Coconut Oil
- Thread starter glitch4200
- Start date
It really does look like it's making a difference.
I'm telling you.. This is legit. I wish you could see the difference instead of through pictures. It's insane. And it's been such a short period of time too less then 3 weeks. I started this mid October. I have always tried to keep proper humidity and I was bathing regularly since I got him but I have not seen the intensity of affects of those husbandry techniques as potent as application of EVCO multiple times weekly exp in the duration I have been doing this. Humidity control and frequent bathing weekly along with these applications seem to be really work well together. I'm sure there are skeptics out there that are reading this but personally I am seeing the results and that's all that matters to me. I'm glad others see the results too.. It's there. It really is there.
To give you guys an idea how quick moisture is taken from these lamps being on. I bought and soaked moss last night i turned on his lamps at 8am and by the time I got back from school at 12:15 pretty much all the moss in the enclosure was bone dry... I thought it was suppose to let off moisture gradually. It barely lasted 4 hours. My humidity this morning was at 61 percent and when I got back home it was back down to 30 percent.. and I just poured over a gallon .5 of water to rehydrate the substrate and it the humidity last night was like 95 percent. Those lamps guzzle h2o molecules from everything. And it's like a constant battle at keeping a proper humidity in an open table top. Which many people have here it seems in one fashion or another, so to say one can properly maintain a good humidity in a open table top must have some type of timd misting system spraying every little bit or they are constantly spaying a hefty amount of water multiple times a day at least personally that's the only way I can see it being done correctly and the the spraying is a constant battle per personal experiance... anyone else notice this dehydrating effect?
Is your research just based on MVBs exclusively? Is your set up open topped?
It is very interesting what you're doing, just thinking that different lights and maintained humidity does the same thing essentially?
I know you've mentioned anti fungal and cosmetic benefits etc, but I don't see these as 'saving a tortoise's life'.
Your Russian's colouring definitely look different and I applaud your efforts.
It is very interesting what you're doing, just thinking that different lights and maintained humidity does the same thing essentially?
I know you've mentioned anti fungal and cosmetic benefits etc, but I don't see these as 'saving a tortoise's life'.
Your Russian's colouring definitely look different and I applaud your efforts.
I have a long tube uvb bulb, a MVB 100watt. And a 100watt, incandescent bulb. Hanging directly overhead the enclosure. About 12 inches from top of shell. My enclosure is open table top you can see in pictures above. The left light is MVB, and right light is incandescent. And across the middle light is UVB tube. My observations are a combination of the 3 since I can't differentiate between the drying effects empirically. I would think the bulbs that produce the most intense IR-A rays would absorb the most H2O molecules the fastest. Particularly the MVB... But I'm sure each light has some type of dehydrating affect on the tortoise and surrounding environment.
The anti- properties of this oil could definitely save a life. Your talking about an organic all natural non toxic product with special acids that inhibit very effectively fungal, bacterial, and viral ailments that could be present in an environment. To say it can't be applied medically to help treat certain types of antifungal, bacterial or viral infections doesn't make any sense to me logically. Do you see many cases of fungal or bacterial infection? Probably not. But to know that an all natural product can potentially eliminate the need for pharmaceuticals in particular cases is all I need to know if the need arises.
Would you rather take organically self sufficient medication with no alteration or known side effects or chemically altered medicine that has side effects and is harsh on your body?
From reading a lot about medications they give tortoises on here and other sources it seems there is usually a harsh side effect associated with the medication. Or a downside to dosing them. If you can find the same problems about EVCO, I would love to know and would like to see the research backing that up. Humans have been using EVCO for thousands of years. If it was toxic or had side effects it would most likely be documented somewhere...
My uncle just told me people he knows brush there teeth with this stuff...
While trying to maintain proper heat in an open top enclosure, the same affect of the escaping heat will be noted that is also happening with the moisture that you are trying to maintain. The cause here is not the lights in and of themselves, but the heat generated from these lights. I have no problem maintaining proper heat and humidity levels in my enclosed chambers. They are enclosed. Open top enclosures are just that. Open topped. The heat creates a chimney effect that takes the humidity away with it. This would happen regardless of your heat source if proper temps were maintained. The problem here is you are trying an old school method of keeping and then defending it by an application of oil on your tortoise and suggesting that the problem has been solved, where in reality you are using a bandaid solution to a negative habitat condition you created.
I am not saying the problem has been solved at all. I am saying it can benefit the tortoise when housed in an open table top indoor habitat with the lights we use, to prevent the drying affect I am noting. A huge chunk of people on this forum seem to have open table tops either glass or wood. I hardly call that old school keeping if a majority of people use that method. At which point this only relates the the idea of open table tops.. Of course the moisture escapes with the heat. Heat rises and the absorbed H20 goes with it... Without it being enclosed it equalizes in the atmosphere around the table top. You still are presented with the same problem in an enclosed enclosure if yoy use the lamps to heat and provide uvb that yoy would in an open top. Even if yoy could provide the appropriate humidity in am enclosed enclosure all the time without any issues like you said you do.
It doesn't change the fact that the IR-A rays from the lamps don't have miles of atmospheric water vapor to absorb the h2o required to preventing the unnatural absorption of h2o in an enclosed or open top enclosure.... This simply isn't present in an outdoor natural enclosure where you do have naturall sunlight and huge amounts of vapor to absorb the harmful moisture sucking IR-A rays.. The open table top just provides another obstacle vs the enclosed table top in keeping consistent humidity.. But doesn't change the fact of unnatural water absorption from IR-A rays..
I am only applying this to people who CANNOT provide a NATURAL outdoor enclosure with sunlight and space for whatever reason preventing them for doing so. I would bet the majority of keepers of tortoises who do NOT have an outdoor enclosure when they first adopt, buy or receive a tortoise houses them indoors in some type of enclosure most likely being an open top one since its the most affordable option in many cases for people. I would bet just like myself that ALOT of nice people listened to the pet store and bought a small glass tank, pellet food, and fucked up bulbs and getting EXTREMELY little correct information on husbandry to raise that animal properly. If i was to care for him according to PETCO's standards nibbles would not last past 15 -25 years... if that and he would suffer greatly , and i would have ABSOLUTLY NO IDEA... these pictures i provided show the difference. At only 3 weeks I SEE RESULTS, This is not a solution but merely an additive to an ever expanding idea of correct husbandry techniques according to us humans. Understand we as humans took these creatures out of there natural habitat for whatever reason and are housing them as pets now for whatever reason. Husbandry in my opinoin is an idea of how WE THINK they should be best raised. When we have very little data on these creatures and how they SHOULD ACUTALLY be BEST RAISED. We just go off observation of there natural enviornment and make conclusions based on those observations to best say how they should be raised.... i present merely an idea to add to an ever changing concensus of correct husbandry techniques that we humans are creating to best care for these tortoises... we are not better qualified then evolution and nature to care for these tortoises but to not be open to new ideas of others will only harm our friends in captivity. just an elevated thought... 
check this out, x-rays taken from not too long ago making sure there were no stones.
I was told he looks perfectly healthy according to these.
phebe121
Well-Known Member
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- Sep 4, 2014
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That is really cool to seethat thanks.for sharing id get it printed and fram it on the wall
@glitch4200
The bulk of new folks receive inadequate care information from chain pet stores as you mention. This doesn't mean it is the standard we should hold ourselves to.
Simply stating that lots of people do something doesn't make it the norm or correct.
On a side note, you don't pay for your electric do you?
The bulk of new folks receive inadequate care information from chain pet stores as you mention. This doesn't mean it is the standard we should hold ourselves to.
Simply stating that lots of people do something doesn't make it the norm or correct.
On a side note, you don't pay for your electric do you?
Oh absolutely not, this forum is an example of a proper resource for the care of these tortoises. With a little research it's easy to find. My husbandry is getting to be the best it can be considering my space allowed, and it being indoors. Appropriate husbandry according to this forum is what I am trying to accomplish. Proper diet, lighting, places to hide, security , and preventing illness. What else is there?
My pictures don't lie, you can see the difference in my old pictures and my recent pictures.
If majority of people do do something and agree, as a whole we do tend create a norm to the collective.. of course they are exceptions.. but for the most part if most people do it .. it is considered a norm for most people. I legit took sociology last semester and went over this process lol
I don't pay for electric but I know what it costs. I do what is needed in my home. I am 25 and I help provide to my family. I am pretty fortunate but that doesn't take away the knowledge of knowing what it costs to upkeep a tortoise. I provide all the money needed to care for him in every aspect.
Your post reads as though you've inferred I don't see the anti benefits of EVCO or that I've implies it may have toxic side effects - I'm not sure why you inferred that from my post, as didn't say it couldn't be applied medically to treat infection, fungal or viral; I said, the anti fungal advantages and the cosmetic ones it could provide, to me, seem like a bonus not a necessity for the average tortoise.
Maybe I missed a post or got the wrong end of the stick, (please clarify if I have) but I didn't think we were talking about sick tortoises and treating them. You are talking about medication, and to me that's only required when there's a problem.
My tortoise can only feasibly live outside for 2 months of the year but she's in an enclosed enclosure, and I have no problem maintaining heat and humidity and a temperature gradient, haven't in the past 11 years and don't have problems with the shell drying out.
I'm not in any way disputing the natural wonders of the coconut oil and your experiment is interesting and I hope you get the long term benefits you are seeking, I guess I just don't see the necessity, not daily anyway.
Yes you are correct I interpreted your response incorrectly. The anti- properties of the oil and cosmetic shine are only a bonus to tortoises not needed unless the ailments arise. I have never stated daily application. I stated at max 3 applications in a week for a weathered tortoise and 2x a week regularly at bath time.
It seems impossible given the concept of the way IR-A rays work and there absorption of moisture to tell me in 11 years that those lamps have had no affect on drying your tortoises shell and skin. Even with established humidity and temp control. Those lights are at most 12-14 inches from the top of the shell. To tell me that those IR_A rays are not absorbing UNATURALL AMOUNTS of moisture goes against the collective knowledge of how these rays work. also understanding that these moisture sucking rays are NOT present in the outside natural habitat cuz of miles of water vapor directly leads me to believe that any amount of time under those lights without some type of protection is providing an unnatural environment hence dehydrating the tortoise. Your enclosed enclosure helps to prevent some of the dehydrating affects of the lamps by providing a stable moistured environment vs an unstable moistured enviornment like a open table top. But it still doesn't address the moisture loss by the lamps..
Cool, thanks for that.
Again though, I didn't tell you that the IR-A rays are not absorbing an unnatural amount of moisture, I didn't even hint at disputing that. I don't know enough about it, but I do understand relatively basic physics.
What I'm saying is that, my tortoise's shell is not 'weathered'. It's not as dry as the photos of your 'before application' Russian, if you like, so for me personally I don't see the necessity in using the coconut oil regularly.
Perhaps if my enclosure were open topped and I had 3 or 4 lights in there, I would. As it stands, in my current set up, my tortoise is well hydrated, (a lack of urates also leads me to believe this) with no outward signs of shell or skin dehydration.
11 years and not once did you see dryness? How? What lights are you using? After many months under one 100watt MVB and 100 watt incandescent light. I saw dryness all over and a huge difference in there skin and shell color shape and look compared to now. Pictures shown in this thread show the difference and it's only been like 3 weeks.
If you feel this doesn't benefit your particular circumstances then so be it. You dont need to listen to me or my opinions. I am not here to change the way you personally care for your tortoise . I am looking for new ideas that we as humans have not thought of yet to make our companions thrive to the best to their ability. I am merely presenting my case. I see a problem with indoor set ups enclosed or open table top that allows these lamps to take much needed Moisture away from indoor kept tortoises. For anyone to say that you know how hydrated a tortoise is just guessing based on observation. And is probably inaccurate Many .many years ago we thought animal protein was the proper diet for tortoises. And of course that couldn't be farther from the truth. Maybe we are wrong to think no harm comes from indoor enclosures and the baking affects of these lights.
