RedFoot is wheezing

[betweenshells]

hey yall a couple days a go I noticed my tortoise Rojita started wheezing and yawning often (yawning a few times a day). Energy and appetite seem normal, she does have a few days here and there where she’s not as active but I assume it’s the winter. No mucus that I’ve noticed. Her eyes are moist but I don’t think it’s discharge. She’s just normally moist from her environment. Her behavior has been pretty normal. She’s indoors right now, has her UVB during the day and her ceramic heater at night. This last week we had pretty cold temperatures here in TX so it was a challenge to keep her enclosure regulated the way I normally do.



But her temperature at night in the enclosure varies from 70 degrees to 80 degrees and during the day it’s more like 80 to 90 (high 80s). Her humidity stays around 70-90 percent but at night it can drop since I’m not around to spray it. I think her night humidity and temperature needs to be worked on on my part. Maybe this is what is affecting her? It’s been getting colder than usual in my city and it’s a dry cold.

She lives outside for most of the year, has a big big spot out there in my yard and I’m planning on expanding it this spring since she’s growing so much. Her diet varies from zupreem pellets to greens and fruit and she eats 5-6 days a week. She always has clean water.

Won’t lie that figuring out her indoor enclosure temperature during this winter has been hard. I’ve been giving her showers with warm water so she can get lots of humidity in there. Her poop looks healthy. She’s a little chubby but nothing crazy. Very active and walks on all fours with entire plastron off ground.

 

[betweenshells]

Here’s a picture i took today. Gonna add a video.

 

[COmtnLady]

hey yall a couple days a go I noticed my tortoise Rojita started wheezing and yawning often (yawning a few times a day). Energy and appetite seem normal, she does have a few days here and there where she’s not as active but I assume it’s the winter. No mucus that I’ve noticed. Her eyes are moist but I don’t think it’s discharge. She’s just normally moist from her environment. Her behavior has been pretty normal. She’s indoors right now, has her UVB during the day and her ceramic heater at night. This last week we had pretty cold temperatures here in TX so it was a challenge to keep her enclosure regulated the way I normally do.



But her temperature at night in the enclosure varies from 70 degrees to 80 degrees and during the day it’s more like 80 to 90 (high 80s). Her humidity stays around 70-90 percent but at night it can drop since I’m not around to spray it. I think her night humidity and temperature needs to be worked on on my part. Maybe this is what is affecting her? It’s been getting colder than usual in my city and it’s a dry cold.

She lives outside for most of the year, has a big big spot out there in my yard and I’m planning on expanding it this spring since she’s growing so much. Her diet varies from zupreem pellets to greens and fruit and she eats 5-6 days a week. She always has clean water.

Won’t lie that figuring out her indoor enclosure temperature during this winter has been hard. I’ve been giving her showers with warm water so she can get lots of humidity in there. Her poop looks healthy. She’s a little chubby but nothing crazy. Very active and walks on all fours with entire plastron off ground.

There is quite a bit that needs changed in how you are keeping her. The wheezing is most likely caused by her being too cold and the spraying, both of which are bad for her. There also could be dust from the substrate aggravating her breathing.


She needs a closed chamber in order to keep the humidity and heat in. Without completely enclosing her habitat, all your heat and humidity drift off into the rest of your room. RedFoots evolved in the equatorial region of South America. They NEED it to be hot and humid 24/7/365. It should be 84F and 84%, higher is fine, lower is not.

STOP spraying. It can cause respiratory distress and infections. Sprayers, foggers, and misters create droplets that are too big and make it difficult for her to breathe, plus it is exactly upside-down of what RedFoots need. You are creating a wet surface to her habitat which has a better chance of causing a fungal infection on her plastron; with dry air that has globs of water clogging her nares.

The optimal way to maintain humidity is to have a base in the enclosure of damp coco coir with dry orchid bark or cyprus mulch on top of it, inside a closed chamber.

You need the coco coir to keep your humidity steady. Think of it like a sponge, the base layer that holds water. And you need the bark to provide a living surface that is as dry as is possible to prevent shell fungus (which RedFoots are prone to due to the humidity levels they need).

First, soak a brick of coco coir in warm water, in a clean bucket, until the brick completely falls apart and there are no hard lumps left. Then squeeze the water out, using your hands, and pack it tightly into the bottom of your enclosure. I use about three or four inches of coco coir with two to three inches of orchid/fir bark on top of that. The water that is left in the coco coir will evaporate up through the substrate and keep the humidity at the level that you want it to be.

When the gauges you have tell you that the humidity is starting to drop down, pour a cup of warm water into the corners (not on the main surface of the bark). Don't flood the floor of your enclosure - you can always add more, but it is a huge pain to remove excess. Pout a cup or two of warm water into the corners of your closed enclosure, wait an hour or so, and watch the gauges to see how far that brings the humidity up. Add more if it doesn't bring it up to the right amount of humidity. It won't take you very long before you know how much is enough. It is fairly easy to do.

She should be able to eat every day - just like you can. Her diet should be mostly greens, with some fruits and veggies - think 60% greens and 40% fruits and veggies, with the pellets as supplements to make sure she's getting all needed minerals and such. I am unfamiliar with that brand, could you provide a clear pic of labels, please. Are you adding a pinch of calcium with D3 powder approximately three times per week?

Here are three guides that another member collated from info from all over this site to make it easier for you to access the info you need. There is much more info available, but these should help get the ball rolling. The second one has dietary suggestions. Read through them, and feel free to ask questions.

Common keeping errors

Hello everyone! I’d been a long time lurker on this site long before joining just under a year ago now, over that time I’ve seen these husbandry issues come up time and time again, sometimes with dire consequences☹️ I thought this thread might serve as a good visual guide for these common...

tortoiseforum.org

Housing older red foot/cherryhead

Hello there! In this thread I’m going to go over an example of an appropriate indoor red foot/cherryhead enclosure. As much as it’s encouraged to have tortoises in a safe outdoor enclosure(especially the size these guys get!) I understand being from the uk myself, that some climate’s make it...

tortoiseforum.org

Visual inspiration

Hi guys! I’ve had some lovely messages complimenting me on my care sheets I made for all the visuals they include! That makes me so happy because as a visual learner myself, that was my goal🥰 I’ve recently had some requests for some more visual inspiration for set ups that can house babies/...

tortoiseforum.org

There are several more guide sheets available, but let's start with those.

Ask questions. We are here to help.
Let's get her breathing easy again!

 

[COmtnLady]

How old is she?

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Welcome to the forum! As @COmtnLady said, some changes are needed in the environment. Proper temperatures are important for fighting of any infection or respiratory symptoms so I recommend you get started by upping your temperatures.

 

[betweenshells]

There is quite a bit that needs changed in how you are keeping her. The wheezing is most likely caused by her being too cold and the spraying, both of which are bad for her. There also could be dust from the substrate aggravating her breathing.


She needs a closed chamber in order to keep the humidity and heat in. Without completely enclosing her habitat, all your heat and humidity drift off into the rest of your room. RedFoots evolved in the equatorial region of South America. They NEED it to be hot and humid 24/7/365. It should be 84F and 84%, higher is fine, lower is not.

STOP spraying. It can cause respiratory distress and infections. Sprayers, foggers, and misters create droplets that are too big and make it difficult for her to breathe, plus it is exactly upside-down of what RedFoots need. You are creating a wet surface to her habitat which has a better chance of causing a fungal infection on her plastron; with dry air that has globs of water clogging her nares.

The optimal way to maintain humidity is to have a base in the enclosure of damp coco coir with dry orchid bark or cyprus mulch on top of it, inside a closed chamber.



She should be able to eat every day - just like you can. Her diet should be mostly greens, with some fruits and veggies - think 60% greens and 40% fruits and veggies, with the pellets as supplements to make sure she's getting all needed minerals and such. I am unfamiliar with that brand, could you provide a clear pic of labels, please. Are you adding a pinch of calcium with D3 powder approximately three times per week?

Here are three guides that another member collated from info from all over this site to make it easier for you to access the info you need. There is much more info available, but these should help get the ball rolling. The second one has dietary suggestions. Read through them, and feel free to ask questions.

Common keeping errors

Hello everyone! I’d been a long time lurker on this site long before joining just under a year ago now, over that time I’ve seen these husbandry issues come up time and time again, sometimes with dire consequences☹️ I thought this thread might serve as a good visual guide for these common...

tortoiseforum.org

Housing older red foot/cherryhead

Hello there! In this thread I’m going to go over an example of an appropriate indoor red foot/cherryhead enclosure. As much as it’s encouraged to have tortoises in a safe outdoor enclosure(especially the size these guys get!) I understand being from the uk myself, that some climate’s make it...

tortoiseforum.org

Visual inspiration

Hi guys! I’ve had some lovely messages complimenting me on my care sheets I made for all the visuals they include! That makes me so happy because as a visual learner myself, that was my goal🥰 I’ve recently had some requests for some more visual inspiration for set ups that can house babies/...

tortoiseforum.org

There are several more guide sheets available, but let's start with those.

Ask questions. We are here to help.
Let's get her breathing easy again!

She has a PVC enclosure so it is not open. The heat and humidity does stay bc it’s f or that! I can definitely work on finding a better way to create humidity… it’s the first time I’m hearing that the sprayer is bad for her. I also just changed 50% of the substrate so I guess it could be dust but I’m not sure. I think it’s the cold air. She was doing fine in here before the temperatures dropped below what is normal in my area.

 

[COmtnLady]

I don't understand = "The heat and humidity does stay bc it’s f or that!" Please explain.

How are you heating her enclosure? As The_Four_Toed_Edward said above, since she's not as healthy as she could be right now, keeping the heat up (above 85F, 90F would be good), until she's over the wheezing is very important. It is even more so with the Polar Express that's hitting for the next several days.

Each species has different requirements. Its important to keep your tortoise within the parameters for that particular type of tortoise. If one evolved in a jungle it needs to be kept with entirely different conditions than a desert species. While they are fairly resilient, there is only so much accommodation they can make for human whims. Its up to us to do what they need.

With the substrate explained earlier you only need to change it once a year or less. Actually, most substrate systems don't need changed very often. Its not like a hamster cage or a horse stall. As long as the discarded food and poop are cleaned out daily (so that they don't foul it or cause mold/mildew), a system of substrate is fine for months.

When I mentioned her breathing might be affected by dust, its because of how dry that top layer appears in the pic of Rojita. Her face is only a couple inches above it, and it doesn't take that much to stir it up.

Please share pics of her enclosure.
Let's see how we can help get it Red Foot friendlier.

And how old is she?
That is an important factor in keeping, too.

How often are you soaking her? Frequency is another age-related thing... every other day or even just a few times per week is fine for an adult, but for one that is fairly young, its better to soak them everyday Warming her up in a half-hour soak will help her get over the wheezing.

.

 

[TammyJ]

You're getting great advice! Please follow it to make sure Rojita gets the best.
Also, Redfoot tortoises need some animal proteins in their diet too. Hard boiled egg in the shell, cut in half is good and so is steamed chicken meat or tinned sardines in water.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Excellent advice from @COmtnLady above! I’d definitely give those links she added a read!

I primarily made that housing thread for folks that I’d seen with adult red foots in already very small open set ups as a means of instant improvement, not every average new member can modify entire rooms or sheds. That said, I go over a greenhouse set up with ceramic bulbs, but a modified room/shed with RHP(s) and oil heating would be much more optimal for an adult red foot(presuming she is an adult?)but it’s definitely a good solution for now, though from my understanding you have her in a closed pvc viv correct?

The common keeping errors is really good to go over too, it’ll help you avoid the wrong bulbs, substrates, housing etc, id use it to double check all your equipment.

Based on your initial description “has her UVB during the day and her ceramic heater at night” I’m assuming you have an all in one compact uv and heat bulb? They aren’t the safest or most efficient choice unfortunately, the right uv bulbs are covered in the housing thread. I’d stick with you ceramic bulbs 24/7 to keep your temperatures in range of 80-86, though as she’s wheezing try shoot for 84-86, there’s no need for a day& night temperature fluctuation for these guys. 70 is much too cool and 90’s is a bit too warm for them.

I’m noticing some gauge dials in the background of your picture? They are notoriously inaccurate so I wouldn’t solely rely on those for your readings.

As touched on above, spraying/misters really aren’t any good for maintaining humidity, it can cause both respiratory issues and shell fungus, you want to go with the lukewarm water pour method, which is also covered in the housing thread. Please feel free to keep asking any further questions!

 

[betweenshells]

Excellent advice from @COmtnLady above! I’d definitely give those links she added a read!

I primarily made that housing thread for folks that I’d seen with adult red foots in already very small open set ups as a means of instant improvement, not every average new member can modify entire rooms or sheds. That said, I go over a greenhouse set up with ceramic bulbs, but a modified room/shed with RHP(s) and oil heating would be much more optimal for an adult red foot(presuming she is an adult?)but it’s definitely a good solution for now, though from my understanding you have her in a closed pvc viv correct?

The common keeping errors is really good to go over too, it’ll help you avoid the wrong bulbs, substrates, housing etc, id use it to double check all your equipment.

Based on your initial description “has her UVB during the day and her ceramic heater at night” I’m assuming you have an all in one compact uv and heat bulb? They aren’t the safest or most efficient choice unfortunately, the right uv bulbs are covered in the housing thread. I’d stick with you ceramic bulbs 24/7 to keep your temperatures in range of 80-86, though as she’s wheezing try shoot for 84-86, there’s no need for a day& night temperature fluctuation for these guys. 70 is much too cool and 90’s is a bit too warm for them.

I’m noticing some gauge dials in the background of your picture? They are notoriously inaccurate so I wouldn’t solely rely on those for your readings.

As touched on above, spraying/misters really aren’t any good for maintaining humidity, it can cause both respiratory issues and shell fungus, you want to go with the lukewarm water pour method, which is also covered in the housing thread. Please feel free to keep asking any further questions!

This is all really helpful advice honestly! My goal is to eventually get her a much bigger indoor enclosure but for now she's in a PVC enclosure. I usually which out the bulb every morning and night, just have one lamp. i'm getting a radiant heat panel tomorrow, she has a uvb panel on top too that doesn't produce heat. it's good to know the spraying isn't helpful and i will switch that up, her wheezing has greatly improved in just the last 24hrs. i've taken others advice of keeping the heat up and not letting it drop below 84. She's still very active and ate her greens and papaya today.

i definitely have to upgrade the temperature gauges! if you know a better way or more accurate way to know temp i'd love any advice on that too. I will be reading the links above tomorrow thank you so so much for all this! thankfully, she is outdoors for most of the year and she's so much happier and healthier out there.

 

[betweenshells]

You're getting great advice! Please follow it to make sure Rojita gets the best.
Also, Redfoot tortoises need some animal proteins in their diet too. Hard boiled egg in the shell, cut in half is good and so is steamed chicken meat or tinned sardines in water.

awesome, i had been reading that recently too i will definitely incorporate that!

 

[betweenshells]

I don't understand = "The heat and humidity does stay bc it’s f or that!" Please explain.

How are you heating her enclosure? As The_Four_Toed_Edward said above, since she's not as healthy as she could be right now, keeping the heat up (above 85F, 90F would be good), until she's over the wheezing is very important. It is even more so with the Polar Express that's hitting for the next several days.

Each species has different requirements. Its important to keep your tortoise within the parameters for that particular type of tortoise. If one evolved in a jungle it needs to be kept with entirely different conditions than a desert species. While they are fairly resilient, there is only so much accommodation they can make for human whims. Its up to us to do what they need.

With the substrate explained earlier you only need to change it once a year or less. Actually, most substrate systems don't need changed very often. Its not like a hamster cage or a horse stall. As long as the discarded food and poop are cleaned out daily (so that they don't foul it or cause mold/mildew), a system of substrate is fine for months.

When I mentioned her breathing might be affected by dust, its because of how dry that top layer appears in the pic of Rojita. Her face is only a couple inches above it, and it doesn't take that much to stir it up.

Please share pics of her enclosure.
Let's see how we can help get it Red Foot friendlier.

And how old is she?
That is an important factor in keeping, too.

How often are you soaking her? Frequency is another age-related thing... every other day or even just a few times per week is fine for an adult, but for one that is fairly young, its better to soak them everyday Warming her up in a half-hour soak will help her get over the wheezing.

.

thank you so much for all this advice! i worked a long shift today so i'm barely getting back to these right now. will be working on this tomorrow. i ordered a RHP that is arriving tomorrow to set up with this cold front coming in. i also stopped spraying the enclosure and focused on just wetting the substrate which is coconut fiber and mulch.

Currently in her enclosure she has a lamp that i switch between a UVB light during the day and a ceramic heater at night though from someone else that commented - i will be changing this. She has a UVB panel attached to the top that is on all day and not very bright so I think that's better for her and will get the temp to a slightly higher level (which i was able to maintain today with the help of my partner).

I soak her much more often during the warmer months here in austin, about three times per week. in the winter time, i do tend to get out of my routine but i try to soak her once a week. since she started wheezing i've been giving her a warm bath every day for about 15 min. she's already wheezing significantly less - my goal is to just get us over this cold front.

i don't know her exact age, i have had her for three years and she's huge. she's about 7-8inches long and growing every year. she used to be my old co-workers but was in horrible conditions. i don't know how long they had her, maybe two years? but she appeared to be a yearling. wouldn't open her eyes and lived in a cage with a chicken who would poop on her. She's come a long way and so have I in learning how to provide her the best I can!

 

[betweenshells]

I don't understand = "The heat and humidity does stay bc it’s f or that!" Please explain.

How are you heating her enclosure? As The_Four_Toed_Edward said above, since she's not as healthy as she could be right now, keeping the heat up (above 85F, 90F would be good), until she's over the wheezing is very important. It is even more so with the Polar Express that's hitting for the next several days.

Each species has different requirements. Its important to keep your tortoise within the parameters for that particular type of tortoise. If one evolved in a jungle it needs to be kept with entirely different conditions than a desert species. While they are fairly resilient, there is only so much accommodation they can make for human whims. Its up to us to do what they need.

With the substrate explained earlier you only need to change it once a year or less. Actually, most substrate systems don't need changed very often. Its not like a hamster cage or a horse stall. As long as the discarded food and poop are cleaned out daily (so that they don't foul it or cause mold/mildew), a system of substrate is fine for months.

When I mentioned her breathing might be affected by dust, its because of how dry that top layer appears in the pic of Rojita. Her face is only a couple inches above it, and it doesn't take that much to stir it up.

Please share pics of her enclosure.
Let's see how we can help get it Red Foot friendlier.

And how old is she?
That is an important factor in keeping, too.

How often are you soaking her? Frequency is another age-related thing... every other day or even just a few times per week is fine for an adult, but for one that is fairly young, its better to soak them everyday Warming her up in a half-hour soak will help her get over the wheezing.

.

oh also i meant the PVC does a good job at keeping the humidity and heat in thankfully.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

This is all really helpful advice honestly! My goal is to eventually get her a much bigger indoor enclosure but for now she's in a PVC enclosure. I usually which out the bulb every morning and night, just have one lamp. i'm getting a radiant heat panel tomorrow, she has a uvb panel on top too that doesn't produce heat. it's good to know the spraying isn't helpful and i will switch that up, her wheezing has greatly improved in just the last 24hrs. i've taken others advice of keeping the heat up and not letting it drop below 84. She's still very active and ate her greens and papaya today.

i definitely have to upgrade the temperature gauges! if you know a better way or more accurate way to know temp i'd love any advice on that too. I will be reading the links above tomorrow thank you so so much for all this! thankfully, she is outdoors for most of the year and she's so much happier and healthier out there.

Im glad she’s improving and so happy you’ve made your way here for some pointers

I’d suggest some digital monitoring that measures both the temperature and humidity, you can get them relatively cheap in hardware stores, or there’s lots of options online, feel free to look around and ask for suggestions

Heat guns are also a good buy to run back up checks!

 

[betweenshells]

Today she still has some slight wheezing but still no lethargy, mucus or loss of appetite. Gave her greens and she’s currently munching on half a boiled egg as suggested.

Sharing a pic of her indoor enclosure. I appreciate any tips and suggestions to make this a better spot for her. She’s only in here 3 months or so out of the year. Ideally I’d have a 8x2x2 or bigger in a garage but I have limited space and her outside area is much bigger since I have a shared yard. Once I get the heat panel today, I’ll only leave her ceramic heater on 24/7. Going to petsmart in a couple hrs.

 

[COmtnLady]

Tortoises need to get their heat from above, so have your mat on a wall or the ceiling of her space.

You really should keep her in the enclosed space except for short daily visits outside in good weather, due to the humidity concerns. I don't know Austin's ambient humidity, but am fairly sure it isn't at least 80% all the time she is out there - which is bad for her. She's already pyramiding and lower humidity will make it worse. (Think similar to human's rickets. Poor bone formation that can't be fixed once established.) If you were down near Corpus Christie or Brownsville you might be able to pull off her being predominantly outdoors, maybe. Most of the members who keep Red foots outside are in Florida, Georgia, and the Carolinas, very wet places with high humidity.

Red Foot are a jungle species, not a species that does well in much dryer Texas, so we humans have to figure out ways to compensate for that. Could you construct a humid hide and humid night box for her? That would help some.


.

 

[betweenshells]

Tortoises need to get their heat from above, so have your mat on a wall or the ceiling of her space.

You really should keep her in the enclosed space except for short daily visits outside in good weather, due to the humidity concerns. I don't know Austin's ambient humidity, but am fairly sure it isn't at least 80% all the time she is out there - which is bad for her. She's already pyramiding and lower humidity will make it worse. (Think similar to human's rickets. Poor bone formation that can't be fixed once established.) If you were down near Corpus Christie or Brownsville you might be able to pull off her being predominantly outdoors, maybe. Most of the members who keep Red foots outside are in Florida, Georgia, and the Carolinas, very wet places with high humidity.

Red Foot are a jungle species, not a species that does well in much dryer Texas, so we humans have to figure out ways to compensate for that. Could you construct a humid hide and humid night box for her? That would help some.


.

She had pyramiding when I first got her, it hasn’t gotten any worse in the years I’ve had her! Building a humid hide outside would be perfect. Do you know if there’s any threads on how to do that?

 

[The_Four_Toed_Edward]

Do you know if there’s any threads on how to do that?

Greenhouses is one option, but you have to make sure that it won't get too hot.

This is one option, but the pot has to be big enough, since terracotta is abraisive:

How to Make a Clay Pot Hide

The goal of a terra cotta pot hide is to create a humid hide without spraying the substrate. A standard plastic dish washing tub works great for most species, but for species that cannot handle damp substrate (Egyptians, and maybe Chacos) there is little other choice. With the terra cotta pot...

tortoiseforum.org

Another option is to place water dishes on selves inside a hide box, but this might not raise the humidity high enough.

 

[betweenshells]

Just wanted to update folks that I took Rojita to the vet today and got her antibiotics i'll have to inject every three days for the next three weeks. the vet said that she otherwise seems very healthy, her shell is in good health. She seemed better over the last few days but since she was still slightly wheezing I wanted to double check with the vet.

 

[Littleredfootbigredheart]

Just wanted to update folks that I took Rojita to the vet today and got her antibiotics i'll have to inject every three days for the next three weeks. the vet said that she otherwise seems very healthy, her shell is in good health. She seemed better over the last few days but since she was still slightly wheezing I wanted to double check with the vet.

That’s good to hear, what antibiotics did they prescribe do you know?