Female stuff?

[Nay]

Hi, I have a female leo about 7 yrs. She is by herself, and presently inside(it's winter here in Mass) This AM I find her acting like she wants to lays eggs? I watched her continue to dig in one spot for a long time. I have pool liner lining my pen and she has reached that.
My question. Do I do anything? Having had cockatiels exhaust themselves laying endless amounts of eggs. The trick there was to make them uncomfortable in their enviorment and discourage that.
And I could be totally wrong about what this is, but she certainly is a girl and she looks like the nature programs when the torts come up and lay eggs!!
All thoughts and comments welcome!
Na

 

[egyptiandan]

Hi Na,
She is definately trying to nest. A female doesn't need to have been with a male to lay eggs, but it helps. Females don't automaticly lay when they become mature. Most females need to have male attention before they will lay eggs.
If she does have eggs, this could just as easily be a phantom (no eggs) nesting. Either way you need to set her up with enough substrate so she can dig a nest. For a Leopard that would be about 12 inches of well packed dirt for her to dig her nest.

Danny

 

[Nay]

Thanks Danny,
I'll add more dirt. She was determined to get to the bottom!
Do torts have egg bound issues? How about calicum depletion? (I do supplement)
Nadine

 

[egyptiandan]

They can have egg binding issues if they hold onto the eggs for to long. Also a females calcium needs are greater when she's laying eggs, so it wouldn't hurt to give her more calcium.

Danny

 

[oswego tort lover]

in this situation i would take her to your vet for an xray to see if she has eggs and a simple one time shot of oxytocin to expell them. its very safe.. .......ed

 

[Nay]

in this situation i would take her to your vet for an xray to see if she has eggs and a simple one time shot of oxytocin to expell them. its very safe.. .......ed

I think I will do that!! Glad I wrote. Thanks I'll let you know!
Na

 

[Nay]

in this situation i would take her to your vet for an xray to see if she has eggs and a simple one time shot of oxytocin to expell them. its very safe.. .......ed

I think I will do that!! Glad I wrote. Thanks I'll let you know!
Na

Hi again, well you guys are spot on. She has 4 eggs inside. There was discussion as to wether she should get an oxytocin shot now or wait to see if she lays them. There also is a bit of a discussion as to the dosage being such a wide range for these guys. I wondered if you can tell by film is these are older eggs or not. I thought I would ask here. My vet is Ok but these kind of exotic questions I think are not in her expertiece so thought I could ask you experts who have had this happen. I thought since she is trying to lay to go ahead with it. But I am not the vet.
Yes give shot and not wait? and a 6 lb leopard oxy dose?
I know your not vets here, I would just like to see if she's close.
No offense intended(to my vet)
thanks Na

 

[Yvonne G]

The only experience I've had with Oxytocin is with the Manouria, and after three injections of Oxytocin and calcium and no eggs, we finally found out that Oxytocin doesn't work on Manouria. I don't know if there are other types of tortoise it doesn't work on or not.

Yvonne

 

[oswego tort lover]

if the eggs are shelled and shes digging yes they are ready to come out. the dosage range is based on weight, your vet can find this info. she may continue to lay one egg at a time with alot., of scratching and climbing to get out. i think it would be fair to say she's in distress. so she's probably not eating as much also. ive used oxy shots with my leopard's for many fall clutchs. i think you will find she'll settle down soon after.. by the way with a correct dose its about 2hrs from shot to the last egg. i would do it asap........ed

 

[Nay]

Once again many thanks. I am the proud parent of 4 infertile eggs!! We gave her some calicium first to 'prime' the uterus and then some oxytocin, the range is from 2 to 20 units per kg. No parameters on what determines use of the low dose vs the high dose. We went alittle more than halfway, knowing she wanted to lay, but still eating. Anyway about 1hr later she went into the barest corner of her pen and layed them. (maybe she knew they weren't really gonna be her kids!!??Who knows.)
OK BIG question(s), can I prevent this? Can I help her somehow to be better prepared next time.? I just wonder also how long is too long to wait till she can lay herself, honestly this was about 6 days from when I first saw her digging as though laying. Did I maybe jump the gun?
I feel so much better that theres no chance of her being egg bound, but how soon can she fill up again? Or if you can direct me to a better site to get these questions answered, I haven't found one.
Thank you all once again!! Na

 

[egyptiandan]

I'm glad she laid the eggs.

No there isn't anything you can do (short of starving her) that will stop her laying eggs. With no access to a male, she might not lay again for years or she might lay in 30 days hard to say whats going to happen.
You'd have to set her up in an enclosure that had a 10 to 12 inch substrate depth to have her lay naturally.
I've had females take 5 weeks to lay a clutch of eggs after I noticed they were gravid and I've had a female die after 2 weeks of not laying.
You can never tell how it's going to go.

Danny

 

[Nay]

Anyone have a male out there?.....

 

[terrypin]

hi there is every chance she may have eggs develop again so now is a good time to prepare for them ,i understand how difficult it is to heat outside areas enough at this time of year. i have used a greenhouse with heat lamps before when the weather was milder but as yourself i just had one of my girls gravid last week.but i was prepared what i have done is built a seperate nesting area that is 6'x3' with a substrate depth of 16''.i have a 250watt heat lamp suspended over one end of the pen and a bowl of water at the other.this has worked well and this year it has seen 5 clutches laid with no breakages.
terry

 

[Nay]

Hi Terry,
I am not quite sure what you mean by prepare, she is by herself in a 8 x 4 pen. I have 2 lights (1 ceramic heater and one 150 watt bulb) and a uvb at one end and her food and water is away from the lights. There is no way for anyone to be outside, it's single digits this weekend and we have a hard enough time keeping our house warm. I wonder if I can do anything different. But also I am wondering if it might be worth it to get a male?
She is eating great today too!! Very happy to see that,
Thanks Nadine

 

[egyptiandan]

The only thing you can do is build an inside laying box for her. You would need something at least 6' X 3' and at least 24" deep and 30" would be better. That way you can get a 12" to 16" depth of substrate. Set-up a good shop light and a heavy duty large dome lamp to provide a very warm spot that she will probably choose to lay at.
Nothing wrong with getting a male, but wouldn't be much good with the mandatory quarantine period. It would be something that would be for next year.

Danny

 

[terrypin]

hi im sorry if i didnt make myself clear enough but i meant what Danny just wrote.i have my torts in a seperate room and the adult leo's in an insulated heated shed outdoors my nesting box is very basic as you can see in this cctv picture she has started digging .this picture was taken 10.12.08.
terry