the wild before abrasion took full effect. Or is the marble affect related to age and deterioration of the older keratin surface?

I can't argue against that excellent theory. Especially since I makes perfect sense

 

[Anyfoot]

I can't argue against that excellent theory. Especially since I makes perfect sense

It definitely rules out the ‘growing them super slow gives a marble effect’ theory imo.

 

[None]

Any way to emulate the natural erosion? Anyone with experience “sanding” the carapace gradually? Like daily pass fine sand paper in the carapace just one time eventually will cause that smooth looking. Just curious. Is it healthy, have been done before?

 

[Anyfoot]

Any way to emulate the natural erosion? Anyone with experience “sanding” the carapace gradually? Like daily pass fine sand paper in the carapace just one time eventually will cause that smooth looking. Just curious. Is it healthy, have been done before?

I wouldn’t advise sanding your tortoise
People have tried to create artificial abrasion using brushes.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Any way to emulate the natural erosion? Anyone with experience “sanding” the carapace gradually? Like daily pass fine sand paper in the carapace just one time eventually will cause that smooth looking. Just curious. Is it healthy, have been done before?

Sand paper sounds a little too harsh. Maybe adding stuff in their enclosure that would wear it down more naturally (branches to go under, plants, tight spots etc. ?

 

[Anyfoot]

I don’t think it’s just abrasion alone.

Other things to consider.


Natural aging
Harsh dry arid conditions.
Monsoon conditions
Windy conditions (sandstorm for example)
Burrows.
Dense underbrush.


I also notice the front toenails on wild torts are extremely worn compared to captive tortoises. So that shows they are doing a lot of digging, or pushing through dense undergrowth, which in turn could be related to carapace wear.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

I don’t think it’s just abrasion alone.

Other things to consider.


Natural aging
Harsh dry arid conditions.
Monsoon conditions
Windy conditions (sandstorm for example)
Burrows.
Dense underbrush.


I also notice the front toenails on wild torts are extremely worn compared to captive tortoises. So that shows they are doing a lot of digging, or pushing through dense undergrowth, which in turn could be related to carapace wear.

Yeah, it definitely must be multiple things. What we should recreate in the captivity and what not is a whole different conversation that maybe deserves it's own thread.

 

[ZEROPILOT]

Any way to emulate the natural erosion? Anyone with experience “sanding” the carapace gradually? Like daily pass fine sand paper in the carapace just one time eventually will cause that smooth looking. Just curious. Is it healthy, have been done before?

Heavily planted enclosures with lots of low, dense bushes would probably work.
But none of us do that because it'd take a day and a half to find each tort!

 

[ZEROPILOT]

I don’t think it’s just abrasion alone.

Other things to consider.


Natural aging
Harsh dry arid conditions.
Monsoon conditions
Windy conditions (sandstorm for example)
Burrows.
Dense underbrush.


I also notice the front toenails on wild torts are extremely worn compared to captive tortoises. So that shows they are doing a lot of digging, or pushing through dense undergrowth, which in turn could be related to carapace wear.

Their shape in general is also just a bit different to me. Lower. Wider. Is it just me? Not to mention that the adult wild collected seem to be larger than the captive born and reared. (These are my own thoughts and observations) I'm not sure if these are scientific facts. But I've seen large, "wild" Redfoot that required a second glance. Because I wasn't sure what I was looking at.

 

[ZEROPILOT]

It appears to me that the only element missing is the shell abrasion and "weathering" that comes with time.

Unfortunately, I lost contact with the member whom adopted the 'Child. (who's not active anymore)
So I can't say how smooth he or she is today. But either way, it'd still be a relatively young RF

 

[ZEROPILOT]

I’m keeping and raising my first hatchling now so I am hoping to have a nice smooth carapace. I am raising in an enclosed chamber. Time will tell.

I used to have a beautiful columbian Redfoot I believe she was. She had to have been wild caught, her shell was perfect. Lots of scratches but still smooth, I think the elements (weathering) is likely a big factor along with the wild diet. Sadly she didn’t live long after I bought her, she went downhill fast. I am always scared to buy ones that look wild caught now.

Redfoot are so easy to breed and are so prolific in areas like south Florida that even thinking about importing a wild one seems like a crime. They seldom do well after that horrible ordeal.