Coconut Oil

jsheffield

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I'm interested in this topic and tried to find a link in this voluminous thread to information about UV uptake in skin versus carapace, but was unable to find it ... can someone provide a link to information about this?

Jamie
 

Markw84

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Previtamin D3 is only synthesized in the skin. Good blood flow is needed, and a relatively thin layer of lighter colored skin is better. Even the scales on the front of a tortoise's legs will prevent any D3 synthesis as the UVB cannot penetrate. The shell has no way for this to occur. When tortoises bask, they stretch out their necks, expose the backs of their legs and upper legs to get as much of that thinner, lighter skin exposed. The shell is actually quite good at absorbing heat and their main method of thermoregulation is the absorption through the shell. But no UVB absorption there.

Perhaps a browse through this exhaustive info would be of interest to you...

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/skintests.htm
 

jsheffield

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Previtamin D3 is only synthesized in the skin. Good blood flow is needed, and a relatively thin layer of lighter colored skin is better. Even the scales on the front of a tortoise's legs will prevent any D3 synthesis as the UVB cannot penetrate. The shell has no way for this to occur. When tortoises bask, the stretch out their necks, expose the backs of their legs and upper legs to get as much of that thinner, lighter skin exposed. The shell is actually quite good at absorbing heat and their main method of thermoregulation is the absorption through the shell. But no UVB absorption there.

Perhaps a browse through this exhaustive info would be of interest to you...

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/skintests.htm

Thanks!

Jamie
 

Cathie G

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Previtamin D3 is only synthesized in the skin. Good blood flow is needed, and a relatively thin layer of lighter colored skin is better. Even the scales on the front of a tortoise's legs will prevent any D3 synthesis as the UVB cannot penetrate. The shell has no way for this to occur. When tortoises bask, they stretch out their necks, expose the backs of their legs and upper legs to get as much of that thinner, lighter skin exposed. The shell is actually quite good at absorbing heat and their main method of thermoregulation is the absorption through the shell. But no UVB absorption there.

Perhaps a browse through this exhaustive info would be of interest to you...

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/skintests.htm
Oh me oh my. That's too interesting. Is tanning a protective response to the sun. Even though everything needs some...
 

Ray--Opo

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Previtamin D3 is only synthesized in the skin. Good blood flow is needed, and a relatively thin layer of lighter colored skin is better. Even the scales on the front of a tortoise's legs will prevent any D3 synthesis as the UVB cannot penetrate. The shell has no way for this to occur. When tortoises bask, they stretch out their necks, expose the backs of their legs and upper legs to get as much of that thinner, lighter skin exposed. The shell is actually quite good at absorbing heat and their main method of thermoregulation is the absorption through the shell. But no UVB absorption there.

Perhaps a browse through this exhaustive info would be of interest to you...

http://www.uvguide.co.uk/skintests.htm
Thanks for that info
Learned something new or maybe I learned it before and forgot. Anyways great info
 

Markw84

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Oh me oh my. That's too interesting. Is tanning a protective response to the sun. Even though everything needs some...

Yes. Tanning is your skin producing melanin to darken it and protect it from the excessive bioactive uv exposure. The darker tanned skin lets less uv through protecting the skin. As you tan you are protected more from sunburn for example.
 

Cathie G

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Yes. Tanning is your skin producing melanin to darken it and protect it from the excessive bioactive uv exposure. The darker tanned skin lets less uv through protecting the skin. As you tan you are protected more from sunburn for example.
What really makes this even more interesting to me is that I have "tanned leather". I did it the old fashioned way using soap, neatsfoot oil, water and bark. It's kind of the same concept because it's skin. The bark IS what makes the cell membrane impervious to water. I'm probably sounding half coocoo but I believe the 2 concepts are related somehow. The tanning leather episode in my life was a homeschool science project for my 2 teenage boys. They loved it almost as much as me. How this would relate to a tortoise I've yet to see. Thanks for answering.
 

glitch4200

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Hehe [emoji12]. Long time no see tortoise forum... I have been evolving in the shadows.

Started my own research and development company..

Writing literature for publication to scholarly journals.

School.

Being a father to my son who is now a wonderful crazy toddler...

More research... building my website. You know... adulting hard and with passion.

Bills gotta get paid. [emoji12]

But in my long absence.


With all my crAziness, I have kept up my coconut oil research and have expanded it around the world. I was and for most part still am, really active in Facebook groups for awhile promoting coconut oil and its use with appropriate tortoise care. I can say with decent certainty that close to 6 different species of tortoise now have coconut applied ritually to the shell under a multitude of parameters, from around the world.

I get messages all the time from people in different countries, asking about how to use it. And I explain it.

Each geo-climate, habitat set up, and lighting scheme in indoor habitats; all seem to have a beneficial postulate for coconut oil to be used.

I am short on time currently but I have literally 5 pages of updates to explain on here about what I have found thus far with coconut oil use and my tortoises.

I am here to show updates photos.

I will be back soonish to type all my findings thus far.

Lots of theory and hypotheticals to go over..

I want you to know that with all of the earlier applications I did I decided a long period of non application was necessary to see the effects of the unfiltered infrared on newly expressed alpha keratin after a major growth cycle. Basically I wanted to see what happens to fresh alpha keratin after a growth cycle under the lamps.

I proposed that I would see epigentic reaction in the core box in the beta keratin in the form of uneven beta to alpha proliferation ratios. But only those areas that experienced hot spotting. Hot spotting is when a piece of keratin heats up super fast compared to the surrounding tissue.

I wanted to see the mechanisms involved in coconut oil and how it worked. But in order to do that. I needed a tortoise who grew hyper cycled alpha keratin during a specific growth phases between young juvenile and young adult. Unknowingly to my pleasure, napebbles was young juvenile when I got her and grew massively. This allowed coconut oil to help promote alpha ratios. By lowering the pH in the microbiological environment where the keratin proliferates. Since coconut oil decomposes and not absorbs into the shell, the decomposing oil exerts biochemical reactionaries to the keratin over time based on its decomposition stage. This is a push/pull effect. I’ll explain at a later time. But I def have teased out some interesting mechanisms.

Re-cap from previous post. Over application will cause too much build up of organic acids like Lauric acid. Which can be detrimental to the growth ratios and actually suppress proliferation. I noted this in one of my last updates way back when. This is why it’s mandatory to scrub once a week if you apply the oil regularly. The oil gets cleaned off at that point thus keeping an equalized environment for proliferation and protein folding. Nibbles was in an slow growth cycle because he’s an adult. He’s not getting any bigger. When I applied back in the day 4x a week. Their was a negative reaction to the keratin and it suppressed and actually dissolved new growth. I had to stop applications for 6 months at that point in order to see if growth returned. It returned and without problems. He’s getting applications again currently. Both tortoises are.



Here are both nibbles my male Russian. And napebbles my female Russian.


Napebbles.
IMG_2271.jpg
IMG_2083.jpg
IMG_2059.jpg IMG_1716.jpg IMG_1742.jpg

Nibbles
IMG_2284.jpg
IMG_2277.jpg IMG_1634.jpg IMG_1628.jpg
IMG_2283.jpg

i will be back with updates on literature soon.


Cheers Tortoise Forum
 

Cathie G

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Hehe [emoji12]. Long time no see tortoise forum... I have been evolving in the shadows.

Started my own research and development company..

Writing literature for publication to scholarly journals.

School.

Being a father to my son who is now a wonderful crazy toddler...

More research... building my website. You know... adulting hard and with passion.

Bills gotta get paid. [emoji12]

But in my long absence.


With all my crAziness, I have kept up my coconut oil research and have expanded it around the world. I was and for most part still am, really active in Facebook groups for awhile promoting coconut oil and its use with appropriate tortoise care. I can say with decent certainty that close to 6 different species of tortoise now have coconut applied ritually to the shell under a multitude of parameters, from around the world.

I get messages all the time from people in different countries, asking about how to use it. And I explain it.

Each geo-climate, habitat set up, and lighting scheme in indoor habitats; all seem to have a beneficial postulate for coconut oil to be used.

I am short on time currently but I have literally 5 pages of updates to explain on here about what I have found thus far with coconut oil use and my tortoises.

I am here to show updates photos.

I will be back soonish to type all my findings thus far.

Lots of theory and hypotheticals to go over..

I want you to know that with all of the earlier applications I did I decided a long period of non application was necessary to see the effects of the unfiltered infrared on newly expressed alpha keratin after a major growth cycle. Basically I wanted to see what happens to fresh alpha keratin after a growth cycle under the lamps.

I proposed that I would see epigentic reaction in the core box in the beta keratin in the form of uneven beta to alpha proliferation ratios. But only those areas that experienced hot spotting. Hot spotting is when a piece of keratin heats up super fast compared to the surrounding tissue.

I wanted to see the mechanisms involved in coconut oil and how it worked. But in order to do that. I needed a tortoise who grew hyper cycled alpha keratin during a specific growth phases between young juvenile and young adult. Unknowingly to my pleasure, napebbles was young juvenile when I got her and grew massively. This allowed coconut oil to help promote alpha ratios. By lowering the pH in the microbiological environment where the keratin proliferates. Since coconut oil decomposes and not absorbs into the shell, the decomposing oil exerts biochemical reactionaries to the keratin over time based on its decomposition stage. This is a push/pull effect. I’ll explain at a later time. But I def have teased out some interesting mechanisms.

Re-cap from previous post. Over application will cause too much build up of organic acids like Lauric acid. Which can be detrimental to the growth ratios and actually suppress proliferation. I noted this in one of my last updates way back when. This is why it’s mandatory to scrub once a week if you apply the oil regularly. The oil gets cleaned off at that point thus keeping an equalized environment for proliferation and protein folding. Nibbles was in an slow growth cycle because he’s an adult. He’s not getting any bigger. When I applied back in the day 4x a week. Their was a negative reaction to the keratin and it suppressed and actually dissolved new growth. I had to stop applications for 6 months at that point in order to see if growth returned. It returned and without problems. He’s getting applications again currently. Both tortoises are.



Here are both nibbles my male Russian. And napebbles my female Russian.


Napebbles.
View attachment 270677
View attachment 270678
View attachment 270679 View attachment 270680 View attachment 270681

Nibbles
View attachment 270682
View attachment 270683 View attachment 270684 View attachment 270685
View attachment 270686

i will be back with updates on literature soon.


Cheers Tortoise Forum
That was nice. I kind of noticed something like that too with my Russian with coconut oil. Just a tiny bit keeps working for months even when you buff it all off. But it still helps 2 or 3 times a year. Maybe it imparts some oil he's missing in his diet. I'll be looking forward to when you post.
 

Ray--Opo

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Joined
Oct 14, 2017
Messages
5,135
Location (City and/or State)
Palm Bay Fl
Hehe [emoji12]. Long time no see tortoise forum... I have been evolving in the shadows.

Started my own research and development company..

Writing literature for publication to scholarly journals.

School.

Being a father to my son who is now a wonderful crazy toddler...

More research... building my website. You know... adulting hard and with passion.

Bills gotta get paid. [emoji12]

But in my long absence.


With all my crAziness, I have kept up my coconut oil research and have expanded it around the world. I was and for most part still am, really active in Facebook groups for awhile promoting coconut oil and its use with appropriate tortoise care. I can say with decent certainty that close to 6 different species of tortoise now have coconut applied ritually to the shell under a multitude of parameters, from around the world.

I get messages all the time from people in different countries, asking about how to use it. And I explain it.

Each geo-climate, habitat set up, and lighting scheme in indoor habitats; all seem to have a beneficial postulate for coconut oil to be used.

I am short on time currently but I have literally 5 pages of updates to explain on here about what I have found thus far with coconut oil use and my tortoises.

I am here to show updates photos.

I will be back soonish to type all my findings thus far.

Lots of theory and hypotheticals to go over..

I want you to know that with all of the earlier applications I did I decided a long period of non application was necessary to see the effects of the unfiltered infrared on newly expressed alpha keratin after a major growth cycle. Basically I wanted to see what happens to fresh alpha keratin after a growth cycle under the lamps.

I proposed that I would see epigentic reaction in the core box in the beta keratin in the form of uneven beta to alpha proliferation ratios. But only those areas that experienced hot spotting. Hot spotting is when a piece of keratin heats up super fast compared to the surrounding tissue.

I wanted to see the mechanisms involved in coconut oil and how it worked. But in order to do that. I needed a tortoise who grew hyper cycled alpha keratin during a specific growth phases between young juvenile and young adult. Unknowingly to my pleasure, napebbles was young juvenile when I got her and grew massively. This allowed coconut oil to help promote alpha ratios. By lowering the pH in the microbiological environment where the keratin proliferates. Since coconut oil decomposes and not absorbs into the shell, the decomposing oil exerts biochemical reactionaries to the keratin over time based on its decomposition stage. This is a push/pull effect. I’ll explain at a later time. But I def have teased out some interesting mechanisms.

Re-cap from previous post. Over application will cause too much build up of organic acids like Lauric acid. Which can be detrimental to the growth ratios and actually suppress proliferation. I noted this in one of my last updates way back when. This is why it’s mandatory to scrub once a week if you apply the oil regularly. The oil gets cleaned off at that point thus keeping an equalized environment for proliferation and protein folding. Nibbles was in an slow growth cycle because he’s an adult. He’s not getting any bigger. When I applied back in the day 4x a week. Their was a negative reaction to the keratin and it suppressed and actually dissolved new growth. I had to stop applications for 6 months at that point in order to see if growth returned. It returned and without problems. He’s getting applications again currently. Both tortoises are.



Here are both nibbles my male Russian. And napebbles my female Russian.


Napebbles.
View attachment 270677
View attachment 270678
View attachment 270679 View attachment 270680 View attachment 270681

Nibbles
View attachment 270682
View attachment 270683 View attachment 270684 View attachment 270685
View attachment 270686

i will be back with updates on literature soon.


Cheers Tortoise Forum
Thanks for that info. I will have to read it 5 times to comprehend half of it.
Great job!
 

bluewolf

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I definitely want to hear more about the effect of direct bright light
on the shell. I was worried about that: I have been pointing the light
not at him but beside him with 6 inches or so between him and the heat source.
I don’t really know what I am doing but it was cold this morning so had to get the temp up. I soak him daily and mist him at night

laura
 

Anyfoot

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Does anyone have a recommendation of how many times to apply a week?
Yep. None. I’ve proved this to myself. With a group of babies you still get a degree of pyramiding. From none to minor pyramiding. I think it’s a combination of hydration and protein
 

Cathie G

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Does anyone have a recommendation of how many times to apply a week?
I can only tell you what I do. I find with my adult 17 year old Russian that once a week would be too much. I only apply it after a rain shower or soak. Then buff it all off. Maybe if you have to use a lot of drying lights or in low humidity they could need more. I just use shell conditioners to hold in some moisture for a while. I'm not an expert though.
 

Anyfoot

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I’ve tried this. Anyone out there. Try this with northern redfoots. You’ll get mixed results. Forget Brazilians. They grow smooth easily. The northern redfoots are a pain to grow smooth. I’m guessing sullies and Indians are the same.
 

Yvonne G

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I’ve tried this. Anyone out there. Try this with northern redfoots. You’ll get mixed results. Forget Brazilians. They grow smooth easily. The northern redfoots are a pain to grow smooth. I’m guessing sullies and Indians are the same.
Craig!!!! Where the heck ya been????
 
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