New Unprepared Tortoise Owner

[Tapwater]

Hey there! New tortoise owner. Fully under prepared. I was in a local small business pet shop picking up supplies for my pup and saw this little guy (or gal) in a tiny tank looking sad and thought "surely I, someone who has done zero research into tortoises can provide a better home for this".

So I bought a tank (75 gal 18x48), basking light, UVB lamp, heat pad, hideout, and reptibark and headed home.

The tank at the store said "hinge back tortoise, eats leafy greens and mushrooms, lives 30-50 years". They handed me a print out of the Royal Veterinary College care guide. As I read this 2 page document I thought "surely there must be more to it than this". Imagine my surprise when I discovered I had undertaken the responsibility level of taking care of another human. Soaking, humidity, animal protein, calcium, and all the other tasks that go along with it.

No clue if this little one is a boy or a girl. No clue on age. It's about the size of my fully open hand and I'm a rather large guy. The receipt says it's a Speke's but I understand that Belle's are sold as those to get around regulations. I wanted to hold off on a vet appointment until it was through the trauma of being re-homed but I think it's important enough to get in sooner rather than later. I found a local exotic vet that specializes in tortoises and turtles so we have an appointment Wednesday.

To be named tortie is still very skidish. If I gear near the tank within sight it retreats into the shell. It mainly sticks to the hideout (now it has one on the hot side and one on the cool side). I try to keep under the basking lamp at about 90 and general tank temp at about 80. Humidity I'm still working on (swapped repti-bark out for coco coir) we're at about 50%. I'm torn between misting with a spray bottle or just leaving the poor thing be for a few days. Basking lamp and UVB are on 9am-9pm, heat pad is under the warm hideout and on 9pm-9am. Death trap water ramp replaced with a 6 inch terracotta saucer. Cuttlebone included in tank now near the water saucer.

First couple days I gave it radish greens and shiitake mushrooms. Ate almost a full leaf the first night (left it in all night and was gone in the morning). Maybe 1/3 a leaf the second. Never touched the mushrooms. This morning I tried another leaf and some mushrooms rolled in calcium powder. Didn't touch it. Hit the grocery store at lunch today and got 50/50 spring mix with spinach, watermelon, sweet pepper rings, hard boiled eggs, white mushrooms, and a cucumber. Put a plate together with all but the eggs and a slide of cucumber at the hideout door to entice it out. Literally as I typed this out it poked its head out to munch on the cucumber. Still hasn't left the cool side hideout all day. Dug itself in and just seems set.

Couldn't tell any urination with the bark but did notice a wet spot this morning near the water saucer with the swap to coir. Had poop in the box from the trip home, 2 more the first morning home, 1 more yesterday morning, but none since. All black and tar like.

Any tips, recommendations, or corrections in what I AM doing to make sure this little one gets to Wednesday to see a vet would be highly welcome and appreciated.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Hello and welcome!

Unfortunately, we don't see many Hingeback tortoises keepers here. I think your best shot would be @2turtletom (if he's around he can help with ID and provide most current care guides and you can also check his YouTube channel: https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCMkL5log3H9fyqWOUD7NAqw) Also, I think @turtlesteve can help, too.

From my very basic knowledge of care for this species, you are on the right track. If the tank has a mesh top you can close it with tin foil - this will help to retain humidity and don't rely on misting. Probably, some fake or live potted plants (e.g. boston fern or pothos) will help him to feel more secure - you can hang the pots on the walls to preserve walking space. Water dish should be large enough for tortoise to fit in (I can't tell from photos if it's of the right size). As a general rule, heat mats should not be used on the bottom of the tank: tortoises like many other species burrow to cool down. Heat pad on the side wall or overhead heating (radiant heat panel or ceramic heat emitter) are preferred.

There is also https://www.thekinixyscooperative.com/ (they might have guides on their Facebook page).

 

[Tapwater]

> tortoises like many other species burrow to cool down

This may explain why it's been burrowed in the hideout on the cool side the last day. I'm planning to soak it today so I'll get this removed and swap in the ceramic heat plate I got while it's chilling it its bath.

Def going to start my search for some wall mounted planters and plants. As for the water dish the 6 inches I have currently is probably the minimum size it would fit in. I'll grab a 12 inch to be extra safe. As for foil over the mesh, my UVB light covers 1 and a half of my panels. I didn't want to hang it inside in case it fell so its sitting right on top of the mesh which seems to be the correct thing to do. I'll have to see what I can figure out.

Just wish it would come out of its hideout and come up to the plate to eat. Not as easy to tell as with my dog if it's just scared, sick, or not hungry.

Thanks for the reply and recommendations!

 

[TammyJ]

Your tortoise is beautiful and will benefit from the right conditions and a less exposed, more covered and humid environment. You've got good advice already! Good luck.

 

[zovick]

> tortoises like many other species burrow to cool down

This may explain why it's been burrowed in the hideout on the cool side the last day. I'm planning to soak it today so I'll get this removed and swap in the ceramic heat plate I got while it's chilling it its bath.

Def going to start my search for some wall mounted planters and plants. As for the water dish the 6 inches I have currently is probably the minimum size it would fit in. I'll grab a 12 inch to be extra safe. As for foil over the mesh, my UVB light covers 1 and a half of my panels. I didn't want to hang it inside in case it fell so its sitting right on top of the mesh which seems to be the correct thing to do. I'll have to see what I can figure out.

Just wish it would come out of its hideout and come up to the plate to eat. Not as easy to tell as with my dog if it's just scared, sick, or not hungry.

Thanks for the reply and recommendations!

Try some canned or frozen and thawed mixed vegetables. I used to put them on a 6" paper plate and the Hingebacks would come out and eat them. The ones I had were K. erosa and K. homeana and they liked the mixed veggies. They also went absolutely crazy for earthworms/nightcrawlers.

Not sure if the one you have is the same, but the the two species I had were crepuscular in habit. IE, most active at dawn and dusk and hid most of the daylight hours.

 

[Tapwater]

Do you just put live earthworms on the plate and hope they don't wiggle off?

It's actually out eating right now. Had a couple cucumber slices and is currently chowing down on some mushrooms. Hoping to see it eat some greens too but I'll take what I can get. It's only been here since Wednesday. I was at my desk about 5 feet away from the tank and noticed it came out of the hide and was chomping down and I really have to pee but I'm afraid to move and scare it back into the hideout.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

> tortoises like many other species burrow to cool down

This may explain why it's been burrowed in the hideout on the cool side the last day. I'm planning to soak it today so I'll get this removed and swap in the ceramic heat plate I got while it's chilling it its bath.

Def going to start my search for some wall mounted planters and plants. As for the water dish the 6 inches I have currently is probably the minimum size it would fit in. I'll grab a 12 inch to be extra safe. As for foil over the mesh, my UVB light covers 1 and a half of my panels. I didn't want to hang it inside in case it fell so its sitting right on top of the mesh which seems to be the correct thing to do. I'll have to see what I can figure out.

Just wish it would come out of its hideout and come up to the plate to eat. Not as easy to tell as with my dog if it's just scared, sick, or not hungry.

Thanks for the reply and recommendations!

What kind of UVB lamp do you have? Top mesh usually filters about 30% of UV and with tank's height of 18" not every lamp will provide sufficient UV levels.

For hanging flower pots I use hanging pockets-organizers (should be available in any home improvement store).

I'm glad it's eating now - looks like it's finally settling down.

 

[Tapwater]

What kind of UVB lamp do you have? Top mesh usually filters about 30% of UV and with tank's height of 18" not every lamp will provide sufficient UV levels.

For hanging flower pots I use hanging pockets-organizers (should be available in any home improvement store).

I'm glad it's eating now - looks like it's finally settling down.

Reptisun T5 H0 36’ UVB lamp which I leave on 9am – 9pm. I had read that T5 wouldn't put out enough and a T10 would be required. I've read that it should cover 2/3 of the tank, that it should only be in the same area as the basking light, that it should be on with the basking light, that it should only be on 2-3 hours a day, that these don't need a basking light because they dislike bright lights and instead I should use a ceramic heat plate. Just so much conflicting information.

It's on my currently 2 page document I have of questions for the vet next week. I have a solarmeter on order but its not due to arrive until Monday.

 

[zovick]

Do you just put live earthworms on the plate and hope they don't wiggle off?

It's actually out eating right now. Had a couple cucumber slices and is currently chowing down on some mushrooms. Hoping to see it eat some greens too but I'll take what I can get. It's only been here since Wednesday. I was at my desk about 5 feet away from the tank and noticed it came out of the hide and was chomping down and I really have to pee but I'm afraid to move and scare it back into the hideout.

I bought the worms at a bait shop and dumped the entire container on the plate (maybe 12 nightcrawlers or 25 regular sized worms per container). The worms never had time to wiggle off the plate. They would be totally devoured in less than a minute. Note that I was feeding 6 or 8 of these tortoises in each enclosure.

Your tortoise might also go for pinky mice, by the way.

They do NOT like bright light. That much of what I read in your other post is correct. That tortoise will most likely never use the basking area (if it is like the forest hingebacks I kept).

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Reptisun T5 H0 36’ UVB lamp which I leave on 9am – 9pm. I had read that T5 wouldn't put out enough and a T10 would be required. I've read that it should cover 2/3 of the tank, that it should only be in the same area as the basking light, that it should be on with the basking light, that it should only be on 2-3 hours a day, that these don't need a basking light because they dislike bright lights and instead I should use a ceramic heat plate. Just so much conflicting information.

It's on my currently 2 page document I have of questions for the vet next week. I have a solarmeter on order but its not due to arrive until Monday.

I'll try to address at least some of these points to make it less confusing:
1. T5, T8, T12 and such refer to fluorescent tube lamps standards (basically - it's just a tube diameter in 1/8s of inch). T5 lamps are the thinnest and are also the newest and the most effective (amount of light per consumed watt). T5 lamps are divided into SO (standard output) with characteristics similar to older T8 and HO (high output) - twice more light output and power consumption with the same tube length. T5HO lamps are considered the best source of UV for tortoises at the moment.

2. Reptile UV lamps differ in amount of UVB output per watt. ZooMed marks different lamps as 5.0 and 10.0 (probably, UV index at some reference point), Arcadia labels lamps as Forest (6% UVB) and Desert (12% UVB). Both kinds of lamps have same amount of visible light and UVA but 10.0 (or Desert) lamps have twice stronger UVB. So it's not T5 vs T10, but 5.0 vs 10.0.

3. For most tortoise species optimal UV index (amount of UVB) at the basking area is 3-4. It's roughly, as in Pittsburgh tomorrow between 11AM and 4PM. In most places, where tortoises natively occur, it corresponds to morning and afternoon hours (9-11AM, 4-5PM) as UV index is much higher in the middle of the day.

4. When using T5 HO lamp marked as 5.0 (or Forest 6%) this UV index is achieved when lamp is installed at 10-12" above substrate. With a 10.0 (Desert 12%) lamp you achieve same UV index at the distance of 18-20". When using old T8 lamps, to get this UV level you need to put the lights really low (literally, just a few inches above tortoise shell).

5. Advice to have UV lamp spanning almost whole enclosure and to let it run for the full 12 hours are mostly applicable to old and weak (T8 or T10) lamps. Because you can't provide strong localized UV exposure, you have to force the animal to stay under weak UV longer and with less options to escape from under the lamp. With newer T5 lamps you can just cover the basking area and use shorter timings (better mimicking natural sunlight UV curve). However, it's still acceptable to imitate a forest canopy and provide bright strong light through the day, spanning whole enclosure but attenuated/filtered by dense plant cover.

6. Basking areas for forest species is a bit controversial topic. When tortoise is kept in a narrow range of comfortable temperatures day and night, you don't really need a basking area. Yet it doesn't harm if you switch on the basking lamp for 1-2 hours in the morning. Hingebacks may need nightime temperature drop (I don't know if they do) and in that case it could be beneficial to provide an opportunity for a larger tortoise to warm up quickly. Heat lamps don't output very bright light, so I don't expect problems here (UVB lamps are usually brighter).

 

[Tapwater]

I'll try to address at least some of these points to make it less confusing:
1. T5, T8, T12 and such refer to fluorescent tube lamps standards (basically - it's just a tube diameter in 1/8s of inch). T5 lamps are the thinnest and are also the newest and the most effective (amount of light per consumed watt). T5 lamps are divided into SO (standard output) with characteristics similar to older T8 and HO (high output) - twice more light output and power consumption with the same tube length. T5HO lamps are considered the best source of UV for tortoises at the moment.

2. Reptile UV lamps differ in amount of UVB output per watt. ZooMed marks different lamps as 5.0 and 10.0 (probably, UV index at some reference point), Arcadia labels lamps as Forest (6% UVB) and Desert (12% UVB). Both kinds of lamps have same amount of visible light and UVA but 10.0 (or Desert) lamps have twice stronger UVB. So it's not T5 vs T10, but 5.0 vs 10.0.

3. For most tortoise species optimal UV index (amount of UVB) at the basking area is 3-4. It's roughly, as in Pittsburgh tomorrow between 11AM and 4PM. In most places, where tortoises natively occur, it corresponds to morning and afternoon hours (9-11AM, 4-5PM) as UV index is much higher in the middle of the day.

4. When using T5 HO lamp marked as 5.0 (or Forest 6%) this UV index is achieved when lamp is installed at 10-12" above substrate. With a 10.0 (Desert 12%) lamp you achieve same UV index at the distance of 18-20". When using old T8 lamps, to get this UV level you need to put the lights really low (literally, just a few inches above tortoise shell).

5. Advice to have UV lamp spanning almost whole enclosure and to let it run for the full 12 hours are mostly applicable to old and weak (T8 or T10) lamps. Because you can't provide strong localized UV exposure, you have to force the animal to stay under weak UV longer and with less options to escape from under the lamp. With newer T5 lamps you can just cover the basking area and use shorter timings (better mimicking natural sunlight UV curve). However, it's still acceptable to imitate a forest canopy and provide bright strong light through the day, spanning whole enclosure but attenuated/filtered by dense plant cover.

6. Basking areas for forest species is a bit controversial topic. When tortoise is kept in a narrow range of comfortable temperatures day and night, you don't really need a basking area. Yet it doesn't harm if you switch on the basking lamp for 1-2 hours in the morning. Hingebacks may need nightime temperature drop (I don't know if they do) and in that case it could be beneficial to provide an opportunity for a larger tortoise to warm up quickly. Heat lamps don't output very bright light, so I don't expect problems here (UVB lamps are usually brighter).

Appreciate the detailed information. Truly thank you. So it seems like I have a good UVB lamp, though mine may be a little high up. My tank is 20 inches high and I have about 2-3 inches of substrate inside. Essentially a 24 quart package of coco coir spread out. This one seems to like to dig, having seen it dig itself into the cool side hideout yesterday and today, so adding a second or third bag of substrate should get the distance down to a reasonable level.

The fact its digging and almost never on the hot side tells me this basking light needs to go. It's sticking to the cool side and digging so it must be hot. I have a 75w ceramic heat plate handy I can swap into the dome which should keep the hot side cooler. I'll likely swap this out tomorrow as I need to leave the house shortly and won't be here to monitor temps and behavior and change things.

As for the UVB light I could be safe running it a few hours twice a day (morning and evening). Especially since I'm waiting on getting some plants in the tank to provide additional cover and shade (seeing conflicting information about fake and real).

So I could potentially save a little bit of cash flow on basking bulbs and electricity by using a heat plate and adjusting my timers on the UVB, but may simply use that on substrate instead going through 2-3 bags a month versus my original planned 1. At least if I'm correct in that ALL of the substrate should be changed monthly.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Appreciate the detailed information. Truly thank you. So it seems like I have a good UVB lamp, though mine may be a little high up. My tank is 20 inches high and I have about 2-3 inches of substrate inside. Essentially a 24 quart package of coco coir spread out. This one seems to like to dig, having seen it dig itself into the cool side hideout yesterday and today, so adding a second or third bag of substrate should get the distance down to a reasonable level.

The fact its digging and almost never on the hot side tells me this basking light needs to go. It's sticking to the cool side and digging so it must be hot. I have a 75w ceramic heat plate handy I can swap into the dome which should keep the hot side cooler. I'll likely swap this out tomorrow as I need to leave the house shortly and won't be here to monitor temps and behavior and change things.

As for the UVB light I could be safe running it a few hours twice a day (morning and evening). Especially since I'm waiting on getting some plants in the tank to provide additional cover and shade (seeing conflicting information about fake and real).

So I could potentially save a little bit of cash flow on basking bulbs and electricity by using a heat plate and adjusting my timers on the UVB, but may simply use that on substrate instead going through 2-3 bags a month versus my original planned 1. At least if I'm correct in that ALL of the substrate should be changed monthly.

Ceramic heater should be used with a thermostat, you set it to lowest acceptable temperature, like 80-82F (this one differs between species) and forget about it. If you plan to cut the electricity bills - adding some insulation (like EPS or XPS board) along the walls helps a lot with glass tanks.

You simply set the UVB lamp to 4 hours around midday (like from 10AM till 2PM). It's works good enough and saves some on/off cycles which shorten lamp lifespan as well. You still didn't mention what lamp do you have and it's an important detail (as there are only a few brands making safe and long-lasting T5 lamps).

You don't need to replace substrate monthly. Standard cycle is 6-12 months (with timely spot-cleaning and regular tortoise soaks, of course). Search for large (~5 kg, 11 lbs) bricks of pressed coco coir on Amazon, in the garden centers or pet stores. Each block rehydrates to ~64 quarts of substrate. Price tag is around 10-20 bucks. Good quality blocks can be rehydrated in less than an hour and with minimal hassle.

Fake plants can be risky if your tortoise decides to eat them (some do, some don't). Live plants need more attention, a decent LED light to thrive and must be repotted after buy in clean soil and "rest" for several months to get rid of chemicals. Or you can save time but not money and get plants from pet stores, specially grown for terrariums.

With some plants like spider plants or pothos, you can use new vines or plantlets for the enclosure right after repotting.

 

[Tapwater]

Ceramic heater should be used with a thermostat, you set it to lowest acceptable temperature, like 80-82F (this one differs between species) and forget about it. If you plan to cut the electricity bills - adding some insulation (like EPS or XPS board) along the walls helps a lot with glass tanks.

You simply set the UVB lamp to 4 hours around midday (like from 10AM till 2PM). It's works good enough and saves some on/off cycles which shorten lamp lifespan as well. You still didn't mention what lamp do you have and it's an important detail (as there are only a few brands making safe and long-lasting T5 lamps).

You don't need to replace substrate monthly. Standard cycle is 6-12 months (with timely spot-cleaning and regular tortoise soaks, of course). Search for large (~5 kg, 11 lbs) bricks of pressed coco coir on Amazon, in the garden centers or pet stores. Each block rehydrates to ~64 quarts of substrate. Price tag is around 10-20 bucks. Good quality blocks can be rehydrated in less than an hour and with minimal hassle.

Fake plants can be risky if your tortoise decides to eat them (some do, some don't). Live plants need more attention, a decent LED light to thrive and must be repotted after buy in clean soil and "rest" for several months to get rid of chemicals. Or you can save time but not money and get plants from pet stores, specially grown for terrariums.

With some plants like spider plants or pothos, you can use new vines or plantlets for the enclosure right after repotting.

I have a ceramic IR emitter that goes into the dome. This https://www.chewy.com/galapagos-geotherm-ceramic-reptile/dp/1601534. The electricity cost isn't really a big concern, it was more so a thought. Primary concern is making sure the tortoise has what it needs to be comfortable and thrive.

I'm thinking I'll swap this in tomorrow morning when I wake up and keep an eye on temps and its behavior.

Sorry I thought I had mentioned the UVB lamp. I have a Reptisun T5 H0 36’ UVB lamp, specifically one of these - https://zoomed.com/reptisun-t5-ho-terrarium-hood/ I've got everything on smart switches so I'll adjust the UVB light before bed. I'm trying tonight without the heating pad at all. All lights and heat sources went out about 5 hours ago and the tank is 73F currently so I'm thinking I won't need a night time heat source until next summer when the air conditioning is running again.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

I have a ceramic IR emitter that goes into the dome. This https://www.chewy.com/galapagos-geotherm-ceramic-reptile/dp/1601534. The electricity cost isn't really a big concern, it was more so a thought. Primary concern is making sure the tortoise has what it needs to be comfortable and thrive.

I'm thinking I'll swap this in tomorrow morning when I wake up and keep an eye on temps and its behavior.

Sorry I thought I had mentioned the UVB lamp. I have a Reptisun T5 H0 36’ UVB lamp, specifically one of these - https://zoomed.com/reptisun-t5-ho-terrarium-hood/ I've got everything on smart switches so I'll adjust the UVB light before bed. I'm trying tonight without the heating pad at all. All lights and heat sources went out about 5 hours ago and the tank is 73F currently so I'm thinking I won't need a night time heat source until next summer when the air conditioning is running again.

The main reason to use a thermostat is not an economy, but more or less predictable temperature in the enclosure: you don't need to guess when to use an AC or room heater or if you need a lower wattage ceramic heater. This is important when you are not at home or in the night, for example. And definitely safer for the tortoise.

Yes, you mentioned the lamp, sorry. It was a bit of confusion between T5 and T10 and 5.0 and 10.0 lamps.. ZooMed is good choice. As you have 5.0 lamp - it can be not sufficient but you will know for sure when you receive a Solarmeter. Later you can change just the tube in the fixture to Reptisun 10.0 if needed, without replacing the whole kit.

I don't know recommended nighttime temperatures for hingebacks so can't tell if 73F is okay. I'll tag another hingebacks keeper (although, without much hope). @Jacqui are you still around?

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

@Tapwater I've found an extensive guide on Kinixys (Hingeback) tortoises. As I can tell, it's backed by some of the people I've tagged before in this thread - experienced keepers and breeders.

It's 140 pages, but lots of photos, habitat descriptions and so on. Care information is in the last section.

https://www.thekinixyscooperative.com/post/kinixys-conservation-blueprint-mifsud (the guide is linked as PDF file there).

If you have further questions, need clarifications and so on - don't hesitate to ask.

 

[Tapwater]

@Tapwater I've found an extensive guide on Kinixys (Hingeback) tortoises. As I can tell, it's backed by some of the people I've tagged before in this thread - experienced keepers and breeders.

It's 140 pages, but lots of photos, habitat descriptions and so on. Care information is in the last section.

https://www.thekinixyscooperative.com/post/kinixys-conservation-blueprint-mifsud (the guide is linked as PDF file there).

If you have further questions, need clarifications and so on - don't hesitate to ask.

Amazing! Thank you so much!