Out of options for substrate

[Mortybaby]

Hi everyone,

I’ve been using Reptibark in my tortoise’s enclosure since I first got her (about 4 years now). This year she has been eating the bark, so recently I switched to coco coir thinking it would be safer. Unfortunately, she had a bad reaction. Her eyelids swelled up, and I had to take her to the emergency vet. She was diagnosed with conjunctivitis and was given eye drops and anti-inflammatory shots.

It’s been 3 days of using the drops. She’s currently in a quarantine setup with soft towels to prevent her from scratching her eyes. In the mornings, her eyes look totally fine, but when I put her in her soak, she seems to strain to poop, and that’s when her eyelids puff up again. After her bath, she went back into her enclosure and they swelled up again but then went back down within a minute or two.

She might be constipated from eating the Reptibark. She passed some small, round poops (not her usual longer ones), and I noticed undigested pieces of Reptibark, hay, and even bite-sized cuttlebone in her stool. They all looked completely intact, not broken down. I always cut her hay into about inch long pieces.

I’m worried something could be wrong with her stomach or digestion. Has anyone seen this before?

Also, I’m unsure what substrate to try next. Orchid bark seems too similar to Reptibark, and cypress mulch looks like a dirt/mulch mix, which makes me nervous because of her reaction to coco coir and her habit of eating small pieces.

What are some safe substrate alternatives for a sulcata who tends to eat everything?
And could there be something missing from her diet that’s making her want to eat the substrate in the first place?

Any advice would be really appreciated.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

And could there be something missing from her diet that’s making her want to eat the substrate in the first place?

That could be. Can you describe the diet? Also, how do you supplement calcium, how often and how much?

 

[Yvonne G]

There's a product mfg'd by Sticky Tongue Farms called Miner-All. It provides minerals that may be missing from the diet. . . mssing minerals that cause them to eat the substrate

 

[Mortybaby]

She gets a mixture of 3 rotating greens
either butter lettuce, endive, dandelion greens, mustard, turnip, bok choy, escarole, boston lettuce, dino kale, red and green leaf, romaine, maybe others i can't think of right now

Then i add:

• two spoonful's of herbal tortoise hay and dusting of "Food Fixer" topper from https://www.tortoisesupply.com/
• NOT every meal - Chopped orchard grass hay (about an inch long)
• Also gets a spoonful of a rotated item from 5 Kapidolo Farms bags (one used at a time)
• Mazuri pellets
• Every other meal - Sprinkle of Sticky Tongue Farms Miner-All Indoor
• NOT every meal more like a treat but often = small pieces of cuttlebone

 

[Mortybaby]

There's a product mfg'd by Sticky Tongue Farms called Miner-All. It provides minerals that may be missing from the diet. . . mssing minerals that cause them to eat the substrate

The only supplement I’ve been giving her (besides cuttlebone) is Sticky Tongue Farms Miner-All Indoor. I’ve been using it for about two months, but she was already eating her substrate before I started with this supplement, and she’s continued to do it since then.

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

What is the lighting like? Could it be affecting her eyesight?

 

[Mortybaby]

She has an LED light bar, 2 CHEs, and UVB that has been the same since being in this enclosure. I have changed out the UVB multiple times.
CHE's are always on and connected to a herpstat device.
LED Fluval plant light is on 7am to 8pm.
UVB is on for a few hours in the middle of the day (i cant think of exact timing right now)

For basking, I used to use incandescent flood light bulbs but i cant find them anymore and did recently switch to Arcadia Reptile GoldenSun Reptile Halogen Heat Lamp.
This light is on from 7am - 8pm.
That light bulb and the coco coir are the only new things inside her enclosure. But the light was introduced weeks earlier. The coco coir was added this weekend and by Monday her eyes bad.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

1. Has Fluval LED always been in her enclosure? At least on the picture I see some colored LEDs (blue and red) in this light. It's not a big deal if the light is positioned high enough but I would try just plain white LEDs and see if behaviour changes.

2. What kind of coco coir was it? Horticultural coir may require washing to remove excess salt. Needless to say it should be damp.

 

[Mortybaby]

Yes, the Fluval has always been in there.

https://fluvalaquatics.com/us/shop/product/plant-3-0-bluetooth-led-59w-48-60-122-153-cm

on the app, there is access to independent color control. I just kept it standard

 

[Mortybaby]

I am unsure what kind. It was compressed at first and definitely damp when I added it to the enclosure.

 

[wellington]

Halogen bulbs should not be used. Get what is labeled basking bulb. Not spot bulb and not CFL or halogen.

 

[Mortybaby]

Halogen bulbs should not be used. Get what is labeled basking bulb. Not spot bulb and not CFL or halogen.

It is a basking halogen flood bulb.
I will get a new one tonight.

 

[Tom]

She has an LED light bar, 2 CHEs, and UVB that has been the same since being in this enclosure. I have changed out the UVB multiple times.
CHE's are always on and connected to a herpstat device.
LED Fluval plant light is on 7am to 8pm.
UVB is on for a few hours in the middle of the day (i cant think of exact timing right now)

For basking, I used to use incandescent flood light bulbs but i cant find them anymore and did recently switch to Arcadia Reptile GoldenSun Reptile Halogen Heat Lamp.
This light is on from 7am - 8pm.
That light bulb and the coco coir are the only new things inside her enclosure. But the light was introduced weeks earlier. The coco coir was added this weekend and by Monday her eyes bad.

There is a problem that has to be discovered and corrected here. My first thought after reading post number one was diet... and then I read post number 7 here. Grocery store foods are not great, but you are using a good variety, and all the right supplements in the right ways, so I don't think it is diet.

The next logical choice is lighting. I would not use a plant light over a reptile enclosure. They are designed for plants and can have spectrums that aren't great for animal eyes.

What type of UV bulb are you using?

Here are the four heating and lighting essentials. I would get rid of all of that and replace it with the correct stuff. I think the current lighting is your problem, not your substrate.

1. Basking bulb. I use 65 watt incandescent floods from the hardware store. Some people will need bigger, or smaller wattage bulbs. Let your thermometer be your guide. I run them on a timer for about 12 hours and adjust the height to get the correct basking temp under them. I also like to use a flat rock of some sort directly under the bulb. You need to check the temp with a thermometer directly under the bulb and get it to around 95-100F (36-37C).
2. Ambient heat maintenance. I use ceramic heating elements or radiant heat panels set on thermostats to maintain ambient above 80 degrees day and night for tropical species. In most cases you'd only need day heat for a temperate species like Testudo or DT, as long as your house stays above 60F (15-16C) at night. Some people in colder climates or with larger enclosures will need multiple CHEs or RHPs to spread out enough heat.
3. Ambient light. I use LEDs for this purpose. Something in the 5000-6500K color range will look the best. Most bulbs at the store are in the 2500K range and they look yellowish. Strip or screw-in LED bulb types are both fine.
4. UV. If you can get your tortoise outside for an hour 2 or 3 times a week, you won't need indoor UV. In colder climates, get one of the newer HO type fluorescent tubes. Which type will depend on mounting height. 5.0 bulbs make almost no UV. I like the 12% HO bulbs from Arcadia. You need a meter to check this: https://www.solarmeter.com/model65.html A good UV bulb only needs to run for 2-3 hours mid day. You need the basking bulb and the ambient lighting to be on at least 12 hours a day.

Soak this tortoise every day for an hour for at least a month to help it pass whatever is blocking it up. Get some spineless opuntia from the store or from someone growing locally. That stuff is slimy when eaten and will lube up the GI tract.

 

[Alex and the Redfoot]

Yes, the Fluval has always been in there.

https://fluvalaquatics.com/us/shop/product/plant-3-0-bluetooth-led-59w-48-60-122-153-cm

on the app, there is access to independent color control. I just kept it standard

At standard setting are Blue and Red LEDs turned off? I see that you can set intensity for each diode color separately in the app.