Respiratory Infection still?

[HannahI]

In September 2024 we rescued Two red foot tortoises, approximately 5 years old. One male, one female.
They Were previously held in a garage without proper temperatures, humidity or food
Brought to the vet for suspected (and confirmed) respiratory infection once they were rescued.
Both went through two rounds of antibiotics (shots)
Both eat and are gaining weight
Both still have slightly watery eyes some days.
Can hear both of them breathing when in the bath and moving around still.

We Have been keeping the heat on at night for them so they are warm (~95 hot spot during the day and 80 hotspot at night) and lowered humidity during the day ~60% (none at night)
Poops look normal (previously male had diarrhea, lots of poop, straining (had prolapse)
Walking around
Seem to still have leg muscle/strength

Does this sound like still an active infection that needs treatment? Or now just their new normal due to their poor previous care?
Any suggestions on what we could do to help them further?

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

In September 2024 we rescued Two red foot tortoises, approximately 5 years old. One male, one female.
They Were previously held in a garage without proper temperatures, humidity or food
Brought to the vet for suspected (and confirmed) respiratory infection once they were rescued.
Both went through two rounds of antibiotics (shots)
Both eat and are gaining weight
Both still have slightly watery eyes some days.
Can hear both of them breathing when in the bath and moving around still.

We Have been keeping the heat on at night for them so they are warm (~95 hot spot during the day and 80 hotspot at night) and lowered humidity during the day ~60% (none at night)
Poops look normal (previously male had diarrhea, lots of poop, straining (had prolapse)
Walking around
Seem to still have leg muscle/strength

Does this sound like still an active infection that needs treatment? Or now just their new normal due to their poor previous care?
Any suggestions on what we could do to help them further?

Hello and welcome!

Watery eyes can be a reaction to high temperatures or low humidity. Some redfoots "whistle" when humidity is low. But this can be a lifetime trait after infection (some pathogens irreversibly damage nasal cavities).

You can try to keep consistent temperature 80-88F (or even more narrow range of 82-86F) day and night and humidity of 80-85% and see if symptoms persist.

Usually tortoises with active infection don't have a great appetite and not very active.

One important point to note: if you keep both tortoises in the same enclosure, consider separating them. Even redfoots can sometimes be openly aggressive to each other (even after many years of living together). Chronical stress and "silent bullying" are the other reasons.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Hello! As touched on above I would definitely separate them if they aren’t already, pair dynamics really don’t work for tortoises, one can actually stunt the other, a male and female pair really isn’t recommended as the male can start to constantly harass the female.

Red foots have higher humidity requirements for life, so aim for 80’s and the recommended temperature range above. Don’t let the temp drop below 80 anywhere in the enclosure.

For the indoor side of things you might hopefully find this post useful, I primarily made it for folks that I’d seen with adult red foots in smaller open set ups as a means of instant improvement, not every average new member can modify entire rooms or sheds. That said, I go over a greenhouse set up here with ceramic bulbs, but a modified room/shed with RHP(s) and oil heating would be much more optimal for an adult red foot(assuming yours are as they’re sexed), however to get your red foots a covered set up as quickly as possible(if it’s not already a closed chamber), perhaps follow these steps in getting the current one covered, and look into future alternatives down the line. That’s certainly what I’m doing currently.
This thread covers correct equipment(uvb, heating bulbs, lighting etc, stores often sell the wrong bulbs so always good to double check), correct levels, importance of a closed chamber for younger tortoises and red foots(only way to maintain the humidity you need), appropriately maintaining the humidity(they’re prone to shell rot so this is important, don’t use a mister/humidifier ), safe substrates, there’s lots of visual examples for everything, a diet list and a really handy diet link to check out! If ever going with a greenhouse, the lower the ceiling height, whilst still allowing for recommended bulb height, the better!

Housing older red foot/cherryhead

Hello there! In this thread I’m going to go over an example of an appropriate indoor red foot/cherryhead enclosure. As much as it’s encouraged to have tortoises in a safe outdoor enclosure(especially the size these guys get!) I understand being from the uk myself, that some climate’s make it...

tortoiseforum.org

This includes different closed chamber options, some run more efficiently than others, bear in mind size scale, always go as big as you possibly can indoors!

Visual inspiration

Hi guys! I’ve had some lovely messages complimenting me on my care sheets I made for all the visuals they include! That makes me so happy because as a visual learner myself, that was my goal🥰 I’ve recently had some requests for some more visual inspiration for set ups that can house babies/...

tortoiseforum.org

Lastly, this one is good to keep on hand! it’ll help you avoid the wrong bulbs, substrates, housing etc and expands on some of the points above, I always encourage double checking purchases on the forum too before buying

Common keeping errors

Hello everyone! I’d been a long time lurker on this site long before joining just under a year ago now, over that time I’ve seen these husbandry issues come up time and time again, sometimes with dire consequences☹️ I thought this thread might serve as a good visual guide for these common...

tortoiseforum.org

Hope they help!

 

[HannahI]

Hello and welcome!

Watery eyes can be a reaction to high temperatures or low humidity. Some redfoots "whistle" when humidity is low. But this can be a lifetime trait after infection (some pathogens irreversibly damage nasal cavities).

You can try to keep consistent temperature 80-88F (or even more narrow range of 82-86F) day and night and humidity of 80-85% and see if symptoms persist.

Usually tortoises with active infection don't have a great appetite and not very active.

One important point to note: if you keep both tortoises in the same enclosure, consider separating them. Even redfoots can sometimes be openly aggressive to each other (even after many years of living together). Chronical stress and "silent bullying" are the other reasons.

We had the torts at 80% humidity and followed guides on here. The vet then insisted they were wrong and to have a max of 50-60% humidity. We will try raising the humidity again.
We will separate them for the sake of quarantine but they do not bully each other and will live together afterwards (have heard from a lot of people that redfoots living together is okay).
Is there anything else we can do to help them?
Does increased heat help if we were to raise them beyond what they currently are?
Can they be in the same room or same enclosure if there is a divider and can’t touch?
What would you recommend instead of a fogger or mister?
Thanks so much for your help!

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

We had the torts at 80% humidity and followed guides on here. The vet then insisted they were wrong and to have a max of 50-60% humidity. We will try raising the humidity again.
We will separate them for the sake of quarantine but they do not bully each other and will live together afterwards (have heard from a lot of people that redfoots living together is okay).
Is there anything else we can do to help them?
Does increased heat help if we were to raise them beyond what they currently are?
Can they be in the same room or same enclosure if there is a divider and can’t touch?
What would you recommend instead of a fogger or mister?
Thanks so much for your help!

Vets often have no clue on how to appropriately treat tortoises, the fact this vet told you to keep red foot’s at 50-60 humidity is a huge red flag and completely incorrect.

The only way you’re going to be able to maintain humidity where needed 24/7 is going to be a closed chamber, the lukewarm water pour method(covered in housing link above) is the safest most effective method for red foots, avoid misters and foggers.

Whilst red foots are indeed a species that is more tolerant of company, this still does not permit to pairs, pairs do not work in the tortoise world, they’ll always be a dominant one, even if you don’t notice it yourself, folks often don’t until one gets sick and passes, the stress of a pair dynamic can eventually prove fatal

A temperature range of 82-86 will be fine, id use CHEs for this.

Theres many effective ways of splitting an enclosure in two yes! As long as they can’t see each other through the barrier, though sometimes this doesn’t work, there is the possibility they they’ll still be able to smell each other, and cause them to constantly pace, this isn’t because they miss one another, it’s them trying to seek out the rival and not being able to figure out why they can’t get to them. Same room shouldn’t be an issue, though I can’t say for certain. Either way once they are split up, they likely seem very unsettled and may even go off their food for a bit, this isn’t because they’re sad one is gone, tortoises hate changes, it’ll take time for them to figure out there’s no longer competition, don’t let it discourage you, it’s what’s best for their long term health

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

We had the torts at 80% humidity and followed guides on here. The vet then insisted they were wrong and to have a max of 50-60% humidity. We will try raising the humidity again.
We will separate them for the sake of quarantine but they do not bully each other and will live together afterwards (have heard from a lot of people that redfoots living together is okay).
Is there anything else we can do to help them?
Does increased heat help if we were to raise them beyond what they currently are?
Can they be in the same room or same enclosure if there is a divider and can’t touch?
What would you recommend instead of a fogger or mister?
Thanks so much for your help!

With high enough temperatures, humidity is not dangerous. Leaving tortoise in 60F with 100% humidity is not, obviously, healthy.

As of bullying, it's not obvious and often is only seen as weight difference between two. There is a post on this forum where a redfoot male has seriously injured a female after 12 years of living together. And there are more like this. So, you may get lucky or may not.

Keeping them day/night in comfort temperature range - 82-86F will help. Rising temperature to 90F - not really, they will be hiding from heat all the time and that's it.

You can keep them in the same enclosure if you place a barrier. However, space requirements for tortoises are rather high - halving the enclosure is less preferred than building a second one.

In a covered enclosure (e.g. portable greenhouse, grow tent, PVC box) it's enough to have a deep (4-6 inches) substrate and just add water to substrate once in a week or two.

 

[COmtnLady]

We had the torts at 80% humidity and followed guides on here. The vet then insisted they were wrong and to have a max of 50-60% humidity. We will try raising the humidity again.
We will separate them for the sake of quarantine but they do not bully each other and will live together afterwards (have heard from a lot of people that redfoots living together is okay).
Is there anything else we can do to help them?
Does increased heat help if we were to raise them beyond what they currently are?
Can they be in the same room or same enclosure if there is a divider and can’t touch?
What would you recommend instead of a fogger or mister?
Thanks so much for your help!

Welcome to the Tortoise Forum!

Here has the most up-to-date info on having healthy, thriving, tortoises. There are decades of successful keeping and breeding of many different species of tortoise represented in our membership. So many pet store employees, people at reptile shows, YouTubers, Social Media posters, and veterinarians are still using older info. Vets in particular tend to be more familiar with other kinds of animals, to the point of giving bad info and even using medications that are poisonous to tortoises but work fine for mammals.

Different species of tortoises evolved in different climates and have very different specific needs. Red Foots come from the equatorial area of South America. It never gets cold there and is extremely humid. If you force them to live in conditions where the temp drops below 80 F/27C and/or the humidity is below 80% they will struggle to survive, and it will slowly destroy their health.

Here is an article on why NOT to keep two torts together. Very similar to stressing tortoises with temperatures they can't handle, two together will bully each other until one dies. What humans see as "cuddling" (piling up as water-turtles do) is dominance behavior in tortoises. Following each other around, sitting in the food or water dish so the other is blocked from it, bumping, are all territorial actions. I would bet the prolapse you wrote about in an earlier post is related to being in a stressful "pair" situation. Here is an article that may explain it better than I can ~

Why not to keep 2 tortoises together - a lesson learned the hard way

This is a copy/paste of an article I wrote on my blog last year. I've seen several new keepers ask the question of whether they should get a 'friend' for their tortoise, and so rather than keeping on linking to my blog (which feels kinda self-promoting, which is not my intent), I am creating a...

tortoiseforum.org

Your vet is recommending temp and humidity more suited for Hermani or Russian tortoises, not a Jungle species like Red Foots. Red Foots also do not need "basking" areas as many other tortoise species do. Red Foots eat a diet heavy with fruit, while almost all other species can not digest the sugars. Conversely, grassland tortoises, like Sulcata, eat grass as the main part of their diet, while Red Foots can't deal with it at all. Each kind has its own needs.

Please give the people here, who live with tortoises 24/7, the chance to advise you about how to help your Red Foots thrive.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Welcome to the forum, I hope your tortoises get well soon!