Training your tortoises...acceptable or "exploitative"?

[Angi]

As a parent of a 17 year old, you have years of girls you like and girls you don't hanging out with your son.
My oldest son just turned 16 and cars are his big focus and basketball.

 

[Tom]

As a parent of a 17 year old, you have years of girls you like and girls you don't hanging out with your son.
My oldest son just turned 16 and cars are his big focus and basketball.

I had just one focus at 16... and 17 and, well it really hasn't changed.

It wasn't cars or sweaty men playing sports.

I guess everybody is different.

 

[Seiryu]

I had just one focus at 16... and 17 and, well it really hasn't changed.

It wasn't cars or sweaty men playing sports.

I guess everybody is different.

Right, reptiles in mini-skirts!

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

As a parent of a 17 year old, you have years of girls you like and girls you don't hanging out with your son.

Yeah...fun, fun, fun!

My oldest son just turned 16 and cars are his big focus and basketball.

I had just one focus at 16... and 17 and, well it really hasn't changed.

It wasn't cars or sweaty men playing sports.

I guess everybody is different.

Right, reptiles in mini-skirts!

Wonder if I can get a nice one made for Jennifer...

 

[tortoisenerd]

I think conditioning a tort to know food time is completely fine. I do the same by tapping on my tort's slate tile. He looks up at me every time and I think he gets it, even though he doesn't always come running over. I think training animals to the point that places like Sea World do is wrong, as the animals are exploited and have to do the tricks for the food, etc. I think moderation is good for everything. PETA is a bit too extremist for my liking, as much as I believe in animal rights.

 

[moswen]

terry, i'm so sorry that you even had to ask that question, what on earth is she thinking? you're not FORCING your torts to do anything, they simply have learned that that bell means something awesome... food!!! and that makes EVERY animal happy, and not even someone from peta can argue that an animal is happy to have food!!

i love animals and i've thought about looking into peta a couple of times, but i never have, and really, if they believe that every animal should live in it's natural environment... i agree with that to an extent, i mean, you shouldn't bring a tiger into your home, but i honestly see nothing wrong with bringing an animal into your home where there are no daily threats of territory or being eaten from other animals, no daily searches for food, no days where an animal goes hungry, no days where animals DIE OF STARVATION, and the animal is loved and properly cared for... how can you claim to love animals and argue with that!?!?

whatev. you're not doing anything wrong. i so TOTALLY agree with the barbecue idea and your son's friends! that's the most awesome thing i've heard all day!

actually, if you think about it, if there weren't all those nuts out there, we would have a harder time looking "normal"!

---

I don't how many are aware that PETA is listed by the US Justice Department as a terrorist group. Fine bunch to be a member of. I think a tortoise responding to a dinner bell is the same as a wild tortoise responding to a troop of monkeys dropping fruit in the forest.

wow that's the best argument i think i've ever heard! really, who'se got their heads on their shoulders tonight... i'm envious that you came up with that and not me lol!!!!

 

[Stephanie Logan]

Right, reptiles in mini-skirts!

Hahahaha! I'll bet Tom still has the posters on his wall in his basement.

 

[Tom]

Right, reptiles in mini-skirts!

Hahahaha! I'll bet Tom still has the posters on his wall in his basement.

Ha! We don't have basements in CA. The only pic I've managed to save is my Nagel print. My wife promised I could keep it up, so she hid it in our upstairs bathroom.

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

terry, i'm so sorry that you even had to ask that question, what on earth is she thinking? you're not FORCING your torts to do anything, they simply have learned that that bell means something awesome... food!!! and that makes EVERY animal happy, and not even someone from peta can argue that an animal is happy to have food!!

Oh, I'm not upset or anything, just amused...and thought I'd share some amusement w/ my tortoise lovin' peeps!

And I am guilty of enjoying seeing Jennifer, Ptolemy, Orion and Andromeda (the latter two being my daughters Ornate Box Turtles) come a-running to see what dinner will be when I ring the bell.

i love animals and i've thought about looking into peta a couple of times, but i never have, and really, if they believe that every animal should live in it's natural environment... i agree with that to an extent, i mean, you shouldn't bring a tiger into your home, but i honestly see nothing wrong with bringing an animal into your home where there are no daily threats of territory or being eaten from other animals, no daily searches for food, no days where an animal goes hungry, no days where animals DIE OF STARVATION, and the animal is loved and properly cared for... how can you claim to love animals and argue with that!?!?

whatev. you're not doing anything wrong. i so TOTALLY agree with the barbecue idea and your son's friends! that's the most awesome thing i've heard all day!

Yeah, that tickles me a lot, too...enough that we're having my son's "posse" over for the 4th, and there WILL be bar-b-q-in' going on!

My daughter's going to make Miss Peta a salad w/ our home-made dresssing...

actually, if you think about it, if there weren't all those nuts out there, we would have a harder time looking "normal"!

My wife assures me I'm in no danger of ever being accused of "normalicy"...

---

I don't how many are aware that PETA is listed by the US Justice Department as a terrorist group. Fine bunch to be a member of. I think a tortoise responding to a dinner bell is the same as a wild tortoise responding to a troop of monkeys dropping fruit in the forest.

wow that's the best argument i think i've ever heard! really, who'se got their heads on their shoulders tonight... i'm envious that you came up with that and not me lol!!!!

---

LOL...an excellent analogy, at that!

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

The pot-luck Bar-B-Q was a success, on several levels: got a chance to meet some of Son's running buddies (a pretty cool bunch, it turns out, and all were very good about helping clean up our yard afterwards) and a few of their parents (mostly decent folks, except for one obnoxious drunk), ate some great food and enjoyed the fireworks (living on top of the tallest hill for miles around, we had a great view of several nearby small towns' displays, as well as a few rather inpressive "amateur" shows, but the best show, by far, was The Girlfriend's tantrums at all of us omnivores.

Son's best friend, C-Dawg (Clarence to his parents) got in the best zinger: when The Girlfriend told us how sickening it was to watch us eat "dead flesh". he thoughtfully pointed out that, otoh, eating animals alive was messier, considerably less humane and really made a lot of racket!

When she demanded that Son take her elsewhere, he told he certainly could, just as soon as he finished eating...and that he was enjoying all the tasty offerings!

However, the best part was when, after finishing up her salad, my daughter explained that her home-made salad dressing, made from the traditional Cherokee recipe, had a base made from deer blood and very-finely chopped sweetmeats...

The Girlfriend wasn't too thrilled by that news...

Hope all of y'all had a good 4th...

 

[DeanS]

Maybe next fourth, the girlfriend can be grilled

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

Maybe next fourth, the girlfriend can be grilled

Probably not...

There was another sweet young thing, knowledgable about torts and things, at the soirre, and she was making eyes at my son...intend to invite her over often and see what happens...

 

[DeanS]

Maybe next fourth, the girlfriend can be grilled

Probably not...

There was another sweet young thing, knowledgable about torts and things, at the soirre, and she was making eyes at my son...intend to invite her over often and see what happens...

HEY! That's even better!

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

Maybe next fourth, the girlfriend can be grilled

Probably not...

There was another sweet young thing, knowledgable about torts and things, at the soirre, and she was making eyes at my son...intend to invite her over often and see what happens...

HEY! That's even better!

Maybe...DEFINITELY not worse!...wonder if I can reserve a Cupid suit at the costume rental...

 

[Jacqui]

However, the best part was when, after finishing up her salad, my daughter explained that her home-made salad dressing, made from the traditional Cherokee recipe, had a base made from deer blood and very-finely chopped sweetmeats...

The Girlfriend wasn't too thrilled by that news...

First off, don't get me wrong I am in no way a fan of PETA and I myself don't approve of the gf's behavior, but what you guys did with giving her the dressing knowing her thoughts on eating meat was a bit on the cruel side. She is young and very strong in her opinions and hasn't learned to show proper vocal control when invited into somebody's home. However you showed a bit of immaturity yourself on allowing this little "get even" behavior with the salad dressing and your daughter.


...and btw, let's get back onto the topic of training your tortoises.

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

However, the best part was when, after finishing up her salad, my daughter explained that her home-made salad dressing, made from the traditional Cherokee recipe, had a base made from deer blood and very-finely chopped sweetmeats...

The Girlfriend wasn't too thrilled by that news...

First off, don't get me wrong I am in no way a fan of PETA and I myself don't approve of the gf's behavior, but what you guys did with giving her the dressing knowing her thoughts on eating meat was a bit on the cruel side. She is young and very strong in her opinions and hasn't learned to show proper vocal control when invited into somebody's home. However you showed a bit of immaturity yourself on allowing this little "get even" behavior with the salad dressing and your daughter.


...and btw, let's get back onto the topic of training your tortoises.

She was told, by me, prior to eating it, what was in the dressing, but chose to believe she was being lied to, until she found out she had not been...therefore, I don't feel my daughter (or anyone else, other than her) was at fault.

The great American writer/humorist, Mark Twain, once said, "You can tell a man not to carry a cat by it's tail, but actually attempting such a feat teaches why".

And if she hasn't learned enough manners to go out in public by the age of 18, when will she learn them?

'Nough said...back to the subject of training torts, as per your wish!

 

[Jacqui]

She was told, by me, prior to eating it, what was in the dressing, but chose to believe she was being lied to, until she found out she had not been...therefore, I don't feel my daughter (or anyone else, other than her) was at fault.

And if she hasn't learned enough manners to go out in public by the age of 18, when will she learn them?

You never said anywhere, that she had been told before she ate any.

Some folks take longer and some never do learn public manners. Seem fewer and fewer learn manners every day, but that's another topic for another debate thread.

 

[Terry Allan Hall]

She was told, by me, prior to eating it, what was in the dressing, but chose to believe she was being lied to, until she found out she had not been...therefore, I don't feel my daughter (or anyone else, other than her) was at fault.

And if she hasn't learned enough manners to go out in public by the age of 18, when will she learn them?

You never said anywhere, that she had been told before she ate any.

This is true, so I can see how that lack of pertinent info could alter the overall view...

I'd guess you've been around teenagers, so know they're an entirely different life-form!

Some folks take longer and some never do learn public manners. Seem fewer and fewer learn manners every day, but that's another topic for another debate thread.

Sadly, you are right...our children, in very real ways, are often a reflection on our parenting skills (or lack, thereof).

 

[Kristina]

PETA.

People Eating Tasty Animals.

 

[jackrat]

Now to get back on topic.When I trained my redfoots to tap dance and spin plates on sticks,I used a combination of sensory deprivation and fasting.I don't see anything unethical about it.