Substrate contradiction

[Mitch_spartan]

Hi all
Had Joe the horsefield tortoise for 3 months and he was about 2-3 mo the old when we got him.
We filled the table up with the compacted pellets at first but after 4 weeks I scooped it all out and filled it with topsoil and little bit of play sand mixed in.
I was told at the time that coco coir isn't advisable as they can eat it and be ill but last night on here was told coco coir in the sleeping area is good.

I was also told the pellets aren't good either

Also I'm going to scoop remaining pellets out and fill the whole thing with top soil.
Now I'm debating sand mixed in as this forum said that sand isn't good as it's too dusty.

Please advise as too much contradicting advice.

Thanks

 

[JHat]

In my experience everyone has an opinion about substrates. A lot of it is for health reasons, some of it is per species and some of it is just preference. So you're going to get a lot of contradictions from one website to the other.

 

[ZEROPILOT]

Here the general advice would be to avoid sand altogether. There are too many better choices out there.
I use orchid bark and garden soil/compost for babies.

 

[JoesMum]

On this forum

Pellets - never recommended. Too dry.

Sand - not recommended. Sand sticks to food, gets ingested and impacts in the gut

Sand mix - generally not recommended either as there's still sand involved

Other substrate recommendations vary with personal preference. They do stick to food with varying degrees but don't cause the impaction problems of sand.

Orchid bark and coco coir are popular with many members as both hold moisture well. Others use topsoil, peat, compost, cypress mulch...

It's what works for you in your climate to get the humidity right

 

[Pearly]

Hi Mitch and welcome from central Texas. I keep the Redfooted and still remember the beginnings when bombarded with contradicting info was frckng me out about doing something that may harm my babies. On this forum most of us prefer coco coir and orchid bark. Some of us (myself included) keep bioactive substrate. I still keep my babies in terrarium (40 gal breeder tank) and in part followed terrarium substrate principles (IN PART ONLY): have layer of activated charcoal on the bottom, then about 1.5-2 inch layer of Reptibark, then nice thick layer of coco coir with some good organic soil , this layer also contains roots of the plants and all the undergrownd critters (earthworms), the top is mostly covered with plants, sheet moss, some flat rocks, and that's where the other critters live, tiny soil centipedes and pillbugs. It's busy in there! I think choice of substrate has to do with personal choice as well as at least attempt to mimic the natural environment of the species. You'll get it to where it works for you anf your pet. I happen to like mine because I don't have to change it and it has no odor, I have to say that this forum gets most credit for what I know today and how I care for my grandtorts (the babies belong to my 11 yr old daughter) so stick around, and you'll figure out your own best practices, plus make some new friends in the process

 

[Mitch_spartan]

Just come to pet store and buying these.
I know hygrometer may not be ideal but at least will have better idea

 

[Yvonne G]

Hi Mitch:

You have to first figure out what your tortoise needs, then try to provide that the best you can. For my tortoises' needs I've found that the small grade orchid bark works well. Other options would be coco coir, a mixture of coco coir and clean soil, cypress mulch - there are many substrates out there. Substrate is a personal choice, depending upon what kind of environment your tortoise needs to be healthy and active.

 

[Pearly]

I have couple of these, one digital with probe stuck inside of the hide, and 2 digital thermo/hygrometers all in different areas of the tank. Youcan get those digital ones at Walmart of Home Depot for 8-9 bucks. The only bad thing is they are kinda awkward to set in place and my babies tend to knock them over all the time

 

[Tom]

Hi Mitch. Your dilemma of who to listen to is a common one. You have my sympathy. There is a lot of old outdated info floating around out there. Incorrect info that has been passed from one generation to another repeatedly. Some people have figured out better ways and some people keep doing it the old way.

Sounds like you've gotten some bad advice unfortunately. Any dry substrate is not good for any species. Sand in any amount is an impaction risk and possible skin and eye irritant. Pet stores are usually bad sources of info and full of misinformation. You can find better products for tortoises at cheaper prices in your local hardware store.

Please give these a read through:
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/beginner-mistakes.45180/
http://www.tortoiseforum.org/threads/russian-tortoise-care-sheet.80698/

 

[Mitch_spartan]

Thanks for the replies.
I have read all those care sheets. After buying the orchid bark and coco fibre brick what shall I do?
Should I put the coco fibre in his sleep area on its own or mix it in and sane with the bark? Mix it in with the top soil? I've lowered the light to try and get those extra few degrees so it's around 30cm from surface now.
Where is best place for the hygrometer?

 

[Mitch_spartan]

Oh and I think as it's not as warm as it should be Joe has put himself into hibernation.
Only thing that explains his behaviour

 

[JoesMum]

Oh and I think as it's not as warm as it should be Joe has put himself into hibernation.
Only thing that explains his behaviour

Inactivity is not hibernation. It is not dangerous for the species that can hibernate like Horsfields.

Hibernation occurs when temperatures are consistently below 50F/10C.

Inactivity occurs when a tort cannot warm its core temperature up properly when basking. It's dangerous for a tort because it is unable to be active and eat and it cannot digest what little it does eat.

It is important to have an accurate digital thermometer - temperature gun type is inexpensive from Amazon - so you are certain of the temperature directly under the basking lamp.

 

[Mitch_spartan]

I've just ordered a temp gun from Amazon. Should be here Saturday. Can use it to check my frying range at work too then.
What about the orchid bark and coco fibre brick?

 

[JoesMum]

Whichever substrate you use (just not pellets or sand) doesn't hugely matter.

Put it in and then dump a jug of water in and mix it with your hands so it's damp, not wet. This will help raise the humidity. Just how frequently you do this and how frequently you need to spray depends on the climate where you live.

 

[Mitch_spartan]

So took Joe out into a bath and changed his table. He now has a mix of top soil, orchid bark and coco fibre all through the table.

 

[Mitch_spartan]

He is wondering about now as I write this which is more than he has done in 6 days. Still not eaten but hopefully will work. Should I spray the whole substrate with water every fewdays to keep it moist? It's in green area on hygrometer at the mo