Do you need Substrate?

[PSLIMO]

Hi All,

I've googled this one for a while now and can't find an answer.

I just emptied and moved my 4'x6' tortoise table to it's own room and realize how easy it is to maintain the cleanliness of the main area without substrate. It's heated hide is 2'x2' and has a few inches of very easy to keep moist coco coir. No problems with humidity or temperature levels.

The rest of the table has a heat lamp by the water source and a UV bulb for basking. Is there a reason or benefit to having substrate in the rest of the table?

It's so much easier to vacuum extra food up and just wipe things down. Also there's no more coco coir being dragged into the water dish daily.

Phil

 

[Blackdog1714]

Imagine moving from your home or apartment to a Quonset hut on a concrete slab. While some like myself would welcome the minimalism others would be dismayed. So no snuggling into your bed to get a nice nights sleep, nothing to fill your days or explore, or the occansional plant to munch on. The substrate also holds the mositure for humidity levels and distributes the heats- ie basking spot. While easier it would no better. I understand cause my Russian loves to drag his subtrate through everything, but I still love him or her!

 

[PSLIMO]

Thanks for the response.

However, he has a very comfortable hide as far as tortoises go. No problems with heat or humidity. I guess I should have mentioned he's not a baby, he's 3 1/2 and weighs about 6 pounds.

Here's a picture of his table with and without the hide cover opened so you can get a better idea of where the substrate is and where I want to keep it to a minimum if at all.

Thanks in advance,

Phil

 

[TechnoCheese]

You definitely need substrate. Along with needing the option to burrow into their own microclimate, it is terrible for a tortoise’s joints and muscles to walk on flat, hard floors. In addition, they need hills to exercise and can’t just walk on a flat plain. Add 3-6 inches of fine grade orchid bark, coco coir, or cypress mulch.

 

[jsheffield]

I'm still a newbie, but agree that your enclosure should have substrate ... if the coco coir is too difficult to keep up with in terms of mess, perhaps orchid bark or cypress mulch would be easier.

Jamie

 

[PSLIMO]

Thanks for the responses.

"it is terrible for a tortoise’s joints and muscles to walk on flat, hard floors."

That's what I wondering, is there a reason or benefit to having substrate in the rest of the table? No problem adding substrate, always had it in the past and now I see the benefits for him.

As far as exercise. I guess I could straighten out that bamboo cave into a small hill to walk over. He doesn't hide under it and prefers to hang under the ferns in the corners. I also thought about putting a fenced ramp to the top of the hide and fencing it off too but it's only a 2'x2' area. That doesn't leave too much room to move around.

It won't be long before he out grows this table and I'll be making another one.

 

[TechnoCheese]

Thanks for the responses.

"it is terrible for a tortoise’s joints and muscles to walk on flat, hard floors."

That's what I wondering, is there a reason or benefit to having substrate in the rest of the table? No problem adding substrate, always had it in the past and now I see the benefits for him.

As far as exercise. I guess I could straighten out that bamboo cave into a small hill to walk over. He doesn't hide under it and prefers to hang under the ferns in the corners. I also thought about putting a fenced ramp to the top of the hide and fencing it off too but it's only a 2'x2' area. That doesn't leave too much room to move around.

It won't be long before he out grows this table and I'll be making another one.

One hill isn’t going to do it. You need an uneven substrate layer.

 

[wccmog10]

I have heard of tortoises ruining their hip and knee joints when kept without substrate. I think the theory behind it was that it happened as they would try to push up the walls of the enclosure. You know how tortoises will go into the corner and sort of climb up the wall, well these tortoise were doing that, and then they would slip down (because there was no substrate) and their back legs would get torqued and twisted funny as the back of the shell was coming down and hitting the backs of their legs, causing the joint damage.